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no Darwin, no Hitler

Jorghnassen said:
Why are people still paying attention to Ann Coulter?

/why am I calling attention to this fact?
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Because she's blond, tall, slender, and (arguably) attractive.

Would anyone listen if she was a non-blond, short, obese, and (not arguably) unattractive?

Friggin' annoying. When shows like the Today Show have her on, why don't they ever have someone on who can really challenge her? Matt Lauer just doesn't do the trick. I'd like to see her forced to take on a real authority on any of the subjects that she chooses to misrepresent. If the media continue to give her forums, then at least make her really defend her warped views to someone who can stand up to her constant interruptions and over-talking.
 
Beerina said:
Hey. Ass. Hole. Your god you're worshipping will torture and perform unspeakable acts on those exact same, executed Jews. And not just for a few months, or minutes, or years, but for all eternity. And you praise him for it!
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[sotto voce]
Psssst. Hey Buddy. I guess you didn't get the memo. It's their own fault -- not accepting Jesus, etc. Get with the program before God (= Love) smites your ass down too.
[/sotto voce]
 
I'm just finishing up Richard Dawkins "The Ancestor's Tale: A Pilgrimage to the Dawn of Evolution". He takes a few good swipes at Intelligent Design (ID). I especially like how he equates the fundamentals of ID as "personal incredulity". That is to say, if I encounter something I can't expalin, I have to attribute it to some higher power.

Using that logic Master Randi would be regarded as a god by some of these people just by doing some intricate sleight-of-hand tricks ....

Charlie (if it got Ann Coulter, it's crap) Monoxide
 
Some quotes from Hitler.



I believe to-day that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator. In standing guard against the Jew I am defending the handiwork of the Lord. --- Hitler, Mein Kampf

A folkish state must therefore begin by raising marriage from the level of a continuous defilement of the race, and give it the consecration of an institution which is called upon to produce images of the Lord and not monstrosities halfway between man and ape. --- Hitler, Mein Kampf

When He [Jesus] found it necessary He drove those enemies of the human race out of the Temple of God; because then, as always, they used religion as a means of advancing their commercial interests. But at that time Christ was nailed to the Cross for his attitude towards the Jews; whereas our modern Christians enter into party politics and when elections are being held they debase themselves to beg for Jewish votes. They even enter into political intrigues with the atheistic Jewish parties against the interests of their own Christian nation. --- Hitler, Mein Kampf

Whoever would dare to raise a profane hand against that highest image of God among His creatures would sin against the bountiful Creator of this marvel and would collaborate in the expulsion from Paradise. --- Hitler, Mein Kampf

For it was by the Will of God that men were made of a certain bodily shape, were given their natures and their faculties. --- Hitler, Mein Kampf

Of course, one doesn't discuss such a question with the Jews... Their very existence is an incarnate denial of the beauty of God's image in His creation.
Anyhow, the Jew has attained the ends he desired... the enemy of Aryan humanity and all Christendom is laughing up his sleeve. --- Hitler, Mein Kampf

And only for such action as is undertaken to secure those ends can it be lawful in the eyes of God and our German posterity to allow the blood of our people to be shed once again. Before God, because we are sent into this world with the commission to struggle for our daily bread. --- Hitler, Mein Kampf

The most devoted Protestant could stand side by side with the most devoted Catholic in our ranks without having his conscience disturbed in the slightest as far as concerned his religious convictions. The bitter struggle which both waged in common against the wrecker of Aryan humanity taught them natural respect and esteem. --- Hitler, Mein Kampf

Almighty God, bless our arms when the hour comes. Be just, as Thou hast always been just... Lord, bless our struggle. --- Hitler, Mein Kampf

I believe today that I am acting in the sense of the Almighty Creator. By warding off the Jews I am fighting for the Lord's work. --- Hitler, speech, Reichstag, 1936

My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in his might and seized the scourge to drive out of the temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was his fight against the Jewish poison. Today, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before that it was for this that he had to shed his blood on the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice..." --- Hitler, Speech, April 12 1922

Secular schools can never be tolerated because such schools have no religious instruction, and a general moral instruction without a religious foundation is built on air; consequently, all character training and religion must be derived from faith . . . we need believing people. --- Hitler, Speech, April 26, 1933



If you had to call it one way or the other --- no Jesus, no Luther, no anti-Semitism, no Hitler.
 
Upchurch said:
Is it just me or is religious fundamentalism directly opposed to any sort of progress we achieve as a species?
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[sarcasm]Of course it is. The whole point of Protestant Fundamentalism is to get us back to the innocence we presumably had before getting ousted from the Garden of Eden. Since that was way back in that primordial age where caveman and dinosaurs walked hand in hand with unicorms and dragons (before the flood wiped them all out, of course), anything we've done since then (other than give ourselves entirely to the Holy Spirit) is just getting us farther and farther away from our neolithic innocence.[/sarcasm]
 
Let's take this a more interesting direction: so who WERE the biggest influences on Hitler?

Martin Luther?
 
Did the Treaty of Versailles motivate Hitler toward genocide? Or just to lash out? Was it really a basis for anti-semitism, or did he just use it as an excuse?

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you that it played a role, but just wondering what that role was.
 
How about Woodrow Wilson? Martin Luther? (as pgwenthold mentioned) Bismarck? Archduke Franz Ferdinand? Gavrilo Princip? Georg Wilhelm Friedrich Hegel (and thus, ironically, his Jewish predecessor Baruch Spinoza)?

If it weren't for any of these people, Hitler may never have risen to power. Or maybe he would have. Historical fantasy is such a dodgy prospect. Darwin would not have been on my top ten list, though. Certainly, I would have put Alois Hitler and Klara Pölzl at the top of the list. You can work backwards from there.
 
Dr Adequate said:
If you had to call it one way or the other --- no Jesus, no Luther, no anti-Semitism, no Hitler.
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I dunno - it seems to me that Jewish people were getting kicked around a whole lot even before Jesus.

Trying to isolate any one thing as THE reason for the rise of Hitler/Nazism is just stupid. Trying to make that one thing Darwin and the Theory of Evolution is even stupider. It sounds to me like they are trying to smear Evolution by dragging in Hitler and the Nazis, which means that they have Godwinned their own arguments at the start.

Can you invoke Godwin's Law outside of this internet thingy???
 
Thanz said:
I dunno - it seems to me that Jewish people were getting kicked around a whole lot even before Jesus.
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Only if you accept the Exodus as fact. Other than that, they had a few wars, won a few, lost a few, and where then conquered by the Romans just like everyone else. ;)
It wasn't until the rise of Christianity that Jews where targeted for being Jews rather than for being part of a nation with which other nations where at war.
 
brodski said:
Only if you accept the Exodus as fact. Other than that, they had a few wars, won a few, lost a few, and where then conquered by the Romans just like everyone else. ;)
It wasn't until the rise of Christianity that Jews where targeted for being Jews rather than for being part of a nation with which other nations where at war.
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Yeah, there wasn't really a "Jewish people" like we think of them today. They were a little kingdom, with some longed-for glorious past (King David), speaking the language of their one-time captors (Aramaic), with a fabulous hilltop city as their cultural/economic center, and particular cantankerousness toward Roman control. This caused them to be ejected and dispersed. Since they had a well documented liturgy and pseudo-mythical "history" in place (bible) and a fairly literate male population to read it, they managed to hang on to their distinct identity through many centuries of travels and travails. It's all the persecution since Jesus that really makes them who they are today. Prior, it was the standard occupying power boot stamp stuff.
 
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