Loose Change

[chipmunk stew]

I haven't made my go-round yet. I'm collecting some of their own "evidence" to have at the ready.

As for Moussaoui, we should have a pool on what the most common answer will be. My money is on some variant of 'he's a retard and the government has the poor sap convinced he's guilty.'

At least one person insinuated that he's probably a paid conspirator who will be living large in a mansion once they ship all the dissenters off to the FEMA camps. Apparently they timed the trial and his revelation to distract people from Charlie Sheen.

 

[hurdygurdy]

eeek, now the behadings were staged

http://s15.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=2135

Roxdog quotes Doctor Raúl Castro Guevara, "a surgeon and forensic expert in Mexico City":

No hay manera que el individuo en el video estaba vivo y su corazon funcionando cuando le estaban cortando la cabeza. En estos casos, el corazon impela sangre con gran presion, y se corta las arterias del cuello, hay una gran cantidad de sangre que salpica por todos lados. En mi opinion el video es un fraude.

=

There is no way that the individual in the video was alive and its heart working when they were cutting the head to him. In these cases, the heart impels blood with great pressure, and it cuts the arteries of the neck, is a great amount of blood that splashes by all sides. In my opinion the video is a fraud.

Spanish is my mother tongue and I can see clearly that the spanish text is a really bad traduction of the english "traduction".

Raul Castro Guevara. Please. It sounds like the secret son of Fidel and el Ché.

 

[Gravy]

Oh, that's an awesome idea! I'm going to email fstdt's webmaster and see what they say about it.

Let me know what happens. I've already started a collection of quotes.

 

[NoZed Avenger]

Apparently they timed the trial and his revelation to distract people from Charlie Sheen.

I approve of any tactic to distract people from Charlie Sheen.

 

[Gravy]

Excellent question. Is anyone here NOT banned from Loose Change's forums to ask it?

But the government IS the prosecution.

 

[Gravy]

oh and one other thing, i hate how smug and condescending CTs are. if you question their theories, they just treat you as a sad, naive sould who is being played the fool.

That is easily combatted by asking them for evidence.

Oh, BTW, i left my bosses office and forwarded him a couple of succint articles debunking all the info the coworkers had just fed him just so we could have a laugh without sending them into some sort of tizzy.

Well done.

 

[senorpogo]

Roxdog quotes Doctor Raúl Castro Guevara, "a surgeon and forensic expert in Mexico City":



Spanish is my mother tongue and I can see clearly that the spanish text is a really bad traduction of the english "traduction".

Raul Castro Guevara. Please. It sounds like the secret son of Fidel and el Ché.

So I did a quick google on "Doctor Raúl Castro Guevara" and got some 1000 hits. A quick glance revealed that the majority were about his comments on the Berg video. So I then did another search this time for "Doctor Raúl Castro Guevara" adding the limit "without the word : berg" in hopes to find some references to some of the other work of the old Doc, a list of his credentials, or maybe where he works. Basically, anything other than his comments on the Berg video. That search returned 21 hits, eight of which were unique (the other 13 being listed as very similar to the eight). In those eight, the majority of those are related to the Berg video as well.

So this guy, this doctor, is mentioned nowhere on the internet outside of his evaluation of the Berg tape.

Seems very credible.

 

[conspiracybeliever]

"I certainly would need to be convinced it [the decapitation video] was authentic," Dr John Simpson, executive director for surgical affairs at the Royal Australasian College of Surgeons, said from New Zealand. Echoing Dr Simpson's criticism, when this journalist asked forensic death expert Jon Nordby, PhD and fellow of the American Board of Medicolegal Death Investigators, whether he believed the Berg decapitation video had been "staged", Nordby replied: "Yes, I think that's the best explanation of it." ...."I would have thought that all the people in the vicinity would have been covered in blood, in a matter of seconds ... if it was genuine," said Simpson. Notably, the act's perpetrators appeared far from so. And separately Nordby observed: "I think that by the time they're ... on his head, he's already dead."

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/FE22Ak03.html

 

[Manny]

And of course that's relevant to exactly nothing whatsoever. Suppose, for a second, that Mr. Berg had indeed been killed by his captors or otherwise died in captivity prior to his being beheaded. That would not change that the terrorists beheaded him and circulated the film, nor that they had done so with others who were indisputably alive at the time of their beheadings.

Hey, did we ever find out whether you think that Americans have to pay income tax on American income?

 

[senorpogo]

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/FE22Ak03.html

"Both Simpson and Nordby also noted the difficulty in providing analysis based on the video, the inherent limitations presented by this. But both also felt that Berg had seemed drugged."

They thought that the dead body seemed drugged?

 

[Nyarlathotep]

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/FE22Ak03.html

ABMDI Board Certified fellows

No Jon Nordby here. The globalists must have gotten to the database.

 

[Manny]

ABMDI Board Certified fellows

No Jon Nordby here. The globalists must have gotten to the database.

That looks to be an error on the part of the article's author -- she also erred in Dr. Simpson's title. But Dr. Nordby exists and is a forensics kind of guy. He appears to have been an examiner for the ABMDI at some point, among his other credits.

 

[Nyarlathotep]

That looks to be an error on the part of the article's author -- she also erred in Dr. Simpson's title. But Dr. Nordby exists and is a forensics kind of guy. He appears to have been an examiner for the ABMDI at some point, among his other credits.

Fair enough, though even a non-doctor can see what is wrong with taking the comments of Simpson and Nordby to mean that the government somehow 'faked' the Berg beheading.

For the sake of argument, let's say the blood spray is all wrong. I certainly don't know enougha bout the subject to say otherwise. Nonetheless, that doesn't constitute positive evidence of the government faking the videos. It is not hard to suppose that Al Qaeda beheaded a dead body for effect. Likewise if he was 'drugged', Al Qaeda can drug a man too.

IN fact, from the context provided, there is nothing in the comments to suggest that either doctor was saying anything more than that the beheading wasn't 'as advertised'. That is, they seem to be saying that Berg was drugged or already dead by the time they got to his head. That's all well and good, but it doesn't say a single thing about WHO did the drugging or the killing, which really is the heart of the matter.

These Loose Brains nutters seem to think that any hole in the official story = The Gubbmint did it. They are rather like rabid creationists trying to poke holes in the theory of evolution that way.

 

[Manny]

IN fact, from the context provided, there is nothing in the comments to suggest that either doctor was saying anything more than that the beheading wasn't 'as advertised'. That is, they seem to be saying that Berg was drugged or already dead by the time they got to his head. That's all well and good, but it doesn't say a single thing about WHO did the drugging or the killing, which really is the heart of the matter.

These Loose Brains nutters seem to think that any hole in the official story = The Gubbmint did it. They are rather like rabid creationists trying to poke holes in the theory of evolution that way.

Clearly, you now join me as a "freaking dumb@ass."

 

[sat556]

It strikes me as mighty cowardly of the Loosers that they won't come on here and debate. This is a much better moderated forum that that one, where everybody, including them, can say what they think. I might have a bit more respect for their opinions if they weren't banning people left and right. Looks like they are scared of something.
Come on Loosers, get over here. It'll make you look a lot better. Either that or stop banning people for having opinions. The mods there come across like that Troy guy.

 

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

It strikes me as mighty cowardly of the Loosers that they won't come on here and debate. This is a much better moderated forum that that one, where everybody, including them, can say what they think. I might have a bit more respect for their opinions if they weren't banning people left and right. Looks like they are scared of something.
Come on Loosers, get over here. It'll make you look a lot better. Either that or stop banning people for having opinions. The mods there come across like that Troy guy.

Yes, but they seem to not be able to follow the explicitly stated rules for here and/or flee when confronted by logic.

 

[senorpogo]

I personally love the "dank basement with bad paint = Abu Gharib" angle. I mean, really, how could it not?

 

[senorpogo]

Why is it that CTs believe that EVERYTHING is a conspiracy? Like on 9/11, it can't just be that the government shot missles at the Pentagon or that the they burned down WTC 7 for some nefarious reason or that the CIA helped the hijackers. Nope, it has to be radio controlled planes emptied of civilian passenger (who are eventually executed by government spooks) then crashed into towers filled with explosives planted by invisible Haliburton employees all while Army personel are shooting missles at the Pentagon.

And then you get a grainy video of some poor souls execution and, because of a widely available white lawn chair that looks suspiciously like another widely available white lawn chair, you deduce that US Government faked the execution in attempt to - what? - make a hated terrorist organization despised by Americans look bad.

It's guess that's bound to happen when you assume everything said by the government and media are lies. But still, you'd think the CTs would be strategic enough to pick, like, one or two conspiracies and go with them. But I guess you've got to fill the hours in your day somehow.

 

[WildCat]

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/FE22Ak03.html

Hey Roxdog, glad you're back. Do any of you lunatic cowards want to come here and actually debate this whole thing? Obviously, dissent isn't allowed on the LC group-think board. That place resembles an old Soviet-era "re-education camp" more than anything else.

And by "debate", I don't mean posting 10,000 google hits about the same nutjob. It means you will actually have to be an advocate for your views by presenting evidence and falsifiable hypotheses.

I doubt you will, but that's ok. We'll just lurk on your little fascist forum and laugh at you.

 

[brodski]

And then you get a grainy video of some poor souls execution and, because of a widely available white lawn chair that looks suspiciously like another widely available white lawn chair, you deduce that US Government faked the execution in attempt to - what? - make a hated terrorist organization despised by Americans look bad.

You don't get it, many PCTers don't even believe that terrorist organizations exist, certainly not AQ anyway. The government had to fake the execution, just t prove that there are real terrorists.

I'm waiting to be told that Te US never invaded Iraq, and all the troops that are "deployed" over there are actually manning the FEMA camps.