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Mentally ill troops forced into combat

Rob Lister said:
Zig, the number is roughly double that of the general population. CDC predicts 12 per 100,000 for 20-24 y/o -- an age representing the vast majority of those on station. There were 120,000 troops during that time frame.

I still don't find it surprising. War is a very, very stressful and depressing thing.

What I do find surprising is that the military actually issues anti-depressants now. Used to be they did not. Just "buck-up" soldier. Go talk to the Chaplin, yada.

Also, on a related note, lets return to what Tricky said in the opening post...

"There have been twenty-two suicides, one fifth of all non-combat deaths."

I can't get an exact correlation of 20-24 y/o group from cdc but I do get this...

From 15- 24 the death rate per 100,000 people is 90.3

I'm not sure if this comparison is relevant. I'm still mulling over it.

Still, 22*5 is 110.

110 there vice 90 here.

Not a hugh difference, given the circumstances.
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I'll accept your numbers about the suicides, Rob. Maybe its not high for the military. Maybe it's not excessively high for the corresponding non-military demographic. But the fact remains that they are sending people who are diagnosed as mentally disturbed into battle situations. Not just Klingers. Not just Yossarians.

Of course you can argue that war is hell and they are all volunteers, but I can't think that putting such people on the front lines is wise from a military standpoint, unless top brass is hoping that a significant percentage of them become berserkers. Plus, if a family is ever successful in bringing a lawsuit against the military (and getting a lot of media play) it will make Cindy Sheehan look like a shrinking violet. It's just not smart.
 
Tricky said:
It's just not smart.
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I again remind you people this is the Army we're talking about.

Not to mention the present situation and people not exactly lining up to do combat in the Middle East.
 
Rob Lister said:
Zig, the number is roughly double that of the general population. CDC predicts 12 per 100,000 for 20-24 y/o -- an age representing the vast majority of those on station. There were 120,000 troops during that time frame.

I still don't find it surprising. War is a very, very stressful and depressing thing.
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Which is why you don't want to put your troops into a combat situation unless there is a compelling reason. You know it will harm many of them, some permanently, even if they never get a scratch.
 
That number put the suicide rate at 17.3 per 100,000 soldiers, compared with 12.8 for the Army overall last year, and an average rate of 11.9 for the Army between 1995 and 2002, Army officials said. The civilian rate for 18- to 34-year-olds, the age range of most soldiers, is 21.5 per 100,000.
(page 2)
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There were 23 suicides among American soldiers in Iraq and Kuwait last year, all but one by gunshot, and most involved young enlisted white men who faced personal financial problems, failed personal relationships or legal problems, Army officials said. The suicide rate was higher among Regular Army troops than among reservists, the study found, but it did not give exact numbers.
(page 1)
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According to NYT, it is less than the civilian suicide rate for the same age range. If taking anti-depressants means that you are mentally ill there are a few million of us out there (7% in the US) who are driving automobiles while mentally ill.

From my dim memories of the Vietnam days, what happens is that while a guy is over fighting for his country, his wife or girlfriend gets bored and lonely and starts sleeping with the hippy bum next door. War doesn't cause suicide at anywhere near the rate that women do.

That being said: war IS hell. Expect bad things to happen in hell.

THE STRUGGLE FOR IRAQ: THE MILITARY; U.S. Army Finds Its Suicide Rate in Iraq Is Higher Than for Other G.I.'s



Change in Antidepressants May Beat Depression
 
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Send the mentally-ill to the front line, a bullet to the head will cure all mental illnesses.
 
Random said:
Just because someone volunteers for duty doesn't mean that they should be sent into combat.

"The ghost of my dead father visited me at Burger King and told me to join the Army so I could kill people legally. When do I get my gun? I've got a list to work on."
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I hate it when they set Hamlet in the modern day.
 
"Atheism is illegal, isn't it?"

Probably my favorite Catch 22 quote.
 
a_unique_person said:
Do you think that's fair?
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Fair to whom? For me to say that women cause more suicide than war might be unfair, but it is my opinion. Am I correct?

The current trend in psychology is leaning towards the theory that mental illness is biological in nature, in which case neither war nor women would be a significant factor. The treatment has shifted to the dominanat use of drugs rather than therapy. Some of the drugs are suspected to increase suicidal thoughts.

Was the article in the OP fair when it tried to make a conspiracy connection that Pres. Bush is deliberately sending mentally ill people into combat? I think my opinion is more "fair" than that. Your mileage may vary.
 
a_unique_person said:
It takes at least two to tango. How man red blooded american men are involved in this?
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Still, the Henry-Short hypothesis can be used to explain some counter-intuitive facts, such as the low suicide rate among Nazi concentration camp inmates, among African-Americans, and during wartime; though, as Erwin Stengel observed, "It is a melancholy thought that marriage and the family should be such effective substitutes for conditions of war..."
http://www.a1b2c3.com/suilodge/facovr1a.htm
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To answer your question, probably more men than women as gay teen suicides are IIRC more than heteros. As with most things human, it is usually due to multiple causation. It makes a better sound byte to say that women kill more men than war, so forget about that bit, I take it back. The point is, that the story in the OP has little relevance when compared with the reality of civilian life and against the background of human nature.
 
a_unique_person said:
Do you think that's fair?
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Do you think that matters or is even slightly relevant? Is life fair? Geez you must be awfully young.

News flash people: the Army (and really the military in general, for the most part, although the Army is the worst) does not care about its troops, at least no more than it has to for CYA purposes.
 
Do you think we should discriminate against the mentally ill by NOT allowing them to serve? Wouldn't that be against the law (ADA)?
 
casebro said:
Do you think we should discriminate against the mentally ill by NOT allowing them to serve? Wouldn't that be against the law (ADA)?
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That is some seriously lame trolling.

And yes, I think you should be allowed to serve.

:rolleyes:
 
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