Mueller Investigation pt 6

[Lurch]

I don't know this for a fact, but I strongly suspect the majority of folk in law enforcement are conservatives/Republicans.

As soon as any of them cast a gimlet eye on Trump, they magically turn into Democrats!

 

[jimbob]

Trump tweets

When will the Fake News Media start asking Democrats if they are OK with the hiring of Christopher Steele, a foreign agent, paid for by Crooked Hillary and the DNC, to dig up “dirt” and write a phony Dossier against the Presidential Candidate of the opposing party.........

......If Republicans ever did that to the Democrats, there would be all hell to pay. It would be a scandal like no other!

What, like they tried to do?

 

[Delphic Oracle]

Trump tweets

When will the Fake News Media start asking Democrats if they are OK with the hiring of Christopher Steele, a foreign agent, paid for by Crooked Hillary and the DNC, to dig up “dirt” and write a phony Dossier against the Presidential Candidate of the opposing party.........

......If Republicans ever did that to the Democrats, there would be all hell to pay. It would be a scandal like no other!

What if Republicans had done that to one of their own?

What if Republicans had done that to Trump?

Crickets...

 

[Stacyhs]

From recent ABC Trump interview.





Trump thinks the Constitution allows the President can do whatever he wants.

TRUMP thinks he can do whatever he wants, Constitution or no Constitution.

Despite what some fools think, Trump cannot fire people in order to obstruct justice.

Nixon ordered Attorney General Richardson and then Deputy Attorney General William Ruckelshaus to fire Special Prosecutor R. Cox. Both men resigned after refusing to do so. Nixon then ordered Robert Bork to fire Cox which he did.

A federal judge later ruled the firing was illegal because no "gross impropriety" on Cox's part had been found.

But of course, we all know that Nixon wasn't attempting to obstruct justice when he fired Cox because Article II allowed him to do whatever he wanted. Right?

 

[Aridas]

"Liberals always lie."

Conservatives are gullible, easily manipulable fools if they actually believe that.

You are saying that Facebook ads

Full stop. If you're going to brazenly lie about what's actually being said, your opinion can be dismissed out of hand due to lack of merit. Once again, that you keep trying to push this disinformation either makes you a dupe or one of the propagandists trying to dupe people.

are a threat to our Republic, but having the full weight of America's national security establishment brought against the Trump campaign and Presidency; FISA warrants, spying, interrogations, investigations, entrapment schemes; all launched under completely fraudulent circumstances isn't? This is how you know if you are a police-state liberal.

Thanks for explaining how you think that investigations that have substantial basis and aren't used as a political tool are illegitimate. Further, you continue to be unable to actually address the rebuttals to your points with anything other than repeating yourself in ways that don't address the points raised. Allow me to treat your opinion with all the respect that you've earned for it with a simple flush.

Now the Mueller indictments of 13 Russians and 3 companies was just another scam to make it appear that there really was some Russia election interference.

Going to sue Mueller, now? It's actually somewhat common practice, at last check, to indict foreign nationals when it comes to some offenses against the US. In practice, it serves as more of a warning, of course.

This Russian "interference" was just a click-bait commercial marketing scheme used to generate advertisement revenue and created online crowds around virtual persona to promote whatever its commercial customers wanted to promote. The internet makes it easy to create an army of sock-puppet accounts to amplify an opinion or promote a product. This is tactic done by many companies, even the US military. This Russian company, Internet Research Agency, created click-bait websites and groups and promoted these through mini Facebook advertisements. These are the Facebook ads that are somehow a threat to our Republic and national security. Some of these sock-puppet accounts engaged in political activities. Some were pro-Hillary, some were anti- Hillary, some were pro-Trump, some were anti-Trump.

That's the spin that you're aiming for?

Still, better! You actually acknowledged that there was more than just Facebook ads here! Your attempts to present false equivalences remain as half-assed as usual, though.

These sock-puppet accounts did not create or promote fake news.

TEN_GOP and tpartynews didn't create or promote fake news? The accounts pushing the claims that Hillary was being paid by the Ku Klux Klan weren't promoting fake news? What an... interesting opinion.

As lawyer Robert Barnes wrote,

"The only thing frightening about this indictment is the dangerous and dumb precedent it could set: foreign nationals criminally prohibited from public expression in the US during elections unless registered as foreign agents and reporting their expenditures to the FEC."

Yes, yes. Raise the specter of things being taken to unreasonable extremes as a screen against entirely reasonable enforcement of principles. That'll be soooo convincing.

To be fair, though, given how out of control the political, not principled, rallying cry for the right has gotten when it comes to opposing women's rights, the way that the Trump Administration has frequently decided to completely subvert tools that assumed that reasonable discretion would be applied in their use, and the right-wing propagandist attempts to claim that liberals are actually just like the completely unprincipled and rotten "conservatives" that have been increasingly dominating the "conservative" political field, I can see how you might buy such an argument.

This forum is call the International Skeptics Forum. There might be posters from countries outside the USA. Most of the posters here are anonymous. Is it legal for some outside the USA to comment on the US elections? If some is commenting from England, Sweden or Brazil must they register as a foreign agent? Is this not foreign meddling if someone outside the USA is commenting?

Your attempts at creating false equivalence are as pathetic as usual.

I provided actual evidence of fake news from Germany. You don't like this because it goes against your manufactured fake news narrative, "Russia attacked our democracy."

There you go, making unsupported assumptions and false claims about me, again.

No one here has yet to provide an example of disinformation from Russia,

"Just some Facebook ads."

Again, though, right-wing and Russian disinformation can be rather hard to distinguish, given how inane the right-wing propaganda has become. Just look at you trying to claim that Mifsud and Papadopoulos are actually the linchpin that the whole Trump-Russia issue rests upon and trying to desperately justify how the FBI, which did a number of concrete things to help Trump and hurt Hillary and none of the opposite during the campaign, was actually anti-Trump and pro-Hillary.

other than Trump-Russia collusion, which you support.

Mmm. Given the clear and overwhelming evidence that Trump and his campaign members did collude with Russia? Yes. I will grant that it might possibly have not risen to the level of criminal collusion, given some technicalities, but that the clear frequency and obviousness of the Obstruction of Justice that was engaged in, among the rest, makes it so that conclusions that there was insufficient evidence to pursue are... unconvincing.

So all the dirt on the Trump campaign came from US sources? Is Serhiy Leshchenko a US citizen?

I addressed the comment you made. This is a diversion from that statement. But alright, let's clarify something. Are you, in fact, claiming that Serhiy Leshchenko's publishing of deeply concerning information on Manafort, who has indeed been found guilty of numerous crimes now in a court of law and was actively feeding some of the Trump campaign's most valuable assets to Russian contacts of his in what his partner claimed was the expectation that they would be used to aid the Russian efforts to influence the election in favor of Trump, is an example of how Leftists are doing things that are ten times worse than what they're saying was done?

Gates told Mueller that Manafort ordered him in April or May 2016 to share polling data with Kilimnik that he could then pass along to Ukrainian oligarchs and Deripaska. At Manafort’s behest, Gates “periodically sent Kilimnik data” via an encrypted-messaging app and then deleted the communications daily. Gates told prosecutors that he believed the polling data let Manafort showcase his work and open doors to jobs after the campaign.

There was no probable cause to investigate because the evidence was all unverified and there was no underlying crime. But this wasn't an investigation anyway, it was a revenge campaign by Democratic partisans and a coup attempt.

Your wishful thinking and projection of yourself onto others just isn't going to get you anywhere close to the actual truth.

 

[Stacyhs]

I think it's quite clear that the internet Russian propaganda machine is still very active. The Bear types quite well with those paws.

 

[Andy_Ross]

Trump tweets

Almost 70% in new Poll say don’t impeach. So ridiculous to even be talking about this subject when all of the crimes were committed by the other side. They can’t win the election fairly!

 

[Belz...]

Trump tweets

Almost 70% in new Poll say don’t impeach. So ridiculous to even be talking about this subject when all of the crimes were committed by the other side. They can’t win the election fairly!

What a moron. Impeachment has nothing to do with elections.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

Trump tweets

Almost 70% in new Poll say don’t impeach. So ridiculous to even be talking about this subject when all of the crimes were committed by the other side. They can’t win the election fairly!

Only a third of the country wants me thrown out, like why are we even having this discission, oh, and butbutclintooooon!!!!!

 

[RecoveringYuppy]

Almost 70% in new Poll say don’t impeach. So ridiculous to even be talking about this subject when all of the crimes were committed by the other side. They can’t win the election fairly!

And, not surprisingly, he's wrong. 27% want impeachment now, a further 24% think the investigation should continue. Only 48% say they don't want impeachment at all. And on top of that, this was a pretty big increase in support of impeachment that occurred in just a month.



https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/me...mong-democrats-new-nbc-news-wsj-poll-n1017751

 

[Regnad Kcin]

"Liberals always lie."

Unattributed quote marks and italics! Well, I for none am convinced!

 

[Stacyhs]

Trump tweets

Almost 70% in new Poll say don’t impeach. So ridiculous to even be talking about this subject when all of the crimes were committed by the other side. They can’t win the election fairly!

Meanwhile.....

An overwhelming majority of Americans say that a sitting president should be subject to criminal charges, according to a new poll.

The national survey, which was released Wednesday by Quinnipiac University, found that 69 percent of Americans polled support charging a sitting president.

....Fifty-two percent of Republican respondents voiced support for charging a sitting president, while 83 percent of Democrats said they'd favor charging a sitting president.

When it comes to President Trump, respondents were evenly split on whether he has committed crimes while in office, with 45 percent saying he did, and the same amount saying he did not. Ten percent said they did not know.

A majority, 57 percent, of respondents said they think Trump committed crimes before he was in the White House.

Despite the findings, 61 percent of Americans polled said that Congress should not launch impeachment proceedings against Trump. Thirty-three percent said the body should. Support is higher among just Democrats, with 62 percent saying Congress should impeach.

https://thehill.com/homenews/admini...-of-americans-say-sitting-president-should-be

Since when is 61% "almost 70%"?

 

[Belz...]

Since when is 61% "almost 70%"?

If you round up to the nearest 10%.

 

[Stacyhs]

And, not surprisingly, he's wrong. 27% want impeachment now, a further 24% think the investigation should continue. Only 48% say they don't want impeachment at all. And on top of that, this was a pretty big increase in support of impeachment that occurred in just a month.



https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/me...mong-democrats-new-nbc-news-wsj-poll-n1017751

What poll would that be? The 'People Are Saying Poll"?

 

[Stacyhs]

If you round up to the nearest 10%.

Or if you just lie.

 

[RecoveringYuppy]

What poll would that be? The 'People Are Saying Poll"?

?? It's from NBC and The Wall Street Journal. I gave a link.

 

[Stacyhs]

?? It's from NBC and The Wall Street Journal. I gave a link.

Sorry, didn't make myself clear. I was referring to Trump's "new poll", not yours.

 

[Delphic Oracle]

Quinnipiac:

"American voters say 61 - 33 percent that Congress should not begin the process to impeach President Trump."

The Hill:

"61 percent of Americans polled said that Congress should not launch impeachment proceedings against Trump."

So they softened that one up for him.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

I don't know this for a fact, but I strongly suspect the majority of folk in law enforcement are conservatives/Republicans.

on average, members of Law Enforcement with political leanings tend to go from strongly Republican for local/state forces and lower ranks to slightly more Democrat for higher ranks and federal posts.

In the FBI, of those with political affiliations, it's pretty much 50/50.

mind you, these are pre-Trump numbers and come with a lot of uncertainty.

 

[Crossbow]

Trump tweets

Almost 70% in new Poll say don’t impeach. So ridiculous to even be talking about this subject when all of the crimes were committed by the other side. They can’t win the election fairly!

Well, this is odd (even for Trump) ...

Recently, Trump was all but 'double-dog daring' the House of Representatives to impeach him as well as bragging about what a great election victory that Trump was going to have.

Now, it seems as if Trump is getting worried about impeachment and that Trump is essentially conceding the election results long before the actual election.