Molten metal in basement of WTC

[c4ts]

For the last time, there is no point asking a question if you already think you have the answer.

 

[Kiwiwriter]

True, except...

For the last time, there is no point asking a question if you already think you have the answer.

...and Loss Leader will correct me on this, but I seem to recall that trial examination of a witness is the exception. You don't want surprises in court.

But I will defer to our legal eagles on this point.

 

[Skibum]

The concept has also been used to forge and melt metal.

The mythbusters even heated a steel 50 cal. Browning gun barrel to redhot temperatures in an open wood fire with air stoking the heat.
They got the temperature up well over 600 degrees.

IIRC they got it up to well over 1200 degrees F.

 

[LashL]

...and Loss Leader will correct me on this, but I seem to recall that trial examination of a witness is the exception. You don't want surprises in court.

But I will defer to our legal eagles on this point.

One of the cardinal rules in direct examinations and cross examinations in court is, as you allude to, quite the opposite. We (lawyers) deliberately avoid asking questions to which we do not already know the answers

(There are exceptions, of course, but it still stands as one of the cardinal rules of trial advocacy.)

 

[eeyore1954]

Are you saying that ANY real policeman should see that the NIST guy is lying, and if somebody says they don't think the NIST guy is lying is lying about being a policeman?

Yikes.

Don't you know that a policeman can almost always tell if you are lying. sometimes they have to get a second opinion from a nurse. If they both concur I think your right to a trial is waived.

 

[babazaroni]

Well the fires continued to burn slowly under the rubble pile. That rubble pile also managed to trap a lot of the heat. When heat is trapped(or insulated) a natural oven is formed. The heat can become intense.

Please provide a source for this.

Here's some info on how the pile could get hot and stay hot for weeks:

http://www.debunking911.com/ironburns.htm

 

[CurtC]

Don't you know that a policeman can almost always tell if you are lying.

Yes, it involves a colander and a copy machine.

 

[Dragon]

Yes, it involves a colander and a copy machine.

.. or .. switching a radio to "transmit inhibit" and then pressing the transmit button to produce a nasty beeping sound ..um, allegedly, or so I heard ...

 

[c4ts]

...and Loss Leader will correct me on this, but I seem to recall that trial examination of a witness is the exception. You don't want surprises in court.

But I will defer to our legal eagles on this point.

But in this case, it's hardly a courtroom situation. There is no judge of the internet.

 

[Dragon]

Body language can indicate that someone is lying. It could also mean that they are embarrassed or intimidated by the situation. Even if they are lying it can be difficult to work out exactly what they are lying about.
Body language is just one more tool in the box, an indicator to be assessed with the other evidence.

eta
There are of course cultural differences, about eye contact for instance, which can be misleading.

 

[Unfit4Command]

How do you know that the molten "steel" reported by some witnesses was not molten aluminium or some other material?

Aluminium melts at 600-660 degrees C
Steel melts at 1300-1500 degrees C

Here's a picture of a car caught in a forest fire which illustrates these facts - http://www.alfed.org.uk/files/ALFEDX0001/3.gif

(From the Aluminium Federation)

That clearly can't be caused by fire, someone put thermite in the wheel rims.

 

[gumboot]

Body language can indicate that someone is lying. It could also mean that they are embarrassed or intimidated by the situation. Even if they are lying it can be difficult to work out exactly what they are lying about.
Body language is just one more tool in the box, an indicator to be assessed with the other evidence.

eta
There are of course cultural differences, about eye contact for instance, which can be misleading.

In the very excellent BBC series "The Human Face" they talked about lying and body language. A significant research experiment was conducted, where various professionals were tested on their "lie detection" abilities. This included lawyers, judges, police officers, teachers, and so forth.

In all cases, their success rate was no better than for random guessing. (About 50%).

Only one profession of all those tested scored consistantly highly, intelligence officers. One of them explained...

The only true indicator of a lie was a thing called a "micro frown". It is a very tiny frown, that only appears for a split second when someone lies. Intelligence officers are trained to ignore all other body language, and just watch for the frown.

-Gumboot

 

[I Am He]

Didn't Dizzy say: Still after five and a half years we are waiting for their wtc7 collapse conclusion with baited breath??

She/He also stated that they were 17 yrs old?? Wouldn't Dizzy/Iggy have been about 12 yrs old when She/He started on the search for the troooth.

 

[NickUK]

Hmmm, my mother was a nurse and she never learnt "body language". I'd also be very surprised if a 17 year old has actually started their nursing training - Possibly the foundation courses required to proceed but not the nursing - sorry, nirsing - training itself.

Can only speak from the UK perspective on this, but the only part of any of my psychiatric nurse training involving body language has been during control and restraint courses where we were taught to recognise pre-assault behaviour which included recognising body language indicative of this.

 

[eeyore1954]

Didn't Dizzy say: Still after five and a half years we are waiting for their wtc7 collapse conclusion with baited breath??

She/He also stated that they were 17 yrs old?? Wouldn't Dizzy/Iggy have been about 12 yrs old when She/He started on the search for the troooth.

He/she was a body language nirse/nerse/nurse prodigy.