alienentity
Illuminator
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2009
- Messages
- 4,325
Hi all, I've been trying to encourage this gentleman to visit Gravy's website and do some research regarding the tipping tower top mystery, but he doesn't seem very interested.
Here's what he says about himself and the main ideas he presents:
'I have a degree in Civil/Structural engineering with advanced qualifications in structural analysis, stress analysis & structural steel design.
More so than that, I have a deep understanding of applied physics. To be honest, it's not as complicated as you might think.
An already-toppled weight (sideways) cannot exert an even force (downwards).
This is very very simple physics. Please watch "9/11 - blueprint for truth". Or 9/11 revisited. (by an MIT engineer)'
And the message he sent to me:
'You seem like an intelligent man, so I have taken the time to send you a personal message.
Firstly, Im not a nut, kook or conspiracy theorist. Im not mad, mental or insane. Or indeed any of the derogatory terms that are so lovingly given to anyone who questions the official theory of 9/11.
I am a Civil/Structural engineer with advanced qualifications in Structural analysis, stress analysis & structural steel design. I have 6 years of experience in building high-rise structures . My most recent project (completed just 2 days ago) was building 4 concrete bridge replacements.
I am not prone to outbursts of conspiratorial chatter, I do not hate americans (I have many American friends in fact). I dont know you, but I can say honestly that I respect you & your current beliefs.
Until 4 months ago, like you (and millions of others) I has swallowed the official theory of 9/11 perpetuated by the US government & the mainstream media. I had seen the footage of the planes crashing into the towers & their subsequent total destruction into steel shards & concrete dust and assumed that the planes had caused this damage why wouldnt I?
I had heard of a conspiracy theory before that the hole in the pentagon wasnt big enough for a plane but instantly dismissed it as impossible that somehow these conspiracy theorists were wrong because no government would ever be so evil etc etc.
4 months ago, a lady gave me a DVD to watch it was a mix of a few different 9/11 documentaries. I grudgingly agreed to watch it after arguing with her that no matter what she said it was IMPOSSIBLE to have been an inside job on the grounds of sheer implausibility. too many people would have to be in on it it would have been on the TV if it was an inside job etc etc.
I started watching & pretty soon my jaw hit the floor. Watching the complete destruction of towers 1&2 and the freefall of building 7 I soon realized (through years of physics & engineering classes) that the observed events on September 11th were absolutely, 100% impossible due to planes/fire & gravity alone.
This created a huge dilemma for me, but I continued watching. After that, I spent every evening watching footage of the collapses, along with detailed analysis from Engineers/Physics professors & other such highly qualified individuals.
I did not want it to be true, such were the moral ramifications of it being so I visited the debunking videos & websites. Desperately seeking some validation that the truthers were wrong that somehow planes/fire & gravity DID do it that Bin Laden really WAS the bad guy but I could not find it.
Unfortunately, years & years of studying Newtons laws were getting in the way. No matter how hard I looked, and how much I WANTED the official theory to be true it isnt (unless you suspend the laws of physics that is).
To cut a long story short, the absolute proof (aside from the mountain of supporting evidence) is in the physics. You might cry thats an argument of incredulity but it really isnt. Certain things are, and indeed are not possible within the physical world.
As previously mentioned. The upper floors above the impact zones on towers 1&2, when falling toppled significantly to a side, yet the wave of destruction under these significantly imbalanced weights remained symmetrical. I know you may say theres really clever people that have already explained this but youd be wrong. It is 100% impossible for an imbalanced force to create a balanced force.
Take a second to actually mentally imagine this the TOPPLED weight (sideways) somehow creating a BALANCED force (downwards) impossible, a contradiction in terms.
Also, the OBSERVED events show that as the upper floors fell, the debris is visibly seen being propelled UPWARDS and outwards. This is 100% impossible due to gravity alone as you mentioned, gravity acts DOWNWARDS. There is literally no force to expel tones of structural steel UPWARDS (anything above the horizontal). Gravity acts downwards always without exception. There is no mechanism in a gravitational collapse to hurl debris UPWARDS. This video will show you the observed events & analysis.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVqNouxDcfY
WTC7 is even more obvious. The freefall acceleration downwards of this building (that was NOT hit by a plane) is very very telling to anyone with any knowledge of physics.
Freefall is defined scientifically as a body that is falling with zero resistance to the fall. It is doing exactly that falling freely. If it encounters resistance, it is no longer free falling because the fall is not free. It has RESISTANCE. NIST were reluctant to include in their report on WTC7 that freefall occurred at all. They only added it as a side-note in the final report due to mounting pressure. What they did was take the start of collapse as when the penthouse collapsed and stopped the clock when the collapse was over.
To many (who like to let others think for them) this was conclusive proof that freefall did NOT occur. Because they took the total distance fallen & the total time to fall and worked out that it was twice the time of freefall
This is nothing more than bad science its the same as me being pulled over by the cops going 100mph and saying to the cop Im sorry sir but I cannot possibly have been going 100mph because I set off from my house one hour ago which is 60 miles away therefore my speed was 60mph
It makes sense if you dont like to think too much but we both know that average speed and point speed are two completely different things.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gC44L0-2zL8
Please watch this video now to truly understand WTC7.
The problem with freefall, (as admitted by NIST 2.25 seconds of PURE freefall & the rest very near to it) is that by very definition the FREEfall due to fire is 100% impossible. When a body is FREEfalling, 100% of the energy held in the body as gravitational potential energy is being converted into kinetic energy (the energy of motion). There is literally zero energy left over to do any work (the work required to bend/buckle/snap the 1000s of tones of structural steel).
You cannot have it both ways. You cannot have FREEfall AND have the building bend/buckle/snap everything in its path. Again, not incredulous, just pure scientifically impossible.
If right now youre thinking Well I dont care, because I dont believe it was an inside job because loads of really clever people have said it wasnt then stop reading, go watch FOX news & go back to sleep.
If youre curious, please visit www.ae911truth.org. Theres over 650 professional engineers & architects. Their names & qualifications listed and an independent description of the 9/11 destruction. Please visit the member profiles. Look at their faces, read their words.
Then I challenge you to find me just 10% of that number of people, by name, that support the OT. Even 5% will do. And dont just say everyone at NIST, because NIST is a government controlled organization. Its circular thinking to believe theres any truth there if indeed it was an inside job.
I understand why you think the way you do. I dont want it to be true either. The truth is so massive & so horrible.. to be honest part of me wishes I didnt know it.
However, this does not change the hard facts that are NOT up for debate.
The rest of the evidence put forward by 1000s of whistleblowers & experts supports the physical evidence Nanothermite found in the WTC dust. I know its just paint right? The editor of the Open Physics journal resigned Ive heard it all. But what you must remember is that this paper has been OPEN PEER REVIEWED. Which means it is OPEN for any debunker to peer review it and fault the science involved. So far, no-one has. All theyve done is thrown **** at it tried to attack the institution, marr the reputation of those involved. But if you have any kind of a brain, ask yourself if its NOT nanothermite that they found why hasnt anyone attacked the SCIENCE involved by peer-reviewing the paper? the answer is simple because theres nothing wrong with the science & they know it.
You also mentioned that aluminium planes can slice through steel if going fast enough (or something similar) I agree the observed events at towers 1&2 show this however please look at this photograph taken from a debunking site
http://wtc7lies.googlepages.com/PentWingHole.jpg/PentWingHole-full.jpg
This shows the plane hole in the pentagon. Notice the column thats been sprayed with white foam it is crisp, clean & undamaged except for maybe a crack near the top. By your logic, the aluminium planes that can slice through structural steel would it not be fair to say that this MASSIVE steel-slicing force would at least chip the concrete in a column when hitting directly? Think about it an aluminium wing that can slice through structural steel hitting a concrete column and not even taking chunk from it? How? Please tell me how this is possible
What you see in this picture is a crisp, undamaged column that does not appear to have suffered the steel-slicing force of an aluminium wing. To my eye, it looks like a crisp undamaged column with sharp, undamaged edges (with a box around it saying Hole made by right wing.
I urge you to consider these things, to watch all of the analysis available. To put your beliefs on hold for just a minute and to actually THINK. Youre a clever man and I know youre capable.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zv7BImVvEyk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7U22m9xLrQ
Ill leave you with these videos. They are in jest, but the subject matter & message is accurate.
Yours,
A concerned friend.'
I'm not suggesting flaming this guy, I simply thought some of you might like to read and/or address a few of the points he's making, and hopefully he'll read the thread....
He may even post if he feels so inclined. A dialogue would be good, I think.
cheers, have a good weekend
AE
Here's what he says about himself and the main ideas he presents:
'I have a degree in Civil/Structural engineering with advanced qualifications in structural analysis, stress analysis & structural steel design.
More so than that, I have a deep understanding of applied physics. To be honest, it's not as complicated as you might think.
An already-toppled weight (sideways) cannot exert an even force (downwards).
This is very very simple physics. Please watch "9/11 - blueprint for truth". Or 9/11 revisited. (by an MIT engineer)'
And the message he sent to me:
'You seem like an intelligent man, so I have taken the time to send you a personal message.
Firstly, Im not a nut, kook or conspiracy theorist. Im not mad, mental or insane. Or indeed any of the derogatory terms that are so lovingly given to anyone who questions the official theory of 9/11.
I am a Civil/Structural engineer with advanced qualifications in Structural analysis, stress analysis & structural steel design. I have 6 years of experience in building high-rise structures . My most recent project (completed just 2 days ago) was building 4 concrete bridge replacements.
I am not prone to outbursts of conspiratorial chatter, I do not hate americans (I have many American friends in fact). I dont know you, but I can say honestly that I respect you & your current beliefs.
Until 4 months ago, like you (and millions of others) I has swallowed the official theory of 9/11 perpetuated by the US government & the mainstream media. I had seen the footage of the planes crashing into the towers & their subsequent total destruction into steel shards & concrete dust and assumed that the planes had caused this damage why wouldnt I?
I had heard of a conspiracy theory before that the hole in the pentagon wasnt big enough for a plane but instantly dismissed it as impossible that somehow these conspiracy theorists were wrong because no government would ever be so evil etc etc.
4 months ago, a lady gave me a DVD to watch it was a mix of a few different 9/11 documentaries. I grudgingly agreed to watch it after arguing with her that no matter what she said it was IMPOSSIBLE to have been an inside job on the grounds of sheer implausibility. too many people would have to be in on it it would have been on the TV if it was an inside job etc etc.
I started watching & pretty soon my jaw hit the floor. Watching the complete destruction of towers 1&2 and the freefall of building 7 I soon realized (through years of physics & engineering classes) that the observed events on September 11th were absolutely, 100% impossible due to planes/fire & gravity alone.
This created a huge dilemma for me, but I continued watching. After that, I spent every evening watching footage of the collapses, along with detailed analysis from Engineers/Physics professors & other such highly qualified individuals.
I did not want it to be true, such were the moral ramifications of it being so I visited the debunking videos & websites. Desperately seeking some validation that the truthers were wrong that somehow planes/fire & gravity DID do it that Bin Laden really WAS the bad guy but I could not find it.
Unfortunately, years & years of studying Newtons laws were getting in the way. No matter how hard I looked, and how much I WANTED the official theory to be true it isnt (unless you suspend the laws of physics that is).
To cut a long story short, the absolute proof (aside from the mountain of supporting evidence) is in the physics. You might cry thats an argument of incredulity but it really isnt. Certain things are, and indeed are not possible within the physical world.
As previously mentioned. The upper floors above the impact zones on towers 1&2, when falling toppled significantly to a side, yet the wave of destruction under these significantly imbalanced weights remained symmetrical. I know you may say theres really clever people that have already explained this but youd be wrong. It is 100% impossible for an imbalanced force to create a balanced force.
Take a second to actually mentally imagine this the TOPPLED weight (sideways) somehow creating a BALANCED force (downwards) impossible, a contradiction in terms.
Also, the OBSERVED events show that as the upper floors fell, the debris is visibly seen being propelled UPWARDS and outwards. This is 100% impossible due to gravity alone as you mentioned, gravity acts DOWNWARDS. There is literally no force to expel tones of structural steel UPWARDS (anything above the horizontal). Gravity acts downwards always without exception. There is no mechanism in a gravitational collapse to hurl debris UPWARDS. This video will show you the observed events & analysis.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVqNouxDcfY
WTC7 is even more obvious. The freefall acceleration downwards of this building (that was NOT hit by a plane) is very very telling to anyone with any knowledge of physics.
Freefall is defined scientifically as a body that is falling with zero resistance to the fall. It is doing exactly that falling freely. If it encounters resistance, it is no longer free falling because the fall is not free. It has RESISTANCE. NIST were reluctant to include in their report on WTC7 that freefall occurred at all. They only added it as a side-note in the final report due to mounting pressure. What they did was take the start of collapse as when the penthouse collapsed and stopped the clock when the collapse was over.
To many (who like to let others think for them) this was conclusive proof that freefall did NOT occur. Because they took the total distance fallen & the total time to fall and worked out that it was twice the time of freefall
This is nothing more than bad science its the same as me being pulled over by the cops going 100mph and saying to the cop Im sorry sir but I cannot possibly have been going 100mph because I set off from my house one hour ago which is 60 miles away therefore my speed was 60mph
It makes sense if you dont like to think too much but we both know that average speed and point speed are two completely different things.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gC44L0-2zL8
Please watch this video now to truly understand WTC7.
The problem with freefall, (as admitted by NIST 2.25 seconds of PURE freefall & the rest very near to it) is that by very definition the FREEfall due to fire is 100% impossible. When a body is FREEfalling, 100% of the energy held in the body as gravitational potential energy is being converted into kinetic energy (the energy of motion). There is literally zero energy left over to do any work (the work required to bend/buckle/snap the 1000s of tones of structural steel).
You cannot have it both ways. You cannot have FREEfall AND have the building bend/buckle/snap everything in its path. Again, not incredulous, just pure scientifically impossible.
If right now youre thinking Well I dont care, because I dont believe it was an inside job because loads of really clever people have said it wasnt then stop reading, go watch FOX news & go back to sleep.
If youre curious, please visit www.ae911truth.org. Theres over 650 professional engineers & architects. Their names & qualifications listed and an independent description of the 9/11 destruction. Please visit the member profiles. Look at their faces, read their words.
Then I challenge you to find me just 10% of that number of people, by name, that support the OT. Even 5% will do. And dont just say everyone at NIST, because NIST is a government controlled organization. Its circular thinking to believe theres any truth there if indeed it was an inside job.
I understand why you think the way you do. I dont want it to be true either. The truth is so massive & so horrible.. to be honest part of me wishes I didnt know it.
However, this does not change the hard facts that are NOT up for debate.
The rest of the evidence put forward by 1000s of whistleblowers & experts supports the physical evidence Nanothermite found in the WTC dust. I know its just paint right? The editor of the Open Physics journal resigned Ive heard it all. But what you must remember is that this paper has been OPEN PEER REVIEWED. Which means it is OPEN for any debunker to peer review it and fault the science involved. So far, no-one has. All theyve done is thrown **** at it tried to attack the institution, marr the reputation of those involved. But if you have any kind of a brain, ask yourself if its NOT nanothermite that they found why hasnt anyone attacked the SCIENCE involved by peer-reviewing the paper? the answer is simple because theres nothing wrong with the science & they know it.
You also mentioned that aluminium planes can slice through steel if going fast enough (or something similar) I agree the observed events at towers 1&2 show this however please look at this photograph taken from a debunking site
http://wtc7lies.googlepages.com/PentWingHole.jpg/PentWingHole-full.jpg
This shows the plane hole in the pentagon. Notice the column thats been sprayed with white foam it is crisp, clean & undamaged except for maybe a crack near the top. By your logic, the aluminium planes that can slice through structural steel would it not be fair to say that this MASSIVE steel-slicing force would at least chip the concrete in a column when hitting directly? Think about it an aluminium wing that can slice through structural steel hitting a concrete column and not even taking chunk from it? How? Please tell me how this is possible
What you see in this picture is a crisp, undamaged column that does not appear to have suffered the steel-slicing force of an aluminium wing. To my eye, it looks like a crisp undamaged column with sharp, undamaged edges (with a box around it saying Hole made by right wing.
I urge you to consider these things, to watch all of the analysis available. To put your beliefs on hold for just a minute and to actually THINK. Youre a clever man and I know youre capable.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zv7BImVvEyk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7U22m9xLrQ
Ill leave you with these videos. They are in jest, but the subject matter & message is accurate.
Yours,
A concerned friend.'
I'm not suggesting flaming this guy, I simply thought some of you might like to read and/or address a few of the points he's making, and hopefully he'll read the thread....
He may even post if he feels so inclined. A dialogue would be good, I think.
cheers, have a good weekend
AE
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