Molten Steel

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I guess C7 must have me on ignore. 3 posts (#1372-#1374) in a row and he chooses to ignore them yet answers other later posts. What's the mater Chris, is Sunstealer making it too hot in the kitchen for ya? Why don't you provide your sources when people ask you and then exclaim, "source?" to others when it suits you? Are you a hypocrite?
 
I read that somebody estimated that about 8 tons of molten steel fell from the window. That can only have been one or more core columns melting so it's not unreasonable to assume that there was a lot more steel all over the floor inside. There could have been hundreds of tons more. It looks to me like there was a pool of molten steel on the floor and as more was added it pushed a ertain amount out the window.
Considering that the building fell soon after it could be that there is a connection.
 
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C7 said:
Are you denying that the molten metal was orange to yellow as it exited the building?
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BigAl said:
What I want to know is how a modest amount of molten metal seen coming out of only one part of one floor and not seen anywhere else in the approximate 3 million square feet of WTC wall tells us anything about how and why the towers collapsed.
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Al, You sidestepped the question.
The molten metal falling from the south tower was orange to yellow. You cannot deny this nor will you admit it, so you change the subject.
 
bill smith said:
I read that somebody estimated that about 8 tons of molten steel fell from the window. That can only have been one or more core columns melting so it's not unreasonable to assume that there was a lot more steel all over the floor inside. There could have been hundreds of tons more. It looks to me like there was a pool of molten steel on the floor and as more was added it pushed a ertain amount out the window.
Considering that the building fell soon after it could be that there is a connection.
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Bill's imagination is running away from him again.

There were no pools of molten steel at WTC.
 
This statement

Christopher7 said:
Therefore, the color of the liquid flowing from the 82nd floor was at approximately the melting point of the metal.
Aluminum melts at about 1220[FONT=&quot]°[/FONT]F
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does not not follow on from this statement.

Christopher7 said:
You are ignoring the facts:
As soon as the metal liquefied it would flow away from the heat source under the force of gravity.
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Any liquid as stated will flow to the lowest point under gravity, however, if that lowest point is a container then the material will be contained. It is very easy to show another way and that is the liquid metal pooled before it exited the building. That is the liquid metal was held in the building for a period of time and that this metal only exited the building when there was a sufficient gap for it to flow or even overflow through. Something could have been holding the flow up and then burnt through or gave way.

The metal exiting the building doesn't have to have been made there and then but some time previously. How on earth this relates to thermite I have no idea.
 
Christopher7 said:
Al, You sidestepped the question.
The molten metal falling from the south tower was orange to yellow. You cannot deny this nor will you admit it, so you change the subject.
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So what?

What does it have to do with the collapse of the other two towers?

What does it have to do with the collapse if the tower it was seen in,. for that matter?
 
BigAl said:
Bill's imagination is running away from him again.

There were no pools of molten steel at WTC.
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[FONT=&quot]There are both video tape and still photos of the molten steel being "dipped" out by the buckets of excavators[/FONT]."
Mark Loizeaux
 
BigAl said:
So what?

What does it have to do with the collapse of the other two towers?

What does it have to do with the collapse if the tower it was seen in,. for that matter?
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You sidestepped the question again.

We cannot discuss relevance until you acknowledge the existence of molten steel falling from the south tower.
 
BigAl said:
So what?

What does it have to do with the collapse of the other two towers?

What does it have to do with the collapse if the tower it was seen in,. for that matter?
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If you agree that the mlten metal flowing from the window was orange in colour what then is your comment on Shyam Sunder of NIST saying that the material was visbly 'silverish' in colour ? Would you say that he is a little colour blind ?
 
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bill smith said:
If you agree that the mlten metal flowing from the window was orange in colour what then is your comment on Shyam Sunder of NIST saying that the material was visbly 'silverish' in colour ? Would you say that he is a little clour blind ?
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What does it have to do with the causue of the collapse of any WTC tower?
 
Christopher7 said:
You don't know how to use a dictionary? Would you like me to change your diaper too?
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Firstly go back and answer my questions in posts 1372 - provide your sources! (I doubt you can).

solid organic materials (e.g., furniture, carpets, partitions and computers)
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Your words from here - http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4497357&postcount=1332 however, what you omit is that NIST says material from burning of the above.

If you define organic as compounds with C, O, H then I can definitely say that organic material can "mix" with aluminium. Here is a chart that shows the solubility of metals in aluminium. http://books.google.co.uk/books?hl=...vT9x&sig=whHcT1Bb2ASBe2IqmRHhGqbZpq8#PPA26,M1 read the writing - carbon has low solubility but is soluble, hydrogen is also soluble and we know aluminium oxidises. That matches all elements.

Liquid aluminium is one of the most reactive substances around. It will react and it will dissolve other elements. And by the way that video you linked to was pathetic - no science was being done there at all, hell they didn't even have a thermocouple to tell what the temperature was.
 
bill smith said:
I read that somebody estimated that about 8 tons of molten steel fell from the window. That can only have been one or more core columns melting so it's not unreasonable to assume that there was a lot more steel all over the floor inside. There could have been hundreds of tons more. It looks to me like there was a pool of molten steel on the floor and as more was added it pushed a ertain amount out the window.
Considering that the building fell soon after it could be that there is a connection.
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So how much did the plane that crashed into the tower weigh? What was it made of? Was it steel?

I can tell you now that there are more than 8 tons of aluminium that go into making a 767.

Lets assume that the weight of metal was 8 tons. Billy boy! Step upto the plate it's your turn to shine!

How much thermite would it take to melt 8 tons of aluminium?
How much thermite would it take to melt 8 tons of steel?

Hint: This page will help you with your maths and chemistry. It will take you no more than 10 minutes if you assume this guys maths. I'll give you half an hour. No lets be extra generous, I'll give you an hour to do the calculation.

What's teh bet that you don't and just ignore this. I'll also promise to do the calculation showing all the working if you have a go and get it wrong.
 
Christopher7 said:
[FONT=&quot]There are both video tape and still photos of the molten steel being "dipped" out by the buckets of excavators[/FONT]."
Mark Loizeaux
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Then you need to provide them for us. Why is it that you continually fail to provide evidence or your sources?
 
bill smith said:
If you agree that the mlten metal flowing from the window was orange in colour what then is your comment on Shyam Sunder of NIST saying that the material was visbly 'silverish' in colour ? Would you say that he is a little colour blind ?
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No I would say that that is anecdotal evidence that the material was more likely to be solidified aluminium (alloy) and that he is referring to the material in a solid state as opposed to liquid. Steel or Iron would heavily oxidise and we would see a blackish colour rather than silver.
 
BigAl said:
What does it have to do with the causue of the collapse of any WTC tower?
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Al colour is only a wavelengh. Any number of devices including the human eye will tell you that the molten material is orange in colour. I only took the opportunity to damage Sunder's credibility in saying that the colour was 'silverish' which it clearly is not. Therfore he was lying or is colour blind. I think I know which one it is.
 
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bill smith said:
Al colour is only a wavelengh. Any number of devices including the human eye will tell you that the molten material is orange in colour. I only took the opportunity to damage Sunder's credibility in saying that the colour was 'silverish' which it clearly is not. Therfore he was lying or i colour blind. I think I know which one it is.
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Or you are too stupid to see that he was referring to the colour after it had solidified whilst falling. See my post above this.
 
Sunstealer said:
No I would say that that is anecdotal evidence that the material was more likely to be solidified aluminium (alloy) and that he is referring to the material in a solid state as opposed to liquid. Steel or Iron would heavily oxidise and we would see a blackish colour rather than silver.
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Nah....I have him on tape saying it.
 
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