Obama's STILL wrong about the war

BeAChooser

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http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article4276486.ece

TimesOnline

July 6, 2008

Iraqis lead final purge of Al-Qaeda

By Marie Colvin in Mosul

American and Iraqi forces are driving Al-Qaeda in Iraq out of its last redoubt in the north of the country in the culmination of one of the most spectacular victories of the war on terror.

... snip ...

Major-General Mark Hertling, American commander in the north, said: “I think we’re at the irreversible point.”

But Obama says we've lost in Iraq. Talk about being out of touch with reality.

He was wrong about the war 6 years ago. And he's still wrong.
 
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article4276486.ece



But Obama says we've lost in Iraq. Talk about being out of touch with reality.

He was wrong about the war 6 years ago. And he's still wrong.

Did he say "we've lost"?

TIMEiraq.GIF

CNNtroops.GIF


What Americans think about the Iraq War
 
Did he say "we've lost"?

You think he's not running on the conclusion the war is lost? :rolleyes:

To show you how clueless (actually, how typically run-of-the-mill a democrat) Obama is, he authored a bill (defeated, fortunately) in early 2007 to withdraw ALL our soldiers from Iraq by March of 2008 (yes, this past March, just about the time it became evident we'd won). He argued at the time that the war couldn't be won. He was wrong.

He later argued against the surge, declaring it would fail. And despite the fact that the surge has clearly worked, and that he was premature in declaring the war a lost cause, he hasn't altered his tune one iota. He's still demanding basically the same thing ... that we withdraw willy-nilly, REGARDLESS of what the generals and current situation suggests we should do. In short, he's a typical clueless democrat.

What Americans think about the Iraq War

The problem with polls regarding what Americans think about the war is that those polls are run by the same group of people who have for the most part kept the American mis- or un-informed about what is happening in Iraq. The number of mainstream media outlets (i.e., the liberal sources by which most of those polled form their opinions) that have reported in any detail the defeat of al-Qaeda and how well things are going now in Iraq is shockingly small. But the amount of time they've devoted to Obama is shockingly high. But not at all unexpected.
 
Did he say "we've lost"?

[qimg]http://www.pollingreport.com/images/TIMEiraq.GIF[/qimg]
[qimg]http://www.pollingreport.com/images/CNNtroops.GIF[/qimg]

What Americans think about the Iraq War


I think you are trying to make the point that Obama's war policy aligns with public opinion, rather than conditions in Iraq. Maybe when he visits there, his make-it-up-as-you-go ad hoc foreign policy will make another lurch.
 
I think you are trying to make the point that Obama's war policy aligns with public opinion, rather than conditions in Iraq. Maybe when he visits there, his make-it-up-as-you-go ad hoc foreign policy will make another lurch.

I'm very happy that things are FINALLY, after YEARS of mismanagement and ineptitude by the Bush Administration, starting to go a little better. Too little, too late. Any victory now will be a phyrric victory at best. About 100 K Iraqis are dead and over a million have had to flee their homes.

Conditions in Iraq are also not the whole story. There are lots of opportunity costs as well. We are now starting to lose ground in the war in Afganistan because we are tied down and distracted in Iraq. The Taliban was allowed to escape into nuclear-armed Pakistan and is now a serious problem in Pakistan.

Iraq is not a strategic success if it keeps large numbers of US troops and money tied up indefinitely. The surge could be a tactical success but a strategic failure.
 
Too little, too late.

So your and Obama's grand strategy is to give up when you are finally winning? That makes a lot of sense. :rolleyes:

We are winning now because we didn't give up ... like Obama said we should do in early 2007, and then again right before the surge.

Any victory now will be a phyrric victory at best.

No, it's going to be a wonderful victory. One that will mean freedom and prosperity for the Iraqi people for the first time in generations. One that spells eventual defeat for al-Qaeda and islamofanatic dictatorships throughout the middle east.

About 100 K Iraqis are dead and over a million have had to flee their homes.

Most of which occurred because al-Qaeda chose to make Iraq the primary battlefield in the war on terror. A fact that you and Obama strangely still do not seem to grasp.

We are now starting to lose ground in the war in Afganistan

The article you quote does not say what you claim. In fact, it only points out that the US death toll in Iraq has diminished to the point that for the first time the death toll in Afghanistan is greater.

In fact, you seem to be equally unclear about the actual situation in Afghanistan. Perhaps because you are only listening to the same sources that were telling you Iraq was unwinnable a year ago, six months ago and even telling you that now. :)

Here are some other views of the situation:

http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/02/media_spins_success_in_afghani.html "February 08, 2008, Media Spins Success in Afghanistan as Failure, American and Coalition forces have taken the initiative in Afghanistan, and have the Taliban on the run. Yet major American media outlets, to the extent they cover fighting in Afghanistan, are portraying the Taliban as "resurgent". Going on the offense and succeeding at it always increases violence. *But is being spun onto bad news. The increase in fighting in Afghanistan is not a sign of a stronger Taliban, but rather a more desperate one. Despite all the media reports to the contrary it is we who are surging in the war against the Taliban and al Qaeda. ... snip ... No American media, except for the AP, not even the media that carries AP content, ran the story that NATO officially reported that the Taliban was not resurgent in Afghanistan.* Most of the American media buried General McNeill's statement as well while continuing to use the "resurgent Taliban" characterization. Why? It should be painfully clear. To acknowledge that the Taliban is losing instead of winning is to validate the war policy of President Bush in the war against terror. When combined with a surge success in Iraq, the implications are dark for any Democrat nominee for the White House."

http://www.thestar.com/News/Columnist/article/427330 "Taliban 'losing momentum', Canadian UN official says most militants are looking for a way out of war they cannot win, May 19, 2008"

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...-Taliban-insurgents-'on-brink-of-defeat'.html "Afghan insurgents 'on brink of defeat'... snip ... June 2, 2008, Missions by special forces and air strikes by unmanned drones have "decapitated" the Taliban and brought the war in Afghanistan to a "tipping point", the commander of British forces has said. ... snip ... In the past two years an estimated 7,000 Taliban have been killed, the majority in southern and eastern Afghanistan. But it is the "very effective targeted decapitation operations" that have removed "several echelons of commanders"."

The Taliban was allowed to escape into nuclear-armed Pakistan and is now a serious problem in Pakistan.

"Allowed to escape?" :rolleyes:

You don't know what's going on in Pakistan either.

http://sharonchadha.blogspot.com/2008/06/is-taliban-winning-or-losing.html "The London Telegraph quotes the commander of the British forces in Afghanistan, Brig Mark Carleton-Smith: "The new "precise, surgical" tactics have killed scores of insurgent leaders and made it extremely difficult for Pakistan-based Taliban leaders to prosecute the campaign, according to Brig Mark Carleton-Smith.... Taliban fighters are apparently becoming increasingly unpopular in Helmand, where they are reliant on the local population for food and water. "I can therefore judge the Taliban insurgency a failure at the moment," said Brig Carleton-Smith. "We have reached the tipping point." Telegraph report suggests that the insurgency is running out of so much juice in Afghanistan, it has to be fought by foreigners: "The number of Afghans involved in the insurgency has also fallen, with increasing numbers of Pakistanis, Chechens, Uzbeks and Arabs found dead on the battlefield." Now how does the NY Times sees the situation? Today's headline: "Taliban Leader Flaunts Power Inside Pakistan" gives us a clue."

http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/06/28/pakistan.taliban/ "June 28, 2008, Pakistan launches Taliban offensive ... snip ... (CNN) -- Pakistan launched an offensive against the Taliban on Saturday, the biggest military push against militants in Pakistan's northwestern tribal region since a civilian government took power in March."

My prediction? Pakistan will just be the next place that islamofanatics are defeated ... as long as we don't put an anti-military, surrender when you are winning, terrorist appeasing democrat like Obama in the White House. :D
 
No, it's going to be a wonderful victory. One that will mean freedom and prosperity for the Iraqi people for the first time in generations. One that spells eventual defeat for al-Qaeda and islamofanatic dictatorships throughout the middle east.

I really hope that you are right about this and I am wrong. Time will tell.
 
It's easy and safe to claim that the war in Iraq is going great right now. Detailed information about what's happening will not be fully available for months, so you can make up any lies you like.

Then when the facts come out a few months later, you can just say "Oh, that was before. Iraq is doing great right now. We've turned the corner!".

The White House has been playing this game for years now.
 
Well I can almost guarantee it won't happen if America elects Obama.

:rolleyes: It will still be Bush's fault. For starting something he couldn't finish. If Bush hadn't screwed everything up, the war wouldn't be unpopular with the American people and they wouldn't have expressed their frustration by voting for a democrat. Bush should have won the war a long time ago.
 
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The body 'Al Qaeda' are not measurable by people. They are measurable by an ideology about jihad.

Unless you go after where it is mainly breathing, you are mearly picking the verruca.

Saudi Arabia is swimming in Wahhabism, a system that teaches children as young as 14 the following in class:
The day of judgment will not arrive until Muslims fight Jews, and Muslim will kill Jews until the Jew hides behind a tree or a stone. Then the tree and the stone will say, 'Oh Muslim, oh, servant of God, this is a Jew behind me. Come and kill him.' Except one type of a tree, which is a Jew tree. That will not say that."

Is it any wonder 15 of the 19, including the leader of Al Qaeda came from Saudi Arabia? Is it any wonder the Al-Ghamdi tribe got involved in both 9/11 and recent suicide bombings in Iraq?

You, like McCain, are regarding the war as a success on the basis of it cleaning up its own mess. Strange to say the least.
 
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The body 'Al Qaeda' are not measurable by people. They are measurable by an ideology about jihad. [snip] You, like McCain, are regarding the war as a success on the basis of it cleaning up its own mess. Strange to say the least.

This is exactly how WWI and especially WWII were fought --- do you consider those wars failures? There still exist Neo-Nazis with their teachings and ideologies. Should we have fought those wars any differently? I'm sure there were many who took US involvement as a means for hating us ... France comes to mind. (;)) OK, I really meant the enemy. But the point is, you'll NEVER completely rid the field of those whose ideologies are based on fear and hatred ... the best you'll ever do is limit their potential to do harm. And the further you push that limit, the better.
 
Not hoping for much from this. We kick Al-Qaida out of their “final Iraqi stronghold” every few months. We also kill the number two or three leader, capture large numbers of dangerous insurgents and weapons, and make the city they are holed up in safe for democracy. Then we do it all over again.

And again, and again, and again…
 
It's easy and safe to claim that the war in Iraq is going great right now. Detailed information about what's happening will not be fully available for months, so you can make up any lies you like.

Talk about WANTING to be in denial. :rolleyes:

All you have to do is talk to the troops to find out what a change has occurred in Iraq.

But your side (and that includes Obama) won't do that.

BECAUSE YOU WANT US TO LOSE and you have from the beginning of the war.
 
He was wrong about the war 6 years ago. And he's still wrong.
You mean Saddam did have WMD's? Iraq did have ties to Al-Qaeda? Iraq was somehow an imminent threat to the US that required immediate action despite the fact that were were already militarily engaged elsewhere?

Please, do elaborate!
 

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