TruthersLie
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Ed Pentagon - TruthMakesPeace
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NoahFence
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TruthMakesPeace
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Questions for Pilot Beachnut: can a 757/767 fly with windows blown out?
>Since you are a pilot, if the fuselage was gradually depressurized, particularly a >Boeing 757 or 767, would it still be flyable by Remote Control?
You're a pilot, but I don't expect you to memorize all the specs of all aircraft. But perhaps you can answer these questions. If the fuselage was depressurized, particularly a Boeing 757 or 767, would it still be flyable - by any means (RC or human pilot)?
One proposal of the AOIRCPCEHBCE theory is that the windows were blown out, with hidden plastic explosives, asphyxiating everyone. Could a 757/767 be flyable with the windows blown out? Or would the drag make it unflyable?
If (say) 10 windows on the left and 10 windows on the right blew simultaneously, and air rushed out both sides at the same time, could a plane stay flying on path?
>Since you are a pilot, if the fuselage was gradually depressurized, particularly a >Boeing 757 or 767, would it still be flyable by Remote Control?
This link to Boeing's web site (below), shows they have a FMCS*. Besides, the AOIRCPCEHBCE theory proposes the RC was enhanced by agents in the ground crew, not that the 9/11 planes used its standard capabilities.
You're a pilot, but I don't expect you to memorize all the specs of all aircraft. But perhaps you can answer these questions. If the fuselage was depressurized, particularly a Boeing 757 or 767, would it still be flyable - by any means (RC or human pilot)?
One proposal of the AOIRCPCEHBCE theory is that the windows were blown out, with hidden plastic explosives, asphyxiating everyone. Could a 757/767 be flyable with the windows blown out? Or would the drag make it unflyable?
If (say) 10 windows on the left and 10 windows on the right blew simultaneously, and air rushed out both sides at the same time, could a plane stay flying on path?
http://www.Boeing.com/commercial/757family/pf/pf_200back.html
* A fully integrated flight management computer system (FMCS) provides for automatic guidance and control of the 757-200 from immediately after takeoff to final approach and landing. Linking together digital processors controlling navigation, guidance and engine thrust, the flight management system assures that the aircraft flies the most efficient route and flight profile for reduced fuel consumption, flight time and crew workload. The precision of global positioning satellite (GPS) system navigation, automated air traffic control functions, and advanced guidance and communications features are now available as part of the new Future Air Navigation System (FANS) flight management computer.
* A fully integrated flight management computer system (FMCS) provides for automatic guidance and control of the 757-200 from immediately after takeoff to final approach and landing. Linking together digital processors controlling navigation, guidance and engine thrust, the flight management system assures that the aircraft flies the most efficient route and flight profile for reduced fuel consumption, flight time and crew workload. The precision of global positioning satellite (GPS) system navigation, automated air traffic control functions, and advanced guidance and communications features are now available as part of the new Future Air Navigation System (FANS) flight management computer.
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Craig4
Penultimate Amazing
Possible doesn't matter. If you can't prove what happened you've nothing anyone need bother with.
TruthersLie
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Cicorp... I believe you will need to admit that you are wrong (again), then then you can admit that you slandered the SEC investigators, the FBI and others in your baseless claims.
http://www.911myths.com/images/5/5b/Remote_Takeover.pdf
Can you do even basic research? Start at about page 20... hell read the whole *********** thing. Then try to put it into your tiny head that you are WRONG again.
Clayton Moore
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No.
excaza
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Good talk.
triforcharity
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You seem to have missed the part where the 10,000 foot flight would not have de-pressurized the plane, as there are cities that high in altitude that people live in without SCBA equipment.
Andy_Ross
Penultimate Amazing
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Funny that isn't it?
JohnG
Pedantic Bore
Yeah...thanks for the tip, but I'm not sure what your point was in responding to my post as I was merely clarifying the spelling of "fuselage" for Grizzly Bear.
And yes, if it's all the same to you, I will defer to Beachnut on any questions about aircraft as he has, you know, actual expertise in the subject, rather than imagined expertise fueled by ignorance and arrogance.
jaydeehess
Penultimate Amazing
Even a non-pilot knows that the pressurization is only for the comfort of the human occupants. The aircraft can fly without this pressurization.
Your point being???
Which cannot be made to actually fly the aircraft with the precision required to hita building. It can take the aircraft to preprogrammed waypoints and it will be accurate +/- 50 feet vertical and +/- a half mile horizontal (IIRC)
However pilots ARE EXPECTED to know the specs, capabilities and specific equipment that the aircraft they are flying has. The First Officer does a pre-flight walkaround.
Again, yes the plane could fly if all you are speaking to is a depressurization of the a/c. If the pilot is supplied with oxygen he could fly it.
It would make it much more difficult to control. The drag increase is not caused simply by the depressurization of the plane but BECAUSE YOU ARE PROPOSING altering the continuity of the aircraft's skin!
With a pilot fighting the controls, yes, as long as the plane does not start tearing apart.
One of the first jet passenger liners, the Comet, flew well. It was a hit but after a whileplanes began suddenly falling out of the sky. It turned out that there was a problem with the design. Too many large windows. The fuselage underwent expansion and contraction with each flight and metal fatigue caused cracks to occur at the corners of the , then , square windows. Eventually the window blew out and the crack widened tearing the aircraft apart in midair. You are proposing explosives be used to violently blow out 20 windows. It is difficult to imagine that this would not result in dangerous deformation of the fuselage. The 737 in Hawaii had a portion of the roof come off and it was touch and go whether or not the plane would continue to tear apart. That aircraft was difficult to control due to the change in the way tit travelled through the air.
RC is hard enough to do when an aircraft is in perfect condition, you are proposing doing it when the plane is actually radically altered.
The aircraft in question did NOT have GPS. The FMCS cannot land an aircraft, its not precise enough.
jaydeehess
Penultimate Amazing
Well, it technically would depressurize the a/c if, as is common, the a/c is normally pressurized to the same as being at 8000 ft.
Sudden depressurization at 10,000 could cause some more susceptible people on board to pass out. That would be very unlikely to include the pilots who have to keep up with physical health requirements and who are routinely working in aircraft pressurized to 8000 ft and are thus aclimatized to more rareified atmosphere. As you point out there are millions of people around the world who live their day to day lives at 10,000 feet and higher. Some very hardy individuals have made it to the summit of Everest, alt 29,000 without supplemental oxygen.
cicorp's pet theory holds no water at all.
However even sudden depressurization at 30,000 will not immediatly incapacitate people. It takes several minutes. If it did not then the drop down masks would be useless.
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fess
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How many more pages of blithering idiocy do we have to endure from TMP? It has been explained many times why TMP’s theories about cyanide gas, pressurization, and the FMCS will not work, but he blabbers on and on. Trolling is trolling, but this is idiocy in every way.
dafydd
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Entertaining though. I don't know any truthers so I have to come here to experience them.
Asphyxiation does not work that way.
TruthMakesPeace
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Remote Takeover on 9/11 article by Apathoid supports AOIRCP
Apathoid describes the Cabin Outflow Valve which, if modified, could have released the air, without requiring windows to be blown out. He writes that there is a backup. But that could have been disabled by agents in a ground crew. He assumes that a normal ground crew and inspectors were in place. The AOIRCP proposes they were in on it.
No one said anything had to be easy to be possible. The USA went to the Moon 6 times over 30 years ago, and remote controls surveyors on Mars. Apathoid concludes: "With modern technology, almost anything is possible; certainly "robo-jets" are possible."
Off topic, already covered. For (hopefully) the last time: UA were put options and the perps made millions. Even if AA stock buys were normal, as a cover up, so what? The perps could simply hold them until the AMR stock went back up, as they did by 2003, and even higher by 2007. So no money was lost.
Thank you for the very interesting article by Apathoid. I'll make another donation to JREF. Apathoid is an airline mechanic, with information supportive of the AOIRCP theory. He only says that that adapting a 757 for Remote Control would be "difficult" but not impossible. He discusses various scenarios. In one scenario, he assumes pilots were conscious and able to regain control of the plane, by simply putting on oxygen masks during depressurization. The AOIRCP theory proposes the hijackers incapacitated the pilots. Then depressurization incapacitated everyone, including the hijackers. Hidden cameras could show if they were knocked out. So there were no barriers to RC.
Apathoid describes the Cabin Outflow Valve which, if modified, could have released the air, without requiring windows to be blown out. He writes that there is a backup. But that could have been disabled by agents in a ground crew. He assumes that a normal ground crew and inspectors were in place. The AOIRCP proposes they were in on it.
No one said anything had to be easy to be possible. The USA went to the Moon 6 times over 30 years ago, and remote controls surveyors on Mars. Apathoid concludes: "With modern technology, almost anything is possible; certainly "robo-jets" are possible."
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NoahFence
Banned
It's far easier to just you know, hijack the thing and slam it into a building. This isn't the Illuminati Olympics you know. You don't get extra points for degree of difficulty.
Grizzly Bear
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So TMP has established that "it is possible to remotely fly an aircraft after gassing it's passengers and knocking out its puppet hijackers that have no intention of promoting a suicide mission."
The evidence that establishes this line of events as having taken place is...?? waiting... waiting....... waiting some more.... ... Is this thing on?.... waiting..............................
The evidence that establishes this line of events as having taken place is...?? waiting... waiting....... waiting some more.... ... Is this thing on?.... waiting..............................
TruthMakesPeace
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Depressurized planes can still fly
On April 2 a Southwest plane landed safely after depressurization from a hole in the fuselage.
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lan...g-ordeal-as-hole-opens-in-plane-fuselage.html
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/757family/pf/pf_200back.html
The precision of global positioning satellite (GPS) system navigation,
It's great to get informative responses from aircraft knowledgeable guys like you and Beachnut, to find a better explanation for 9/11 than the OCT.
The floors that were hit in WTC 1 were Marsh & McLennan, run by Paul Bremer. He wasn't in his office on 9/11, but was being interviewed on TV, saying OBL did it. He was rewarded with the position as Administrator of Iraq. Homing devices could have been installed in the WTCs, to ensure Remote Controlled panes hit their target.
On April 2 a Southwest plane landed safely after depressurization from a hole in the fuselage.
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lan...g-ordeal-as-hole-opens-in-plane-fuselage.html
Good point. It is more plausible that the Cabin Outflow Valve and backup were tampered with.
OK. I agree. Cabin Outflow Valve makes more sense.
Even my phone has GPS. Boeing says 757/767s have GPS.
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/757family/pf/pf_200back.html
The precision of global positioning satellite (GPS) system navigation,
automated air traffic control functions, and advanced guidance and communications features are now available as part of the new Future Air Navigation System (FANS) flight management computer.
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