Juan williams fired from NPR

[Brainster]

Well, it looks like the liberals at NPR learned the wrong lesson from the Sherrod fiasco. Is there some sort of context that Williams made his remarks in that would make them not racist? Well, yeah:

In a debate with Bill O’Reilly I revealed my fears to set up the case for not making rash judgments about people of any faith. I pointed out that the Atlanta Olympic bomber -- as well as Timothy McVeigh and the people who protest against gay rights at military funerals -- are Christians but we journalists don’t identify them by their religion.

Yep, Williams himself made the exact same point as the buffoonish OP. But wait, there's more:

And I made it clear that all Americans have to be careful not to let fears lead to the violation of anyone’s constitutional rights, be it to build a mosque, carry the Koran or drive a New York cab without the fear of having your throat slashed. Bill and I argued after I said he has to take care in the way he talks about the 9/11 attacks so as not to provoke bigotry.

But let's face it, the dolts who are calling Juan Williams a bigot are not doing so because of what he said, but where he said it.

 

[Puppycow]

Let me ask again since it has not been answered:

Would it be bigotry if a woman was walking home at night and looked back to see a large man walking behind her and she felt scared?

 

[Snide]

Oh? That's a novel definition. Websters says:

a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

So the traditional meaning of the word is how you think, not just how you act.

Then it's not bigotry to feel worried about seeing muslims on a plane, but for a different reason from what Puppycow gave.

 

[Thunder]

when I see Jews on a plane, part of me worries that they will talk me out of my wallet.

is the above a bigoted statement?

 

[Snide]

Let me ask again since it has not been answered:

Would it be bigotry if a woman was walking home at night and looked back to see a large man walking behind her and she felt scared?

No, because that's not hatred or intolerance.

It IS prejudice and perhaps stereotyping, but prejudice and stereotyping != bad.

 

[GreNME]

^^this
If I am on a college campus, black, brow, yellow or green kids in baggy pants with their drawers showing are not going to bother me.
If I pull in to an all-night gas station in North Ft Worth at 2:00 Am, they will make me nervous--possibly to the point of going elsewhere for my snickers bar and gas. Is that bigotry? Nope--it is called "Situational Awareness"

Actually, that is bigotry, and pretty textbook at that.

Listen, my house is in southern Dallas-- good luck finding a gas station at 2 AM where there aren't some kids with baggy pants and darker skin. What you describe isn't situational awareness, it's just prejudicial blaming of an entire group for actions not representative of the group. What you're calling situational awareness is based on ignorance and paranoid assumption... pretty much core components of bigotry.

 

[Snide]

when I see Jews on a plane, part of me worries that they will talk me out of my wallet.

is the above a bigoted statement?

I would think so, because I can't imagine any reason to be nervous of that without some hatred or intolerance existing.

 

[Unabogie]

Well, it looks like the liberals at NPR learned the wrong lesson from the Sherrod fiasco.

Which is what, Andrew Breitbart is a liar?

But let's face it, the dolts who are calling Juan Williams a bigot are not doing so because of what he said, but where he said it.

Except he said:

Yesterday NPR fired me for telling the truth. The truth is that I worry when I am getting on an airplane and see people dressed in garb that identifies them first and foremost as Muslims.

This is not a bigoted statement. It is a statement of my feelings, my fears after the terrorist attacks of 9/11 by radical Muslims.

Which is, you know, bigoted, which I've shown by substituting just about any other race or creed. Funny how that works. Sheesh, Nazi re-enactors, Paladino's racist emails, nothing penetrates. Nothing is actually bigoted even though it's right there in your face.

 

[Unabogie]

Hey gotta run. Don't think I'm refusing to answer anyone. I'll be back tomorrow.

 

[Puppycow]

Oh? That's a novel definition. Websters says:



So the traditional meaning of the word is how you think, not just how you act.

Wait, "hatred and intolerance" are not synonyms for "fear."

 

[thaiboxerken]

Maybe they fired him for being stupid. Because only a stupid person would think that terrorists would diguise themselves as the "terrorist stereotype" that people on Fox News think of.

 

[Snide]

Maybe they fired him for being stupid. Because only a stupid person would think that terrorists would diguise themselves as the "terrorist stereotype" that people on Fox News think of.

That's kinda where I'm coming from. Ignorant and doofish, sure. Just not bigoted.

 

[Puppycow]

Then it's not bigotry to feel worried about seeing muslims on a plane, but for a different reason from what Puppycow gave.

No, because that's not hatred or intolerance.

It IS prejudice and perhaps stereotyping, but prejudice and stereotyping != bad.

Good points.

 

[thaiboxerken]

This could also be a last straw in quite a few discrepencies.

 

[Piggy]

http://www.thinkprogress.org/2010/10/19/williams-oreilly-muslims/

Well, what I can say is that this is a pretty stupid statement on Williams's part.

I see people in "muslim garb" fairly frequently, even just yesterday in the Wal-Mart at the town nearby me in Georgia. And certainly when I go into the Big City or fly on a plane.

But first of all, the odds that they're terrorists are no better than the odds that, say, some redneck next to me is a "patriot" nutjob who intends to shoot up the place -- pretty darn small.

And as a reporter, Williams should know that Islamic terrorist groups are not sending people "in Muslim garb" to carry out missions in non-Muslim countries.

I'm really quite surprised, saddened, and disappointed in Mr. Williams.

Does he deserve to be fired? Well, NPR is certainly free to fire any correspondent they want to fire if they believe their audience doesn't, or won't, like him. So I can't fault them for it. Just a business decision.

 

[Alferd_Packer]

Slightly OT, but here is another example of the "I'm not a racist, but . . " type comment

It's a letter to the editor of the North West Florida Daily News

http://www.nwfdailynews.com/opinion/obama-34046-chuckled-detest.html

 

[Puppycow]

Maybe they fired him for being stupid. Because only a stupid person would think that terrorists would diguise themselves as the "terrorist stereotype" that people on Fox News think of.

That's kinda where I'm coming from. Ignorant and doofish, sure. Just not bigoted.

I do agree with this. A terrorist, unless he was stupid, would probably dress in anything but traditional muslim garb. And I also think that NPR has every right to fire him. Because, while not bigotry, his comments were insensitive. Williams just got a new $2 million contract from Fox, so he's laughing all the way to the bank anyway.

 

[thaiboxerken]

2 million dollar contract to work for Fox. This just confirms that he's a bigot.

 

[Just thinking]

Even Whoopi is on Juan's side.

This I find interesting.

Whether one agrees with Whoopie isn't the point, as is what I see as a blatant hypocrisy. When Bill O'Reilly said on the View that Muslims attacked us on 9/11, it was simply a fact. Of course he didn't mean all Muslims are terrorists --- anyone with 2 or more working brain cells knew that --- but that didn't matter. To many that was clearly going to be how they wanted his words to be interpreted, end of story. Now, with Juan --- whom Whoopie is defending --- it seems we have a very similar view, in that the appearance of observed Muslims boarding a plane gives him pause to be concerned. For this concern to be real, it seems to me that one must view all identifiable Muslims as potential threats, at least on planes.

So why is Bill's comment --- factually correct --- so repugnant to her while only days later Juan's comment is highly defensible?

 

[Just thinking]

Didn't realize this thread was here, but I posted in politics:

Not bigoted?

Oops, no he actually said:

Hmm, that's not it.

Nope...now what was it?

Still not there...

Ah yes, he's right. When it's about Muslims, it's totally not bigoted.

I believe your analogies fail on the basis of relevancy. If you take each case and apply the context under which each tragedy occurred --- not simply applying them all to airplanes --- you may be surprised to find many people would have trepidations under similar circumstances within reasonable time frames.