No excuse for not testing for explosives

I can guarantee you that there are no jets going supersonic over the bay. The place where those videos were taken is in or around the Marina district. Lots of old houses there with old style glass in their windows (the newer, energy efficient ones would detract from the houses look and value). That glass is expensive to replace (lots of people want the original style "Wavy" glass) and I don't recall ever hearing about the navy having to replace thousands of expensive windows broken by a sonic boom.
 
That's what I thought. I've been to Fleet Week in San Francisco (my grandfather once got to cruise on USS Nimitz at one of them), but every time I've been there it's been socked in with fog, and no Blue Angels. :(
 
... ETA: Incidentally, I'm not convinced that F/A-18 is going supersonic. I don't see it in afterburner, it's awfully close to fragile objects, and if it was shedding a shock off its nose, that shock should be coming down at an apparent angle of ~ 45 degrees. It doesn't look like it. Do you have more information?
F-18 was not supersonic, no boom. Is the sound from the engine ripping up the water? Like a good speaker next to body of water?
 
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I've never bothered going to fleet week even though I was born and raised here. I think it's my intense dislike of idiotic tourists aboard ships (I was a tour guide on the Nautilus for two years for my "Shore" duty rotation) combined with a lot of "I've already seen it" as far as most navy ships are concerned. Besides the stuff I'd want to see isn't where the general public would be allowed anyway.

I did get a chance to "Visit" the brig on the Coral Sea in the early 80's, for a summer job as a teenager I helped remove and replace tank level indicators for calibration and one of the tanks access hatches was in the brig. That place was so polished and detailed that you could see yourself in the chains holding the racks up, and they weren't chromed, they were just burnished so many times as make work/punishment for the prisoners.
 
I can guarantee you that there are no jets going supersonic over the bay. The place where those videos were taken is in or around the Marina district. Lots of old houses there with old style glass in their windows (the newer, energy efficient ones would detract from the houses look and value). That glass is expensive to replace (lots of people want the original style "Wavy" glass) and I don't recall ever hearing about the navy having to replace thousands of expensive windows broken by a sonic boom.

Concur.

Many don't remember but there never was any supersonic flights over SF. There were however, plenty of low passes that the uninitiated could mistake as a "sonic boom", and that ended when Diane Feinstein took over as Mayor. She has offices in the McKesson Building, a skyscraper that was frequently buzzed by the angels as it was one of the tallest buildings in the area back then.

They used to buzz the hell out of my building too. I was at 100 Vanness Ave, which was one of only two skyscrapers in that area back then. They used to perform a stunt where four of the group were doing a giant loop over Crissy Field. The other two would approach from the south at a very high rate of speed and come about 100 feet off my roof. Most of the time I would be up there watching them pass over. I can report that I still have both eardrums intact to this day.
 
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I've never bothered going to fleet week even though I was born and raised here. I think it's my intense dislike of idiotic tourists aboard ships (I was a tour guide on the Nautilus for two years for my "Shore" duty rotation) combined with a lot of "I've already seen it" as far as most navy ships are concerned. Besides the stuff I'd want to see isn't where the general public would be allowed anyway.

Makes sense... When I was up there during Fleet Week, we'd usually go hiking near Sausalito and watch it from the opposite side, relatively alone. The crowd was OK once, but it gets old.

My grandfather was a Lt. Col (long retired) in the Army, and his friend from the Los Altos fire department (where he was a volunteer) was a retired Navy Captain -- so he got to go on one of the better cruises around the Farallons, got to see the CIC, all the good stuff.

I once got a private tour on USS Abraham Lincoln at Alameda, courtesy of a classmate who was an SH-2 pilot, a helpful rating assigned to Abe, and the promise of a case of beer. Good times.

They used to buzz the hell out of my building too. I was at 100 Vanness Ave, which was one of only two skyscrapers in that area back then. They used to perform a stunt where four of the group were doing a giant loop over Crissy Field. The other two would approach from the south at a very high rate of speed and come about 100 feet off my roof. Most of the time I would be up there watching them pass over. I can report that I still have both eardrums intact to this day.

Fun. :D

I work sometimes at Edwards AFB / NASA Dryden, even did an experiment once on F/A-18's, sharing a ride with sonic boom research. You hear lots of booms up there in the desert. But I've never seen one at low altitude, or over water.
 

Damn good fun.

The fun part was bringing our girlfriends up there and faking concern when we saw the two F-18's banking to line up on the building. I can't confirm it, but I've got a scar on my right forearm that looks suspiciously like deep nail gouges, though the suspect will never admit to it. :D
 
Planes don't drag shock waves, per se. An oblique shock will disturb a liquid surface, but there is also a large contribution from the aircraft wake -- a different effect.

Likewise, the smoke plumes that USS Wisconsin, above, is throwing out there represent gas jets, totally apart from the concussion exiting its main battery, and that roils the water much more than the shock leading it.

ETA: Incidentally, I'm not convinced that F/A-18 is going supersonic. I don't see it in afterburner, it's awfully close to fragile objects, and if it was shedding a shock off its nose, that shock should be coming down at an apparent angle of ~ 45 degrees. It doesn't look like it. Do you have more information?
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The F/A-18 isn't supersonic in those videos.
Supersonic flight over ConUS is illegal except for testing.
The condensation wave and disturbance in the water surface is due to air flow over the airplane getting close to sonic. True supersonic flight would have the condensation begin -ahead- of the plane. The pilot would be concerned. :)
This is Darryl Greenamyer's Red Baron F-104 at Mach 1.28 flying over Mudd Lake Nv , October 1977.
Note the shallow angle of the Mach waves, with the first beginning at the nose, the rest from parts of the airplane.
The angle of the wave at Mach 1.00000 would be vertical at the nose, and departs from the vertical as the Mach gets higher.
The angle of the wave can be used to compute the speed.
And had the dreaded humidity been there... :)
 

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The F/A-18 isn't supersonic in those videos.

Yeah, we figured that out. I thought you were implying it was, since we were talking about shock waves. There are none in your video, except possibly a weak shock attached to the horizontal stabilizer due to Prandtl-Glauert instability, but even that is hardly definitive.

Supersonic flight over ConUS is illegal except for testing.

No, actually there are established corridors for routine and even commercial supersonic flight. Nobody uses them much except the military, for obvious reasons. But surely the San Francisco Bay would not be in them, unless a special permit was issued. It could have been for an airshow, in theory...

The condensation wave and disturbance in the water surface is due to air flow over the airplane getting close to sonic. True supersonic flight would have the condensation begin -ahead- of the plane. The pilot would be concerned. :)

The last bit is wrong. Condensation ahead of the plane can only happen in subsonic flight, and will only happen very near the dew point. At supersonic, the wave cannot possibly precede the aircraft.

This is Darryl Greenamyer's Red Baron F-104 at Mach 1.28 flying over Mudd Lake Nv , October 1977.
Note the shallow angle of the Mach waves, with the first beginning at the nose, the rest from parts of the airplane.
The angle of the wave at Mach 1.00000 would be vertical at the nose, and departs from the vertical as the Mach gets higher.
The angle of the wave can be used to compute the speed.
And had the dreaded humidity been there... :)

Right. Exactly at Mach 1, assuming the shock is a very strong one, the aircraft is basically keeping pace with previously generated waves. Thus the part of the bow shock travelling a tiny angle downward will eventually hit the ground just after the aircraft passes overhead. But again this requires a very strong shock. You can't really see this effect in your photos because the F-104 throws a relatively weak one, especially much higher than Mach 1. The effect is strongest at exactly Mach 1, and can be enhanced through maneuver.

The strongest effect, however, is the bow shock traveling straight to the ground, along the shortest path. This defines the trailing edge of the shock cone, and is at an angle of θ = tan-1 M, where M is the Mach number. This shock is a sharp expansion shock and normal to the ground, and therefore quite easy to see.

This also defines the minimum wing sweep for a supersonic aircraft. The aircraft must fit within its own shock cone, or else it incurs tremendous drag and thermal stress at speed. The only exception to this general design principle I can think of is the Space Shuttle, which is designed to dissipate speed through those mechanisms in the first place. [/GALCIT grad]
 
Supersonic flight over ConUS is illegal except for testing.

Nope, not true. There are several areas in Nevada where it is perfectly legal to go supersonic. However, it is military only airspace (without special approval) There are additional areas off of the coasts where it's legal, but no others areas over land that I know about.

I don't believe the FAA would issue a waiver to go supersonic in the SF area even for the Blue Angels.
 
Nope, not true. There are several areas in Nevada where it is perfectly legal to go supersonic. However, it is military only airspace (without special approval) There are additional areas off of the coasts where it's legal, but no others areas over land that I know about.

I don't believe the FAA would issue a waiver to go supersonic in the SF area even for the Blue Angels.

In a way that's too bad. I remember sonic booms from when I was a kid and always thought they were cool.
 
Quibbles over when and where supersonic flight is legal over ConUS notwithstanding, at the annual Edwards AFB Open House, Chuck Yeager flies an F-15 supersonically. (From the back seat.)
Not scientific, not military, it's Chuck Yeager.
35 miles away in Palmdale, I can hear the double-boom, but it's muted and probably not noticed by the average man on the street.
The Shuttle OTOH when it comes in shakes the whole area.. a much larger vehicle slowing from a much higher speed.
The usual testing over EAFB has the occasional sonic boom, but they're also not much to attract attention from any distance away.
But anyway, discussing technical situations with jammy is a total waste of time, he is ignorant of everything he mentions, as he demonstrates with all his evasions and hand-wavings and repetitions of meaningless thoughtless rambling incoherencies.
 
Nope, not true. There are several areas in Nevada where it is perfectly legal to go supersonic. However, it is military only airspace (without special approval) There are additional areas off of the coasts where it's legal, but no others areas over land that I know about.

I don't believe the FAA would issue a waiver to go supersonic in the SF area even for the Blue Angels.
Were you before the 38?

UPT... USAF pilot training T-38, a supersonic trainer.

Our dollar ride in the T-38 was a supersonic run. There are rules, OTTOMH; above 30,000 feet with permission from center in the designated area in the ISJTA (Intensive Student Jet Training Area), I think it had to be in a straight line, a turn amplifies the sonic boom. In addition we had a log in the ready room where you were suppose to log accidental sonic booms, flight above MACH 1 during training (which my IP and I did fill out when we chased clouds in the vertical)


General Yeager can go supersonic in an F-15 at the Edwards AFB air show for a few reasons, 1-he can, 2-he is in a military aircraft, 3-it takes place at in the Edwards complex...
 
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