Prophesies on the Messiah

[Twiler]

Why do you expect us to believe that the bible is a factual, historical work merely because you assert that it is?

Why should it be given more credence than any other religious text?

 

[Coolhat]

Because it is God inspired.

And who, may I ask, told you that?

 

[Piggy]

Because it is God inspired.

But the Bible does not say this. In fact, it can't, because it is not a single book.

Some parts of the Bible claim to be the Word of God. Others don't.

But in any case, I'm curious, why isn't it ok for, say, Genesis 1 and 2 to be a couple of creation myths by the early Hebrews? If they are, does that change God?

Why do you need to believe that the Bible is the Word of God, that it is all true, all history?

What is it about the writings of the ancient Hebrews, that these writings -- all of them -- must be divinely inspired? If they're not, God doesn't change.

Second question: Since we know there were different versions of these texts in circulation in ancient days, which ones were divinely inspired and which werent? And when we find an error in our translations, does the Word of God change, or was the mistaken translation not the Word of God?

Thanks.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

And? Just because evidence hasn't been found, or has been interpreted wrongly, doesn't mean it isn't true. My faith isn't based on scientific evidence, I don't need that to know that the Bible is true.

With respect, hamelekim, why is 'faith' and 'know' in the same sentence?

Because it is God inspired.

Many religions claim to be. Muhammad claimed that the angel Gabriel personally gave him the knowledge to write the Q'uran. Same thing.

 

[X]

Because it is God inspired.

But, besides that, there is archeological evidence for cities and events in the Bible. The fact that there isn't evidence for everything doesn't mean it is wrong, it just means the evidence hasn't been found yet, if it ever will.

This post was written by God in Winnipeg, Manitoba on Friday, September 5, 2008 at 9:52 am.

It is the true word of God, and God does not lie.

I, God, do hereby disown the Christian Bible as nothing more than a warped collection of cultural myths. Sorry guys. The Sikhs are right.


Was that so hard?
I claim this post is written by myself (God). Therefore, by your logic, since the post claims to have been writtne by God and God cannot lie about such things, this post is 100% factual and accurate.
Look! It even gives a city currently extant and near where the post was written.

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

This post was written by God in Winnipeg, Manitoba on Friday, September 5, 2008 at 9:52 am.

It is the true word of God, and God does not lie.

I, God, do hereby disown the Christian Bible as nothing more than a warped collection of cultural myths. Sorry guys. The Sikhs are right.


Was that so hard?
I claim this post is written by myself (God). Therefore, by your logic, since the post claims to have been writtne by God and God cannot lie about such things, this post is 100% factual and accurate.
Look! It even gives a city currently extant and near where the post was written.

Don't try and use logic on true believers. It only shows you are motivated by Satan!!

 

[Achán hiNidráne]

My faith isn't based on scientific evidence, I don't need that to know that the Bible is true.

Yet, people such as yourself, wave it front of our face and demand that we follow its "teachings"--and I use that word very loosely. I'm sorry, but I need more than your "faith" to base my life around what appears to me to be a book of Bronze Age fairy tales. Even if he did exist, this Yahweh person has some serious explaining to do before I choose to worship him.

For example: How is it all right to murder thousands of men, women, and children of a different faith and keep the virgin girls as your own sexual playthings? (Numbers 31: 1-54)

Our entire historical record is a joke, especially when it comes to ancient history. There is so much information lacking, and so many personal agendas in archeology, that we will never come to the real truth.

Argument from ignorance. Just because there are gaps in our historical record doesn't lend credence to your Bible stories. Show us the evidence-- oh wait, I forgot. Unlike every other discipline that attempts to make statements of fact, you don't need any stinking evidence. It's funny how religion demands, and oftentimes gets, to operate on a set of rules apart from what is testable, reviewable, and observable.

 

[Achán hiNidráne]

But, besides that, there is archeological evidence for cities and events in the Bible.

So, 3000 years from now, when a future civilization uncovers the city of London, that should be taken as evidence that the great heroes of the ancient world like James Bond, Harry Potter, and The Doctor, really existed?

Why not? All of their stories mentioned a London.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

Some great posts by Mark here. I have nothing to add.

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Because it is God inspired.

But, besides that, there is archeological evidence for cities and events in the Bible. The fact that there isn't evidence for everything doesn't mean it is wrong, it just means the evidence hasn't been found yet, if it ever will.

And yet, for all the digging done by Christian Archeologists the great City of Nazareth remains undiscovered except for a few shepherds' huts. No such city is recorded in the records of the time either.

 

[edge]

For the Son of Man is going to come in his Father's glory with his angels, and then he will reward each person according to what he has done. I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom."

You will be judged by the king of kings.
Judgment is exactly what happens upon your death.
May haps that the descriptions documented by many of death experiences are exactly correct.
He is in his kingdom and some won’t experience death.

"Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me; you do not have in mind the things of God, but the things of men."

after this,

22Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him. "Never, Lord!" he said. "This shall never happen to you!"

From that time on Jesus began to explain to his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, chief priests and teachers of the law, and that he must be killed and on the third day be raised to life.

Seems to be right on to me.

Seems to me that for the Covent to take place then there has to be a spiritual and a physical second coming of the lord which is verified by what the medical field has documented and by personal experiences.
The physical second coming is marked by the great threat that is to come to Israel and Jerusalem and I believe that event is eminent and could happen at any time now.

So, 3000 years from now, when a future civilization uncovers the city of London, that should be taken as evidence that the great heroes of the ancient world like James Bond, Harry Potter, and The Doctor, really existed?

Why not? All of their stories mentioned a London.

The context alone tells us they are fiction.
With all the information that is gathered and stored they will if they, “people exist 3000 years from now, second coming or not”, that these are exactly what they are and Christianity will be there too along with the bible, so your point is moot.


Participation and belief/faith is where the best proof is gained.
This is the dilemma, being skeptical denies you the interaction and proof you truly desire.

And yet, for all the digging done by Christian Archeologists the great City of Nazareth remains undiscovered except for a few shepherds' huts. No such city is recorded in the records of the time either.

Nothing new here, this has been said of others also, “cities”, till they where discovered.
Make a list and we will see and check mark them off, as they are discovered in the future.
Or not.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

Get behind me, Satan!

Ooooh! Kinky, kinky. Thought the guy didn't like such things.

The context alone tells us they are fiction.

How so? What context? Harry Potter is set in today's England. How does that context tell us it's fiction, by your standards? You are the ones who believe in talking snakes, gods addressing humans through burning bushes, a man parting seas through the power of his god, said god incarnating on Earth and then going back up to Heaven, and cities being bombed by divine brimstone.

Your double standards are so evident it's embarrassing.

With all the information that is gathered and stored they will if they, “people exist 3000 years from now, second coming or not”, that these are exactly what they are and Christianity will be there too along with the bible, so your point is moot.

...eh?

The physical second coming is marked by the great threat that is to come to Israel and Jerusalem and I believe that event is eminent and could happen at any time now.

Right. Now what about the prophecies that have failed? What about the ones you have to shoehorn?

Jesus was supposed to return before "many of his generation had died". All the people of his generation have been dead for two thousand years, and still no Jesus.
Jesus was supposed to restore Israel. Israel has been restored, and still no Jesus.

Nothing new here, this has been said of others also, “cities”, till they where discovered.

Do you believe in Atlantis, Hogwarts and Hogsmeade, then?

 

[edge]

Jesus was supposed to return before "many of his generation had died". All the people of his generation have been dead for two thousand years, and still no Jesus.

You are skeptical of soul, so you don't get it; it's like talking to a wall.

What did he tell the criminal next to him on a cross? The other mocked him but one submitted to Christ.

"For today you will be in heaven”, the kingdom, my kingdom, paradise, the crucifixion of Christ changed everything.

First for you, you have to prove to yourself you are more than flesh, how much more does the father care for you than the sparrow?

You should be embarrassed that you think so little of yourself.

Do you believe in Atlantis, Hogwarts and Hogsmeade, then?

My belief lies in a bigger truth, do I acknowledge them?
Atlantis has never been proved to me, Christ has.
As far as the rest I don’t know what you people eat over there but I’ll have none.

 

[enrique]

Hey Safe-Keeper!

I just wanted to cooperate with your OP. I appreciate how specific your question is.

This is a link which lists the prophecies. In context may help a little.

Hope this helps stay on the OP.

http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/jim_lippard/fabulous-prophecies.html

PD: I just noticed the "infidels" on the address. Just know I don't like the word.

I am sorry this discussion has gotten heated.

enrique

 

[Twiler]

You are skeptical of soul, so you don't get it; it's like talking to a wall.

...

My belief lies in a bigger truth, do I acknowledge them?
Atlantis has never been proved to me, Christ has.
As far as the rest I don’t know what you people eat over there but I’ll have none.

What makes your beliefs more valid than those of any other religious folk?

 

[Safe-Keeper]

You are skeptical of soul, so you don't get it; it's like talking to a wall.

Right, so Christ is not overdue because his disciples aren't dead, because they've been reincarnated in Heaven. I anticipated that reply, and don't respect it, because it's clearly a cop-out to me.

Hey Safe-Keeper!

I just wanted to cooperate with your OP. I appreciate how specific your question is.

Thank you!

 

[Frozenwolf150]

The Bible is pretty specific when it comes to prophecies. It's not like Nostradamus quatrains.

When the Bible says that Damascus will be a ruinous heap, it's going to be destroyed. That's pretty straight forward.

Or when it says that Lybia, Persia, and Ethiopia are going to move against Israel along with Magog, that's pretty specific.

Or when it says that natural disasters, disease, starvation are going to increase in the last days, that's pretty specific.

The only unfullfilled prophecies are ones that will happen in the future, such as Damascus, or the Gog Magog war.

Of course, all of that is a moot point if you belive that the NT was written by people who looked at the OT and wrote those prophecies as being fulfilled.

I hope you realize that any idiot can write a prophecy and be correct-- as long as no specific time or place is given. As long as there are people living in this world, there will be wars, disease, and starvation. As long as the sun keeps shining and the Earth keeps turning, there will be natural disasters. Nations rise and fall, cities crumble into dust, and the world is always ending for someone, somewhere, at some time.

Yet somehow life goes on.

 

[Piggy]

My belief lies in a bigger truth

There is no truth bigger than the truth.

There is just the truth. Fantasy is not a bigger truth, it's a non-truth.

The fact is, you don't understand the Bible you purport to believe.

You believe what you believe, and you use the Bible to prop it up.

Nobody in Biblical times would have understood your theology, much less agreed with it.

 

[enrique]

There is no truth bigger than the truth.

There is just the truth. Fantasy is not a bigger truth, it's a non-truth.

Nominated!

 

[Achán hiNidráne]

Ahhhh edge.

Prima facie evidence that the insane need to be kept away from internet connections.