Kyusho/Tuite Application

[robbersdog]

A light, rapid touch to an artery does not significantly raise blood pressure.

How light? Your statement doesn't make sense without this being clarified.

 

[Phrost]

I volunteer to let this guy test his pressure point KOs on me. We have several "Throwdown" events around the country in which forum members get together and test their skills against each other to see what works, and what's BS.

Perhaps he'd like to show up to one and prove his abilities to skeptical martial artists.

Phrost
Site Director: Bullshido.com
Exposing BS in the Martial Arts

 

[Elio]

Greetings all !

I can see I'm not the only one in here who practice Muay Thai ...

Yes ! how light the blow needs to be ?

A+

Elio

 

[apoger]

The question of what constitutes a light touch is key.

Groundstrength whose claim initiated this topic, said that he would use aporximately the same striking strength at could be generated by a ten year old boy. I felt that in the context of head blows, this was clearly not paranormal.

There hasn't been much clarity offfered after this. Those who claim they can do "light touch" knock-outs seem extraordinarily reluctant to define what they mean.

This lack of clarity is common on these forums when attempting to determine precisely what people are claiming.

 

[GroundStrength]

I volunteer to let this guy test his pressure point KOs on me. We have several "Throwdown" events around the country in which forum members get together and test their skills against each other to see what works, and what's BS.

Perhaps he'd like to show up to one and prove his abilities to skeptical martial artists.

Phrost
Site Director: Bullshido.com
Exposing BS in the Martial Arts

I am in Houston, TX.

 

[Phrost]

Tell you what...

If you're willing, we can set up a Mixed Martial Arts match in which I'll be allowed to punch you in the face while you try to KO me by touching my arm.

This would be more realistic, considering those of your ilk claiming this sort of nonsense has an application in a self defense situation.

We can do this at a KC Hook N Shoot event.

www.KCHookNShoot.com

What do you think?

 

[Phrost]

Heck, there's a picture of me on the front page getting pounded on... with your special skills, that should be very easy for you to accomplish.

 

[Phrost]

*crickets*

 

[T'ai Chi]

Tell you what...

If you're willing, we can set up a Mixed Martial Arts match in which I'll be allowed to punch you in the face while you try to KO me by touching my arm.

This would be more realistic, considering those of your ilk claiming this sort of nonsense has an application in a self defense situation.

We can do this at a KC Hook N Shoot event.

www.KCHookNShoot.com

What do you think?

Can I come there and teach people how to relax?

 

[crimresearch]

Too late, everyone knows that an excess of Yang Chi, combined with a cranial obstruction of the root chakra causes people to issue internet challenges to 'real' combat...

The only lasting cure would be an ego transplant

Paul

 

[GroundStrength]

Phrost,

Stop it your scaring the children (but not me).

Tuite/kyusho is used for low-level threat altercations. I don't teach this stuff anymore as I now study xingyiquan (a chinese internal martial art). Also you don't know what my ilk is, so you might want to find out before shooting your mouth off fuck3r.


Have a nice day,
Scott

 

[apoger]

so you might want to find out before shooting your mouth off fuck3r.

It would appear that the discipline of martial arts has endowed you with great serenity.

 

[GroundStrength]

It would appear that the discipline of martial arts has endowed you with great serenity.

No that's my four children.

and I did say have a nice day

 

[Phrost]

Phrost,

Stop it your scaring the children (but not me).

Tuite/kyusho is used for low-level threat altercations. I don't teach this stuff anymore as I now study xingyiquan (a chinese internal martial art). Also you don't know what my ilk is, so you might want to find out before shooting your mouth off fuck3r.


Have a nice day,
Scott

I never had an intent to scare anyone, children, or 'internal' martial artists alike.

Who's shooting off his mouth here? I offered to provide you a legal, realistic medium for you to prove your claim against a resisting opponent. What does your 'ilk' have to do with anything?

"Tuite/kyusho is used for low-level threat altercations."

You need to qualify this statement with a definition of what constitutes a 'low level threat'. It's a purely subjective term. To me, a 'low level threat' is anything from a toddler angry about dropping his ice cream, to an 'internal martial artist' who thinks he can knock me out by touching my arm.

Since I'm sure you don't (or didn't) teach your students skills used to defend themselves from children, I'd like to give you the opportunity to explain what you mean by a 'low level threat' for which you'd use your vulcan arm pinch ability.

 

[robbersdog]

Tell you what...

If you're willing, we can set up a Mixed Martial Arts match in which I'll be allowed to punch you in the face while you try to KO me by touching my arm.

This would be more realistic, considering those of your ilk claiming this sort of nonsense has an application in a self defense situation.

We can do this at a KC Hook N Shoot event.

www.KCHookNShoot.com

What do you think?

Cute though this post is, it is entirely irrelevent. GroundStrengths claim was to be able to carry out a light touch knock-out. That's all he would have to do to win the million. Why on earth would he want to be punched whilst doing this? This is merely bending the rules to try to create a straw man. Even if the technique would only work if the other person allowed it to happen, it wouldn't diminish the claim.

If you have a problem with the million dollar challenge, let's discuss it. If you have a problem with martial arts, might I suggest a martial arts forum might be a tad more relevent?

I'm sure you're big and hard an' all, but you might have noticed that you can't hit me over the internet, so lets get away from the aggression. If you have something useful to say, lets hear it.

 

[GroundStrength]

I never had an intent to scare anyone, children, or 'internal' martial artists alike.

Okay

Who's shooting off his mouth here? I offered to provide you a legal, realistic medium for you to prove your claim against a resisting opponent.

No you made an classic 'internet challenge'. We can either have a 'real' match (both of us fighting) or you can try to hit me in the face while I apply a wrist lock that uses the points, while you resist. However, having a match is not part of the scientific study of whether the method works it would just be fun.

What does your 'ilk' have to do with anything?

Don't know but you brought it up. I don't support what most of these guys say about chi and no-touches but I know that the concept of attacking points and nerves in a specific way will cause the effects desired.

"Tuite/kyusho is used for low-level threat altercations."

You need to qualify this statement with a definition of what constitutes a 'low level threat'. It's a purely subjective term. To me, a 'low level threat' is anything from a toddler angry about dropping his ice cream, to an 'internal martial artist' who thinks he can knock me out by touching my arm.

Since I'm sure you don't (or didn't) teach your students skills used to defend themselves from children, I'd like to give you the opportunity to explain what you mean by a 'low level threat' for which you'd use your vulcan arm pinch ability.

Working the door. Control techinques. Being grabbed or pushed but not for rolling around sweating half-naked on the floor with other men(not that there's anything wrong with that).

 

[Phrost]

No you made an classic 'internet challenge'. We can either have a 'real' match (both of us fighting) or you can try to hit me in the face while I apply a wrist lock that uses the points, while you resist. However, having a match is not part of the scientific study of whether the method works it would just be fun.

Who said I was trying to work within the scientific method? Perhaps I just wanted to pound on you.

Don't know but you brought it up. I don't support what most of these guys say about chi and no-touches but I know that the concept of attacking points and nerves in a specific way will cause the effects desired.

And what exactly is paranormal about pain compliance techniques and cutting off the bloodflow to your brain? Of course if I cram my knuckle into the niche behind your ear and jaw it will hurt. The same goes for chokes.

How does this qualify as proof of something paranormal?

Working the door. Control techinques. Being grabbed or pushed but not for rolling around sweating half-naked on the floor with other men(not that there's anything wrong with that).

Again, nothing supernatural here. If you bend something the wrong way, it hurts. BFD. How much did you charge people to learn this?

In case you've forgotten, this is your claim:

Claimed Abilty:
I state for the record that by using the TCM (traditional chinese medicine) model for point selection I can render a person unconscious through the combination of tuite jutsu(pressure point grappling) and kyusho jutsu(pressure point striking). The attempted KO will use minimal force on both the grappling and striking components.

Demonstration:
Using the TCM model for point selection, points will be selected that follow the model for best effect. Then I will place the subject(s) in a grappling technique (using the pre-selected points) and then a light-force strike will be issued to the final point(s). The subject should lost consciousness and fall into the arms of two (2) catchers behind him.

This has nothing to do with the JREF anymore. This is about Bullshido, selling people garbage and claiming it will keep them safe in dangerous situations.

Your test requires a compliant person who allows himself to be placed in a position which would be at the very least, difficult to obtain in a realistic situation. Unfortunately for you, fighting doesn't work that way.

The only way you could structure a test to prove your skills have a practical application would be to attempt to apply them on a variety of opponents who are actively trying to resist you.

Again, if you would like to prove that your claims aren't Bullshido, I have given you an option to do so.

Considering Austin is about a 3-4 hour drive from Houston, perhaps you'd like to show up to one of our Throwdown events there, and prove your abilities.

http://bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8991

Here's a link to the discussion.

 

[T'ai Chi]

No you made an classic 'internet challenge'. We can either have a 'real' match (both of us fighting) or you can try to hit me in the face while I apply a wrist lock that uses the points, while you resist. However, having a match is not part of the scientific study of whether the method works it would just be fun.

GroundStrength is interested in applying his skills in the challenge, not in any other arena from what I can tell. Phrost's challenge is interesting, but wholly irrelevant to scientifically testing GS's skill.

 

[Phrost]

Cute though this post is, it is entirely irrelevent. GroundStrengths claim was to be able to carry out a light touch knock-out. That's all he would have to do to win the million. Why on earth would he want to be punched whilst doing this? This is merely bending the rules to try to create a straw man. Even if the technique would only work if the other person allowed it to happen, it wouldn't diminish the claim.

If you have a problem with the million dollar challenge, let's discuss it. If you have a problem with martial arts, might I suggest a martial arts forum might be a tad more relevent?

I'm sure you're big and hard an' all, but you might have noticed that you can't hit me over the internet, so lets get away from the aggression. If you have something useful to say, lets hear it.

You mean a martial arts forum like Bullshido?

http://bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10837

If this individual, and those like him were actually willing to discuss their claims in an environment that would subject them to critical review by their actual peers, as opposed to a group that is generally ignorant of the fraud and garbage the martial arts is plagued with, I would do so.

Useful? You mean as if working to prevent people from, at the very least, wasting their money on martial arts training that is ineffective in a real situation?

 

[Phrost]

GroundStrength is interested in applying his skills in the challenge, not in any other arena from what I can tell. Phrost's challenge is interesting, but wholly irrelevant to scientifically testing GS's skill. [/B]

Of course he's not interested in proving his claims can be applied to a realistic situation; it's much easier to dupe a bunch of people ignorant of real martial arts.

Heck, Randi himself was taken in by SCARS, a well known martial art that's chock-full of pseudoscience and impractical/unrealistic techniques that are as unproven as this guy's claims.