Loose Change - Part III

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JamesB said:
You have been suspended already? I haven't yet. I am expecting it moment after pointing out he was lying about PNAC.

http://www.atfreeforum.com/911studies/viewtopic.php?t=5&mforum=911studies

Remember, these papers were "peer reviewed" before they were published.

To add to gravy's post, the professor admitted to me in an e-mail:
Yes it is possible that you could make the angle cut like that and get the appearance observed. However why would you waste all that expensive procedure at an angle? It would be much cheaper to cut the column horizontally.
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But of course he then stated the exact opposite in the forum.
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His comment sort of makes the assumption that these ironworkers were working with ideal jobsite conditions. The reality was often more like this:

8790444fc18b8d552.jpg
To suggest that a column cut at an angle suggests foul play is quite strange.
 
Johnny Pixels said:
I was trying to get an answer to how thermite cuts through vertical columns and doesn't just run straight down the side, with the help of this :[qimg]http://img434.imageshack.us/img434/1114/untitled4dv1.jpg[/qimg]

Expert diagram. Except I've just got suspended for a month.
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I asked the professor repeatedly what type of thermite device would be used to make a cut like this, he just kept on making vague comments about some nameless "patented" device. Then he finally said "thermite is nothing strange or new look it up on google" Which not only doesn't answer the question, but was insulting because I specifically told him I had experience in the use of thermite with military grenades. Which is probably more experience then he does.

To answer your question, which of course you know can not be answered, no way in hell. I suppose you could theoretically make a "belt" of thermite that went clear around the beam, but it would not make a flat cut. The outside part would melt first and drip down the side, it would end up looking like a pyramid. Thermite is extremely volatile and messy, it would not create anything near that neat looking. Check out this video for example.

http://www.guzer.com/videos/thermite_car.php
 
MarkyX said:
I kind of disagree with you there. Instead of adding some bias commentary like Loose Change or Michael Moore, we get the real meat into the matter. This is not what the author of the document is saying; this is what THEY are saying, with their own words and actions.
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You're perfectly right. I wasn't suggesting an "audio" commentary, it wouldn't be appropriate for Karim's style (the absence of voice-over), wich I think is one of his best qualities. His style reminds me of Werner Herzog's "Fata Morgana". But maybe some other way to focus our attention on what we are seeing would help clarify a bit. :)
 
Gravy said:
His comment sort of makes the assumption that these ironworkers were working with ideal jobsite conditions. The reality was often more like this:

[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehost/8790444fc18b8d552.jpg[/qimg]​
To suggest that a column cut at an angle suggests foul play is quite strange.
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Yeah, my response to him, which he did not like at all, was:

Maybe they couldn’t get into the right position to take it straight on? Occam’s razor here, which is easier to explain? A complicated international conspiracy involving the placing of some strange new demolition device that nobody has ever seen? Or some union worker on overtime not caring how much acetylene he wasted?
 
JamesB said:
Yeah, my response to him, which he did not like at all, was:

Maybe they couldn’t get into the right position to take it straight on? Occam’s razor here, which is easier to explain? A complicated international conspiracy involving the placing of some strange new demolition device that nobody has ever seen? Or some union worker on overtime not caring how much acetylene he wasted?
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My thought was that perhaps they cut it at an angle to have some control over which direction the column was going to fall over... just like people cut a tree.
 
karim said:
May I ask those who are interested to check out my new film. It's sort of directed to CTs but might interest others too.

There is some video where some of the 911 hijackers appear.
Few quotes:
"... after consulting sincere scholars ...(mentions many names including Bin laden)... We found no solution than carrying out martyrdom operations."
-Ahmad Al-Haznawi (united 93)

"May Allah reward those who trained me on this path... I mention in particular the Mujahid leader Shaykh Usama bin Muhammed bin Laden"
-Abdul Aziz Alomari (American Airlines 11)

and so on.

For now this video is on google only for it's just the "first version". I would like to hear some feedback and comments, good or bad.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3657479898431151510
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Karim,

This is a very powerful piece of work, and it speaks for itself.

About half-way thru the film I found myself wondering what the lyrics to the music in the background meant. It was a very powerful device to see the translations, and then to hear one of the hijackers reading them back during his Last Will & Testament.

Thank you again.
 
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Montoya said:
My thought was that perhaps they cut it at an angle to have some control over which direction the column was going to fall over... just like people cut a tree.
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You are correct, I thought at first he was talking about the angle of the torch which he brought up earlier. In the "Jones" photo he claimed that grooves were both too wide and not perpendicular, which he said would not happen. I showed him the pic of them cutting with a thermic torch holding it an an oblique angle, and he admitted it could. The angle of the cut is another issue, which is obviously also explained.

Of course none of this is actually ever explained by thermite, which now he apparently is saying he is not trying to do. Bizarre.
 
Montoya said:
My thought was that perhaps they cut it at an angle to have some control over which direction the column was going to fall over... just like people cut a tree.
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Usually a crane cable would be attached to the top of the piece to keep it from falling over and to speed removal, but perhaps that couldn't be done in that case. There clearly is a steep slope heading towards the camera.
 
dubfan said:
About half-way thru the film I found myself wondering what the lyrics to the music in the background meant. It was a very powerful device to see the translations, and then to hear one of the hijackers reading them back during his Last Will & Testament.
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That's what's so powerful about the film. The music is so moving and beautiful that once you know what the lyrics mean, it becomes really disturbing.
 
Well I linked "The Usual suspects" on Screw Loose Change. It was too good to wait any longer to promote. If Karim doesn't want me to (and I can't imagine why not) then just let me know and I will take it down.
 
Thank you for all the comments.

I will do some fixing on it... when I have time. And I will upload a downloadable better resolution version soon.

Ofcourse you can link to this version if you want. After all it says at the end of the film that it's the first version. Yes, the Haznawi section is too long and other good points here also.
 
karim said:
Thank you for all the comments.

I will do some fixing on it... when I have time. And I will upload a downloadable better resolution version soon.

Ofcourse you can link to this version if you want. After all it says at the end of the film that it's the first version. Yes, the Haznawi section is too long and other good points here also.
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Karim, good job. I agree that the Haznawi section is to long.
 
karim said:
Thank you for all the comments.

I will do some fixing on it... when I have time. And I will upload a downloadable better resolution version soon.

Ofcourse you can link to this version if you want. After all it says at the end of the film that it's the first version. Yes, the Haznawi section is too long and other good points here also.
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If it is OK with you, I will send off a pointer to the video blog Hot Air. They would most likely find this very interesting. We'll push you up the google charts!
 
There's some real wackiness on the 911 Studies forum. One poster, MMC, has made several jaw-droppers in just a few posts:

WTC 1: There Was No Inferno
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WTC 2: There Was No Inferno
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It doesn't matter...the impact of a plane, in terms of structural damage to the WTC, is a non event...
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That's a lie. We know the impact of the plane did not do major structural damage...
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Yes, I have read the NIST reports...
There is no evidence contained within them.
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