It's not a scholarly jumping off point. It's literally Tumblr ideology, aimed at children. Not even a "solid" jumping off point. We should probably ditch these lies to children, in favor of more serious thinking on the subject.
Out of curiosity: have you ever spoken to a real live transperson about their identity?
Yes, and it is precisely the ideological claim at issue in this thread.
This thread is actually about whether non-transpersons all have a gender identity.
If they do, that's why it would be enlightening to respondents to listen to them, rather than form an opinion from chosen online wags.
Pretty much.
I am skeptical of the assumption that what it is like to have a transgender identity is similar enough to what it is like to have a cisgender identity to allow insights from the former to carry over to the latter, but I'm open to hearing the argument.
I don't know if it is or isn't. The one transwoman that I knew from going from a troubled teen boy to an (at least partially medically transitioned, never asked about bottom surgery) well adjusted transwoman made it pretty clear. Pre-transition, he said he felt like a woman till he looked down or in the mirror. Everything felt wrong and off. Post transition, she doesn't feel like anything but herself. No disorienting weirdness anymore. It's all in synch. The weirdness itself was the feeling of being trans, that things were wrong.
Yes, of course. d4m10n even acknowledged that in specifying that this thread was only about the people who'd never had a need to consider that sex and gender might be separate concepts. It's one of those "if you don't count all the times I'm wrong, you can't say I'm wrong" arguments and deserves due consideration.
Whenever things don't "line up" the way I would like, I do not refer to the misalignment in terms of personal identity and I really doubt people would understand me if I did so. I'll provide three examples:
In that case wouldn't everyone have a gender identity. Even saying, "I don't have a gender identity" implies you have some sort of thoughts on the matter. Even if my gender identity is that I don't conform to traditional notions of gender or I don't have an internal conception of my gender. It all would seem to say somethign about your self perception.
Ok, but I think people often do, especially if they like you. They'll say you look great, etc, even if they don't really think so, but know you do. Or simply know that you are working hard at really transforming yourself by taking practical steps and putting the work in, and want to encourage you in living your best life.
Right. Kind of like a transwoman that starts dressing and acting differently while transitioning? Is their work on their presentation less meaningful than you basking in the praise of your SO or the boys at the gym who are admiring your improved physique?
Kind of, except that identity doesn't play any role in my case, only unmet desire.
Does this question have any bearing whatsoever on the OP?
I think they do, especially if it means "do you think of yourself as a man or woman". Its just super subtle unless something is jarringly out of place. Like, your junk.
Sort of, as a response to your example.
There are several definitions of gender identity available to choose from—we've already seen the cartoon versions for kids but there are also philosophically sophisticated accounts.
Ya that's the problem. "For several vague and ambiguous definitions of variable X, what is the value of X?"
But this arises from you considering your private internal behaviour to be typical. Like any anecdote that isn't strong evidence, you are going to have to provide evidence for your belief.
