Looking for Skeptics

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Maurice Ledifficile said:
I would like to interrupt this thread to plagiarize the following disclaimer, which hereby applies to all the posts I ever made and ever will make.

DISCLAIMER: The following is my opinion only. I do not represent the JREF message board in any way. My opinion carries no more weight than that of any other poster's.


Worthy of plagiarism, in part for its proper use of an apostrophe.
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Actually, no. "...that [=the opinion] of any other poster."

ETA: I retract that. "...that [=the weight] of any other poster's [opinion]."

Could go either way. I'm glad that's out of the way.
 
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jsfisher said:
Actually, no. "...that [=opinion] of any other poster."

ETA: I retract that. "...that [=the weight] of any other poster's [opinion]."

I'm glad that's out of the way.
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Or he could blue pencil out "that of". (As long as we're policing,....)

ETA: Re your ETA. No. Too strained.
 
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Foolmewunz said:
Or he could blue pencil out "that of". (As long as we're policing,....)
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I like your thinking! I like your apostrophe, too.

ETA: Regarding your ETA to my ETA, yeah, it is. Let's just stone him with indefinite antecedents.
 
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Foolmewunz said:
Flaccon,


Stop telling us what they won't do. Stop telling us what you're sure they can do. Start telling us what they will do.
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Or this... ↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑
 
flaccon said:
I am not trying to convince, reality should do that for itself.
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Do you seriously believe that understanding reality is so easy, so obvious, that it should be immediately apparent to any honest observer? If you do, you would be vastly ignorant of the history of human knowledge.
 
John Jones said:
Have you ever proven these spirit voices to anyone's satisfaction? If so, tell us something about them. They don't appear to be your clergy or physician.
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I wasn't really trying to prove his presence, I was seeking confirmation, then appropriate help.

Brother, ex army officer, 17 years served.
Mr Cederberg, 30 years experience (Private)
Mr Roberts, Truck driver. (+ two lady friends)
Daughter, temp supervisor.
Son, joint manager (Private hotel)
S. Freytis, retired convenient store owner.
Mr Bulger, retired hod carrier.
Mrs M.M, top London chef.

GP clearly explained in the letter of my "massive improvement of health"
and twice indicated that he was not familiar with, and is no expert of the supernatural. His departing words were "Keep the ball rolling" I will update the GP this week, with the steps I have taken so far.
 
flaccon said:
I wasn't really trying to prove his presence, I was seeking confirmation, then appropriate help.

Brother, ex army officer, 17 years served.
Mr Cederberg, 30 years experience (Private)
Mr Roberts, Truck driver. (+ two lady friends)
Daughter, temp supervisor.
Son, joint manager (Private hotel)
S. Freytis, retired convenient store owner.
Mr Bulger, retired hod carrier.
Mrs M.M, top London chef.

GP clearly explained in the letter of my "massive improvement of health"
and twice indicated that he was not familiar with, and is no expert of the supernatural. His departing words were "Keep the ball rolling" I will update the GP this week, with the steps I have taken so far.
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Witnesses mean nothing. Bring an overnight bag at the GP, just in case.
 
flaccon said:
Nice thought. Being selfish I would love this to be just mine.
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I've just finished reading this entire thread. My conclusions are:

1. You currently have no credible evidence of paranormal phenomena.

2. You have no interest in subjecting your claims to any rigorous, scientifically controlled test.

3. You're probably aware that your claims would fail any properly conducted test, which is why you won't participate in one.
 
Foolmewunz said:
In order to come up with such questions, though we need a better understanding, as I mentioned before, of just what properties these spirits have. Are the omniscient world-wise spirits? Or are they local Chester spirits from your private panoply and only know things local to the area? That makes it much harder, of course, for us to devise questions, but I'd imagine something can be worked out.

We also cannot use any question that you, the claimant, could obviously see the answer for, as the test assumes to prevent the claimant from providing the answers.

[snip for brevity]

Stop telling us what they won't do. Stop telling us what you're sure they can do. Start telling us what they will do.
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That really sums it up. We need to see evidence that the spirits aren't just you reporting what you imagine to hear in random noise, or what other people report imagining in random noise.

We now know the spirits won't (or can't) identify cards you can't see. What information are the spirits willing and able to provide, that is most likely unknown to you?
 
Paul2 said:
Do you seriously believe that understanding reality is so easy, so obvious, that it should be immediately apparent to any honest observer? If you do, you would be vastly ignorant of the history of human knowledge.
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I don't think I recall saying that understanding reality is easy. This is only immediately apparent to the observer who can recognise words being called out by a deceased family member. It is less apparent to the observer with no voice recognition. However, it is immediately apparent that voices are present, although it could be rogue frequency or Paredolia. There is no frequency that I am aware of, that I can liken, to this spirit-world noise that is being heard. Unless one has heard what a spirit world sounds like, one cannot begin to assimilate it to anything.

There are many things of this world and it's reality that I don't understand, and only when fully understood, will my take on reality alter.
 
flaccon said:
There are many things of this world and it's reality that I don't understand, and only when fully understood, will my take on reality alter.
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You are quite correct, here. It's reality that you don't understand.

Congratulations on your proper use of an apostrophe.
 
trustbutverify said:
I've just finished reading this entire thread. My conclusions are:

1. You currently have no credible evidence of paranormal phenomena.

2. You have no interest in subjecting your claims to any rigorous, scientifically controlled test.

3. You're probably aware that your claims would fail any properly conducted test, which is why you won't participate in one.
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As is the case with every paranormal claimer/beliver.
 
flaccon said:
I don't think I recall saying that understanding reality is easy. This is only immediately apparent to the observer who can recognise words being called out by a deceased family member. It is less apparent to the observer with no voice recognition. However, it is immediately apparent that voices are present, although it could be rogue frequency or Paredolia.
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I think I misunderstood you. My apologies.
flaccon said:
There is no frequency that I am aware of, that I can liken, to this spirit-world noise that is being heard. Unless one has heard what a spirit world sounds like, one cannot begin to assimilate it to anything.
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Good point, but it seems that you used no particular method to rule out that you are merely fooling yourself in imagining that you are really hearing spirits.

What other explanations have you ruled out, and how did you rule them out?
 
SezMe said:
Indeed. flaccon has not only herself to protect but she has also (apparently) convinced a number of others of her abilities so directly facing the evidence would be a major loss of faith face. And maybe friendships. She would also have to take down her web site. And, finally, she would have to admit to the huge waste of time she has spent on this.

There is no way either flaccon nor JREFers will come away from this with a whole new outlook on life.
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Sorry, my edit time has expired and that error is too misleading to leave on the table.
 
flaccon said:
This is only immediately apparent to the observer who can recognise words being called out by a deceased family member. It is less apparent to the observer with no voice recognition. However, it is immediately apparent that voices are present, although it could be rogue frequency or Paredolia.
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This is quite deceitful, flaccon. Throughout this thread you have repeatedly emphasized that the voices are clear and obvious. You have stated the spirits talk in complete sentences, as if it were a regular conversation. You have stated the voices (not sounds) are unmistakable. These are not my interpretation of your posts - these are all your stated and repeated assertions.

With this post, you have retracted your previous claims by adding caveats. By doing so, you only enhance other poster's concerns (and mine) that you are making this up as you go along. Or worse, that you are simply not serious about this effort to test your claims.

flaccon said:
It is less apparent to the observer with no voice recognition.
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Every single person in the world who was not born deaf has experience with voice recognition. What do you mean with this statement.
 
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