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Promises from Iran

How much "economic aid" has the U.S. Security Council veto been worth? It has been used to thwart (as opposed to making them fair and equitable) U.N. sanctions, border control, peace-keeping forces, and most of the rest of the globe from resolving the problems resulting from the behaviors of all parties involved in the ME.

Tight relationships with Israel during the cold war, made sense as a counterbalance to all the Soviet-friendly allies in Africa and the ME. Now, while I would work with the security council and the world court members to insure that fair and balanced proceedings and rulings/consequences are enforced, that is about the extent of my concern or consideration for the nation of Israel.

International Law has always been a joke, because when something doesn't suit any of the big 5's interests, it is dead in the water (otherwise why wasn't DeGaulle and Eden tried over Suez)? And with a ********* like Israel/Palestine, the litigation would take decades for a single case to clear (there's been shorter lawsuits involving Tobacco Companies, and they drag cases out for decades).
 
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It's funny you had to add up nearly 70 year's worth of aid, and then adjust for current values, in order to generate a number that sounds impressive.

Yeah it's hilarious. Only I didn't add up anything. It's a quote from an Israeli magazine. But I'm sure you know more than they do.

This is from Listosaur:
Since World War II, Israel has been the largest cumulative recipient of U.S. foreign aid, and from 1976 until 2004, it was the largest annual recipient. Link

Right now Israel is the number two recipient of U.S dollars, trailing only Afghanistan.
 
International Law has always been a joke, because when something doesn't suit any of the big 5's interests, it is dead in the water (otherwise why wasn't DeGaulle and Eden tried over Suez)? And with a ********* like Israel/Palestine, the litigation would take decades for a single case to clear (there's been shorter lawsuits involving Tobacco Companies, and they drag cases out for decades).

I don't see complexity and long resolution times as necessarily indicative of a failed, flawed or ineffective process. The important aspect is that no one is seen as "above" the process that everyone else must likewise abide by. The largest issue with international law is the enforcement of the rulings and findings. I'm wondering if a more official connection between the World Court proceedings and the enforcement responsibilities of the Security Council would add some more teeth to such processes?
 
It's undoubtedly true that the mullahs in Tehran are running a nasty gov't, with the usual tactics of domestic repression and foreign scapegoats. But the same is even more true for Saudi Arabia, America's bestest friend and ally.

Of course it is - this shows Iran could be a US ally if it chose to be. However, Iranian policy of the past 36 years has been one of constant and unprovoked hostility towards the US. It is Iran's choice and Iran's choice alone to be at odds with US, for whatever reason. Nothing US does can change that.

I don't think it's worth it. I think America should stand back and let the Iranians crush the House of Saud and turn the Arabian Peninsula into a permanent war zone.

Let's wait until after the oil, particularly Saudi oil, is no longer economically important, shall we? Hopefully this will happen within 15 years, and then we can stop worrying about what happens there.

Until then it is rather vital for the region to be at least marginally stable.

McHrozni
 
How much "economic aid" has the U.S. Security Council veto been worth? It has been used to thwart (as opposed to making them fair and equitable) U.N. sanctions, border control, peace-keeping forces, and most of the rest of the globe from resolving the problems resulting from the behaviors of all parties involved in the ME.

Tight relationships with Israel during the cold war, made sense as a counterbalance to all the Soviet-friendly allies in Africa and the ME. Now, while I would work with the security council and the world court members to insure that fair and balanced proceedings and rulings/consequences are enforced, that is about the extent of my concern or consideration for the nation of Israel.

How is Israel relevant to Iran at all?

McHrozni
 
President Hassan Rouhani.

“We will keep our promises within the framework of our national interest” *

*Please note, the above is a quotation, not a synopsis.

So, how does this equate with Iran's desperate need to develop a deployable nuclear weapon, and Kerry's attempts to keep the talks alive?
The only member who has really spoken out is Phillip Hammond who warns that.
“Failure to achieve a deal over Iran's uranium enrichment programme could trigger a nuclear arms race in the Middle East”.

Would it surprise anyone if Israel attacks Iran in the coming weeks, or months?

No, not in the least. Israel has been chomping at the bit to do that very thing for several years now. If the deal falls apart and the diplomatic route is closed off, only a military option exists then.
 
You do realize that Israel is a failed ME state, don't you? The only reason it has survived is because we keep pouring US wealth and armaments into their failed economy to protect them from the consequences of their failed economic and diplomatic boondoggles.

Israel is not a failed ME state.
 
I don't see complexity and long resolution times as necessarily indicative of a failed, flawed or ineffective process. The important aspect is that no one is seen as "above" the process that everyone else must likewise abide by. The largest issue with international law is the enforcement of the rulings and findings. I'm wondering if a more official connection between the World Court proceedings and the enforcement responsibilities of the Security Council would add some more teeth to such processes?

Therein lies the rub. While many hold Israel to the letter of the law, a much less stringent standard is applied to its enemies. Allowing Libya on the UN Committee for Human Rights is a great indication of the interplay of dark interests with legal opportunism at the UN. The Security Council itself is based on balancing power and conflicting ideologies, and decidedly not on achieving a fair and balanced roll-out of the rule of international law.

This regional conflict is, for many of the players and by their own repeated declarations, first and last a religious war. This is not a question of redrawing simple nation-state boundaries, and the very legitimacy of nation-states is under question. Conquest of Jerusalem and its subjugation to Islamic rule is the number one, unchanging objective of many in the Muslim world, as they so often explicitly make abundantly clear: a never-ending, do-or-die crusade. (This applies fully to Iran, and gives the lie to their public posturing about nukes.)

If you are concerned with human rights and law, you have clear work cut out for you in terms of the legal systems in place across the region, which enshrine profound bigotry and sentence innocents with death. Seriously, just how do you reconcile the consistent, intentional, legally prescribed, grotesque violation of human rights in Muslim countries with arguments in favor of unleashing that same anti-modern extremism on the borders of Israel, without sufficient condition? You do see the missiles raining in from wherever they can be placed, whenever there is any opportunity, don't you?

The false equivalence is between theocratic and democratic principles. Politically correct notions about respect for religious belief, regardless of its illiberal anti-democratic content, is the source of the myopic loss of gonads.
There is a double standard at work alright, and you have it entirely, 100% backwards. Peace in the ME? Islam must drop its claims, and lower all weapons, then we can talk. That is, assuming one believes anything a subscriber to al-darura tubih al-mahzurat says ("Necessity overides the forbidden;" aka to lie, cheat, steal, break oath, murder, ambush and divide the spoils is 'righteous' if this advances Islam. Some 'religion,' that! More like hate speech and mafia doctrine than anything approaching 'holy.' Ridiculous! No respect.)
 
Therein lies the rub. While many hold Israel to the letter of the law, a much less stringent standard is applied to its enemies.


This.

How many UNSC resolutions have been initiated against ISIS for the suffering they inflicted upon Palestinians in Yarmouk camp in Syria? An estimated 100,000 had to leave their homes. How many Palestinians were left homeless due to Israeli settlers again? 0,1% of that number, if that much. By and large the Islamic world doesn't care about Palestinians at all. It only cares how it can (ab)use Palestinians for it's own gain, and there is no gain by going against ISIS in Syria on their behalf. Iran is front and center with this crime.

The same goes for Kurds, who suffered worse than Palestinians for at least as long. But they also don't matter, apparently.

It's not and it has never been about human rights nor about suffering, not about anything else the civilized world would consider legitimate efforts. It's about conquering land and antisemitism, plus a hefty dose of manufacturing foreign enemies in order to conceal how ****** their own countries are. That's what the Israel-Palestine conflict is all about, and Iran of all countries demonstrates that beyond all reasonable doubt.

Can we move to the appropriate thread with this now?

McHrozni
 
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Therein lies the rub. While many hold Israel to the letter of the law, a much less stringent standard is applied to its enemies...

Israel has never had to face the law, it is shielded from virtually any and all international repercussions by U.S. Security council veto of actions or even official hearings about Israel.
 
Israel has never had to face the law, it is shielded from virtually any and all international repercussions by U.S. Security council veto of actions or even official hearings about Israel.


I think somebody has "issues" with the existence of Israel.
 
Who's Islam ?
Indeed. The faith does not have a formal hierarchy similar to, say, the Catholic Church. The alternative we do have is the set of institutional structures and policies: governments, and their policies regarding human rights, and the right of Israel to exist.

As long as the Cairo Declaration on Islamic Rights reads as it does, and as long as the state of Israel remains unrecognized and under existential threat, and hate-speech propaganda of the worst kind show to children, the nation-states in the region have their work cut out for them in order to join the modern world in peace. Meanwhile, these policies form the mantra excusing extremist positions and actions, and ought to be the square target of our own policies and treaties.
 
I have the perfect solution. Israel recognises Palestine as a sovereign state, and it gets a seat on the UN, and they pull out from the area; and the Arab and Muslim countries recognise Israel and meet for halal dinner.

In a perfect world...
 

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