Split Thread Pronouns

[SpuriusMaximus]

I get your point, but I don't think the people allegedly using a double standard are doing so.

Fair enough. You are, of course, more than entitled to your own opinions.

Like, arthwollipot is a very pronoun-accommodating guy. I think we could agree there?

In theory, but it took him years and some ruthless prodding to do it in practice. (IF he ever did commit to doing it, as in, will ever do it again.) And, as they say, I wish I lived in the country of Theory, because in Theory everyone's having the perfect life.

Arthwollipot says he uses the intuitive pronouns too. Since EC identifies herself as female, the intuitive pronoun is she.

Same as me, then.

If EC corrected him.in the past,he may have simply forgotten.

Same as my argument for years now, really. Some people are just not important for me to care to remember their pronouns. But apparently I'm a bastard and going to hell for it, while the self-proclaimed "progressives" get a free absolution for being so holy by paying lip service to the holy church of "progressives."

Upon being reminded in this thread, he has apologized and used "they" as requested.

Then still immediately reverted to "she" anyway, like he's always done before. As you too just did. All I'm saying is: just admit that you're not any better. We're all brothers in arse. I'm not judging anyone for being an arse. I am one. Been saying it myself since 2009. I only object to people playing holier than though while doing the exact same. Just admit you're an arse and we could all skip to the pub and I'll buy every one of you a pint.

So none of that is a double standard, nor is it even an issue of standards at all. It's an issue of politeness and compliance with requested pronouns.

I've just detailed again why it IS. Again. Someone still not stopping preaching against X, while doing the polar opposite of X (even via conveniently forgetting it every time,) even after being repeatedly reminded for years that they're doing it, and still damning only everyone ELSE doing it... yeah, they ARE applying a different standard to themselves than to others. Textbook case, even.

It's literally no different from the fire-and-brimstone preachers damning homosexuality while hiring male prostitutes. It's just the old trope of thinking that you can somehow atone for doing X, by being the most vocal against X.

 

[Thermal]

Fair enough.


In theory, but it took him years and some ruthless prodding to do it in practice. (IF he ever did. I haven't seen it before the exact previous message before yours.) And, as they say, I wish I lived in the country of Theory, because in Theory everyone's having the perfect life.

Dig it.

Same as me, then.


Same as my argument for years now, really. Some people are just not important for me to care to remember their pronouns. But apparently I'm a bastard and going to hell for it, while the self-proclaimed "progressives" get a free absolution for being so holy.

Big difference, though: it's one thing to forget, and entirely another to just say "no, ◊◊◊◊ off I'll call you what I want to".

Then still verysoon reverted to "she", like he's always done before. As you too just did.

I do because da Cat never once asked me to use anything different. And she has said more than once in a moment of candor that she doesn't believe in it herself, but is just trying to make a point.

All I'm saying is: just admit that you're not any better.

Thats the thing- she says she doesnt really believe it and doesn't use it IRL, and that's what is sticking for me. There's nothing Holier Than Thou about recognizing the truth that she herself tells you and having that stick with you.

Again, massive difference between "dude, my bad, I've got a memory like a seive" and a flat "NO, ◊◊◊◊ off, you are what *I* say you are."

We're all brothers in arse. I'm not judging anyone for being one. I am one. Been saying it myself since 2009. I only object to people playing holier than though while doing the exact same. Just admit you're an arse and we could all skip to the pub and I'll buy every one of you a pint.

I'm an arse. If I say it three times, do I get three pints? And a shot if I further say I'm a ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ arsehole?

I've just detailed again why it IS. Again. Someone still not stopping preaching against X, even while doing the polar opposite of X, even after being repeatedly reminded for years that they're doing it, and still damning only everyone ELSE doing it... yeah, they ARE applying a different standard to themselves than to others. Textbook case, even

If arthwollipot or anyone else says "NO, I refuse to call you what you want, you are what I say you are", they are absolutely the only flaming arseholes at the table. But let's stop kidding ourselves- there's only one small group around here that says "NO, ◊◊◊◊ OFF" loud and proud. And arthwollipot ain't a member.

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

Big difference, though: it's one thing to forget, and entirely another to just say "no, ◊◊◊◊ off I'll call you what I want to".

Fair, but that's not what I've said. I'm saying it will fly out of my human middle-term memory buffer after 3 days, because you don't matter enough to me to be committed to long term memory. And actually I don't even care enough for it to make it past the 8 seconds first stage cache in my brain.

I do because da Cat never once asked me to use anything different. And she has said more than once in a moment of candor that she doesn't believe in it herself, but is just trying to make a point.

Thats the thing- she says she doesnt really believe it and doesng use it IRL, and thats what is sticking for me. There's nothing Holier Than Thou about recognizing the truth that she herself tells you and having that stick with you.

Maybe she didn't directly to you, but she HAS said it before repeatedly. You don't really care more than I do, is all I'm saying

And you just judged whether someone REALLY believes it.

Again, massive difference between "dude, my bad, I've got a memory like a seive" and a flat "NO, ◊◊◊◊ off, you are what *I* say you are."

Kinda, but again, what I'm saying is more like, "**** off, you're not important enough to me to remember that." Or in this case, "**** off, you are what YOU say you are." Which is different from pronoun preferences. But close enough, so you get full points for that.

I'm an arse. If I say it three times, do I get three pints? And a shot if I further say I'm a ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ arsehole?

For THAT, I can buy you a dozen pints (or shots of whatever you want: whisky, tequila, rum, vodka, gin, original French cognac, you name it) and then drive you to the hospital. Well, call a taxi. Cheers. To us arses! Raise your mug and raise your voice! Arses of the world unite!

 

[Thermal]

Fair, but that's not what I've said.

You've said a bunch of different, if related things.

I'm saying it will fly out of my human middle-term memory buffer after 3 days, because you don't matter enough to me to be committed to long term memory. And actually I don't even care enough for it to make it past the 8 seconds first stage cache in my brain.

Which is fine. But again, that's worlds away from "you are what I say you are". EC is not taking issue with your use of pronouns. This thread (refresh your memory on the first couple posts) is about EC saying big and bold "◊◊◊◊ off, you are what I say you are". And that's light years away from "IDGAF, the whole issue doesn't pay the brain rent".

I hope you realized that in the same first 1.5 line paragraph above you just claimed to do what she asked, which was to call her by a neutral pronoun

Absolutely didn't, and in fact said the polar opposite. I'm sensing a pattern here?

, and then called her "she" twice, in the same paragraph. And then you proceeded to judge whether she ACTUALLY believes it. Calling her "she" again. You don't really care more than I do, is all I'm saying

No, I am relying on what SHE, HER own self has said to me directly, that it's all to make a point, she doesn't believe this stuff, and it is 'exhausting', as she put it, to maintain the farce. That ain't me judging a damn thing.

Kinda, but again, what I'm saying is more like, "**** off, you're not important enough to me to remember that." Or in this case, "**** off, you are what YOU say you are." Which is different from pronoun preferences. But close enough, so you get full points for that.

Right. This thread, as the title suggests, is about Pronouns, not whether we value internet randos enough to show trivial respect. That's a slightly off-to-the-side drift, maybe worthy of a thread in its own right.

For THAT, I can buy you a dozen pints and then drive you to the hospital. Well, call a taxi. Cheers. To us arses! Raise your mug and raise your voice! Arses of the world unite!

*books plane ticket to Germany while googling "how do you say Buy the American arsehole a pint"?

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

"Ein Bier für mich, bitte, und ein für meinen Ami arschloch Freund." (What? You didn't think you'd be the only one getting wasted, right?)

Glad to be of service

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

Reminds me of the joke: a group of Romans walk into a bar. One raises two fingers and says, "five beers!"

 

[Thermal]

"Ein Bier für mich, bitte, und ein für meinen Ami arschloch Freund." (What? You didn't think you'd be the only one getting wasted, right?)

Glad to be of service

I forget sometimes how much German is like English. I didn't know "Ami arschloch" but otherwise sounded familiar. (Oma came to the States on a ship out of Hamburg. I got a picture of the boat itself and her signature on the ship logs from the Ellis Island archives).

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

I forget sometimes how much German is like English. I didn't know "Ami arschloch" but otherwise sounded familiar. (Oma came to the States on a ship out of Hamburg. I got a picture of the boat itself and her signature on the ship logs from the Ellis Island archives).

"Ami" is short for American, and "arschloch" means arsehole. So it just means, "one beer for me, please, and one for my American arsehole friend."

Glad to be of service. See you at the next Oktoberfest.

 

[theprestige]

No it isn't. Not unless you hold to the ridiculous position that you hold some sort of claim over someone else's pronoun.

Or unless you hold to the perfectly reasonable position that access to some spaces and privileges depends on a person's pronoun.

Women's sports, for example. You have to measure whether a pronoun is pronouny enough to entitle access.

 

[Thermal]

"Ami" is short for American, and "arschloch" means arsehole. So it just means, "one beer for me, please, and one for my American arsehole friend."

Right I got both words in context but never heard them before. The rest was familiar.

Glad to be of service. See you at the next Oktoberfest.

Which is actually a big deal around my way. The town my family was from had (as of the 1960s) more German language newspapers than English.

 

[arthwollipot]

Same as my argument for years now, really. Some people are just not important for me to care to remember their pronouns. But apparently I'm a bastard and going to hell for it, while the self-proclaimed "progressives" get a free absolution for being so holy by paying lip service to the holy church of "progressives."

No, we don't get a "free absolution", we apologise, change, and move on. You, being a self-proclaimed bastard, do not.

Big difference, though: it's one thing to forget, and entirely another to just say "no, ◊◊◊◊ off I'll call you what I want to".

To be clear, I did not forget. Well... I don't think I forgot. There is another reason why I didn't know.

Maybe she didn't directly to you, but she HAS said it before repeatedly.

I had no way of knowing that.

Or unless you hold to the perfectly reasonable position that access to some spaces and privileges depends on a person's pronoun.

Women's sports, for example. You have to measure whether a pronoun is pronouny enough to entitle access.

A different issue, and not one that should be discussed at length in this thread. All I'll say here is that access to gendered sports does not depend on a person's pronoun.

 

[EHocking]

I mean, it's in the signature block, as the site rules require. But yeah, after someone complained about the last n in "HansMustermann" being split onto a different line, it started to bug me too. So I asked it to be changed to this.

Didn’t work. I always presumed that the new moniker was some sort of joke about the above action.

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

Didn’t work. I always presumed that the new moniker was some sort of joke about the above action.
View attachment 76750

Well, the joke was just that I'm the biggest bastard. The name literally means that. The reason to change, though, was that after someone pointed out that that final "n" wrapped around to a different line, I also couldn't help seeing it. Every. Single. Post.

But yeah, Darat already pointed out that on whatever devices or settings, this also wraps. Well, at least not on my screen, so I can live with that. If it doesn't for you, sucks to be you. I couldn't honestly call myself a bastard if I cared more

 

[Thermal]

Well, the joke was just that I'm the biggest bastard. The name literally means that. The reason to change, though, was that after someone pointed out that that final "n" wrapped around to a different line, I also couldn't help seeing it. Every. Single. Post.

But yeah, Darat already pointed out that on whatever devices or settings, this also wraps. Well, at least not on my screen, so I can live with that. If it doesn't for you, sucks to be you. I couldn't honestly call myself a bastard if I cared more

Well... the old handle was 14 characters, and so is the new one. I would expect it to display with the straggler character too? I guess with a couple 'i's in the new name, it might fit on one line on some devices. Still seems like RightPrick would've been the safer bet for new handle?

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

Well... the old handle was 14 characters, and so is the new one. I would expect it to display with the straggler character too? I guess with a couple 'i's in the new name, it might fit on one line on some devices. Still seems like RightPrick would've been the safer bet for new handle?

Well, the characters were narrower by just about the length of that final wrapped-around "n" when I measured them in a message here. Yeah, I measured, not just counted characters. And it used to wrap around for me too before, now it doesn't, so SOMETHING has changed.

I could change it to SpuriaMaxima, the feminine form, if it really bothers you. It drops 2 letters. And use a female empress pic. But I'm not sure how often Darat would allow me to do name changes. But if you get him to say OK, I'm up for it. Let it never be said that I'm not up for a jolly good game of silly buggers

 

[Thermal]

Well, the characters were narrower by just about the length of that final wrapped-around "n" when I measured them in a message here. Yeah, I measured, not just counted characters. And it used to wrap around for me too before, now it doesn't, so SOMETHING has changed.

I could change it to SpuriaMaxima, the feminine form, if it really bothers you. It drops 2 letters. And use a female empress pic. But I'm not sure how often Darat would allow me to do name changes. But if you get him to say OK, I'm up for it. Never let it be said that I'm not up for a jolly good game of silly buggers

Another member, Gawdzilla Sama, had the last letter of his custom title dangling too, then one day it was all on one line. Maybe the software got updated or something? I dunno.

Eta: another forum annoyance: that second paragraph you edited in didn't appear for me till after I hit Post Reply.

 

[SpuriusMaximus]

Another member, Gawdzilla Sama, had the last letter of his custom title dangling too, then one day it was all on one line. Maybe the software got updated or something? I dunno.

Well, I'm afraid you'll have to ask Darat about that. I'm not privy to when they update what. Could also be a browser update, though, since this is likely formatted by JavaScript. And Lucifer knows that my Mozilla updates every week. Or a font change. I dunno.

 

[arthwollipot]

A pronoun replaces a name in grammar. "I like John" becomes "I like him". It follows all of the grammatical rules that the name does. I have the right to tell you what my name is, so by those same rules I also have the right to tell you what my pronoun is, because my pronoun is literally standing in as a substitute for my name. It serves the role of the name in a sentence in every way.

I ask you to call me Andrew and not Andy because, by Data's Rule, Andy is not my name. You substitute a pronoun for my name, which grammar permits you to do, and I ask you to call me he/him and not she/her because she/her is not my pronoun.