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MLM

So why are these people joining in the first place and then never ordering anything? High pressure sales tactics would explain this... That and lying about what it's really about. For example telling someone to join so they can get distributor pricing yet afterwards they find out that the prices aren't very good even for distributors. Or they are told they will get rich and then they look into the matter a bit.

There's lots of reasons, including those you list. Others are that sponsoring IBOs do a lousy job at getting people started. They're so focused on signing them up and finding the self-starters they forget their job is to help people get started.

Even in the case of high pressure sales tactics (which independent surveys indicate are not common) the fact the entry fee is so low would still be a significant contributing factor.

Again though, as I've demonstrated on this forum numerous times, prices *are* very good - if you're purchasing a similar class of product now. Problems do arise when this isn't the case (common), an issue I raised in Please stop selling Amway as a way to save money
 
The tools scam aside:

In my experience, most of those that are signed up aren't pushed to sell products, they are pushed to sign up more 'recruits'. They are told that these will then sign up more and they will profit from every transaction. (Of course, it never seems to sink in that without anyone but the dealers themselves actually buying the products at 'wholesale' there IS no profit to be shared.)

The company may say it is supposed to be different, but in 20 odd years here in the Northwest U.S.A, I have never seen any other sales presentation made. (And I have lived in 5 states out here.)

Irregardless of how good the products may/may not be, if all everyone is doing is selling to their family, at wholesale, (Like Kirby Vacs, but don't get me started on THAT one...:mad:) how can any profit be made?
 
(Of course, it never seems to sink in that without anyone but the dealers themselves actually buying the products at 'wholesale' there IS no profit to be shared.)

Not true.
(a) like traditional distribution there are discounts available based on volume, which are, by definition, not shared equally amongst "dealers". Ultimately, dealers with higher volumes get a better wholesale price, which is how they profit from recruiting others who purchase in smaller lots
(b) there are relatively few actual "dealers". Of those generating volume, most are not actively trying to profit

The company may say it is supposed to be different, but in 20 odd years here in the Northwest U.S.A, I have never seen any other sales presentation made. (And I have lived in 5 states out here.)

Amway has been promoting their products on TV and at sports events for several years now (primarily marathons), I'm surprised you haven't seen them.

Nevertheless over the last decade or two the focus for most has indeed been on developing volume through "wholesale buyers", ie signing everyone up as a potential distributor (INO) with the aim that those who don't try to sell or recruit create volume through personal use, which can contribute to profit from the volume discounts.

Thus "recruiting" is actually a technique to get customers. Not to say that's a smart way to build a business, IMO it's not, and corp says the statistics are pretty clear - IBOs that develop personal retail clients, and encourage there groups to do the same, are far more profitable and far more likely to continue their relationship with Amway. Surprise surprise.

So there's been a lot of changes towards encouraging that the last few years. Still some groups holding out on it though.

Irregardless of how good the products may/may not be, if all everyone is doing is selling to their family, at wholesale, (Like Kirby Vacs, but don't get me started on THAT one...:mad:) how can any profit be made?

Well, if you take the base wholesale price, and sell say $150 worth to three separate family members, at wholesale price, you'll have qualified for a 3% volume rebate - ie 3% gross profit. If one of those family members happens to do something similar, they'll get a 3% discount, but you've now got enough volume to get a 6% discount, so you make 3% profit on that family member and 6% on the rest.

Ultimately the manufacturers selling price is, in the US, about 29% lower than the price a new IBO pays, and that 29% is available as profit separate to the recommended retail markup. In traditional business it's the $$$$ being shared by the importers/exporters/wholesalers/advertisers etc. The last step, retail profit, is only one potential profit center.
 
Sweet, this sounds like an awesome opportunity.

Where do I signup? This is just a no brainer business opportunity.
 
I personally think that it has to due with the nature of the program itself. I have seen hard working, committed, serious minded people work their guts out at this thing only to LOSE MONEY month after month.

And yet every month they are prompted to "just hang in there" and "See it through", all the while their pockets are being picked for various 'training materials' and rallies to 'keep their spirits up'. And then when they have nothing left to give, nothing left to spend, and nothing but a pile of debt and lost time, they either quit or are cut loose for failing to produce. Not cool.:mad:

It is even more not cool when you realize that the worst statistics for your standard (ie non-MLM) small business (restaurants in this case) have only 20% of them survive their first year. Overall there is a 50% chance of a business failing within five years. Yet MLMs have failure rates much higher than that--generally in the 90 to 99% range.

So if your standard small business endeavor has a failure rate of 50% to 80% why would you want to go into something that has a much higher failure rate, is full of scammers who can bleed you dry, and is very poorly regulated?!
 
It is even more not cool when you realize that the worst statistics for your standard (ie non-MLM) small business (restaurants in this case) have only 20% of them survive their first year. Overall there is a 50% chance of a business failing within five years. Yet MLMs have failure rates much higher than that--generally in the 90 to 99% range.

So if your standard small business endeavor has a failure rate of 50% to 80% why would you want to go into something that has a much higher failure rate, is full of scammers who can bleed you dry, and is very poorly regulated?!

Because a charlatan convinced you it was a good idea and you didn't know any better?
 
Yet MLMs have failure rates much higher than that--generally in the 90 to 99% range.

Only if you arbitrarily get to decide that people who are reaching their goals are "failures" because they didn't reach some goal you think they should have.

This is a skeptics board. Most of us here don't believe in any god, let alone the idea you are God.:cool:
 
Only if you arbitrarily get to decide that people who are reaching their goals are "failures" because they didn't reach some goal you think they should have.

This is a skeptics board. Most of us here don't believe in any god, let alone the idea you are God.:cool:

Icerat, you're the one with the oddball ideas about success. You like to try and twist the numbers to show that "no really, they are successful because they really only want to make $100 a month". Gimme a break.
 
Icerat, you're the one with the oddball ideas about success. You like to try and twist the numbers to show that "no really, they are successful because they really only want to make $100 a month". Gimme a break.

Someone sets a goal to make $100/mth and goes and does it. How is that NOT "success", let alone an "oddball idea"????:confused:
 
Someone sets a goal to make $100/mth and goes and does it. How is that NOT "success", let alone an "oddball idea"????:confused:

Prove that their goal is $100 a month and you might have a point.

Also prove they are actually making this is profit not gross.

Otherwise you are just making stuff up and trying to twist the facts to make your precious scam look good (which is obviously what you devote your life to).
 
Prove that their goal is $100 a month and you might have a point.

Also prove they are actually making this is profit not gross.

Otherwise you are just making stuff up and trying to twist the facts to make your precious scam look good (which is obviously what you devote your life to).

The last refuge of the anti-mlmer ... accuse everyone of lying.

I believe I already provided links to statistics on peoples reasons for joining direct sales companies. You choose to simply ignore the facts.
 
Someone sets a goal to make $100/mth and goes and does it. How is that NOT "success", let alone an "oddball idea"????:confused:

Why wouldn't people set a goal of a wage they could live on, even if it was the low end?

The one commonality of all multi-level marketing is that a participant needs to dedicate time and all of their social connections to it. What is the point of doing that for $100 a month?
 
Why wouldn't people set a goal of a wage they could live on, even if it was the low end?

Why would you if your happy with what your doing but could do with a little extra cash?

The one commonality of all multi-level marketing is that a participant needs to dedicate time and all of their social connections to it.

Huh? Where'd you get that idea? Actual research and data or just someone's opinion?

According to DSA surveys, 66% of direct sellers (who were involved enough to respond to a survey!) say they spend less than 10hrs a week on it. 43% work less than 4 hours. (source)

MonaVie, while not exactly my favourite company, does produce a very interesting income disclosure statement that shows that the vast majority of their reps, even those making full time (and better) incomes, work less than 20hrs/wk.

What is the point of doing that for $100 a month?

A few hours a month for $100/mth extra is quite a reasonable trade. Now if you want to make large incomes, then sure you have to dedicate time to it. I'm not quite sure what you mean by "all of their social connections" to it though.
 
A few hours a month for $100/mth extra is quite a reasonable trade. Now if you want to make large incomes, then sure you have to dedicate time to it. I'm not quite sure what you mean by "all of their social connections" to it though.

Sorry, I forgot that you think MLM participants don't hit up everyone they know plus the friends and family of same.

Which is really weird because this month alone, I've been hit up by both Amway and Arbonne through a very casual acquaintance of Facebook.
 
So true. I don't think even he believes it. He's just hoping to catch the occasional fish.

I'm fairly certain he does believe it actually. The brainwashing they do is fairly effective in the same way you can create true believers in any religion.
 
I'm fairly certain he does believe it actually. The brainwashing they do is fairly effective in the same way you can create true believers in any religion.

Creepy. It explains his style but it doesn't explain why he has no supporters. Where are the other "happy" MLM-ers? This is a 300+ post thread that has gone on for months. No one else has stepped forward to say that it works for them or someone that they know.
 
Sorry, I forgot that you think MLM participants don't hit up everyone they know plus the friends and family of same.

I'm about to launch a major new business. Nothing to do with MLM. It offers a service I think pretty much everyone I know might find useful.

Am I going to tell them all about it? You bet.

If that's "dedicating all my social connections" to it, then guilty as charged.

Which is really weird because this month alone, I've been hit up by both Amway and Arbonne through a very casual acquaintance of Facebook.

Oh right. Yes, well that's proof then :rolleyes:
 
I'm honestly not sure. I suspect that the cult leaders have told most of them not to engage. Don't talk negative, think negative or associate with negative was the way I heard it.

There are other forums where they are more active though. Although I'm not aware of any of the high level cult leaders being regularly active.
 

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