John Edward - psychic or what?

[Foolmewunz]

Please refer to this quotation which was the basis of the argument:



Your recollection, per the standards being argued, is 100% Since you think that "post #8" (actually #9) was informative, I can see what motivated this bizarre angle in the vein of the italicized portion above:



Indeed, this confirms their point.

At this point since everyone commenting, including myself, and the authors of those "substantiating articles" all seem to recall exactly how they learned of the 9/11 attacks just as it's argued we're now supposed to be oblivious to, I call the issue moot.

I will however admit I do not recall what color Jodi's shirt was, nor whether it was Jodi who was the first one who said "What!"

This closes my comments toward anything other than the fraudulent activities of John Edwards.

You don't get it, do you? 50% of their stories (not 50% of the persons but 50% of the details) had changed. What do you guess didn't change? Maybe things like where they were and whether they heard it on television, from a co-worker, or were actually witnesses to the events. I contend that the 50% of the details that changed are the things like those I mentioned. Who said what, who was with them when they heard or saw things, etc... Those are the details that make eyewitness testimony so shaky in court.

 

[Resume]

At this point since everyone commenting, including myself, and the authors of those "substantiating articles" all seem to recall exactly how they learned of the 9/11 attacks just as it's argued we're now supposed to be oblivious to, I call the issue moot.

Well of course you do. You haven't done a single thing to indicate you understand the issue.

As kerikiwi and Foolmewunz and AdMan and malicus have pointed out.

 

[Robin1]

My hubby's sister from Colorado called me to find out if my husband who works in NYC was OK the morning of 9-11. That is how I found out what was happening...was feeding my son a bottle at the time. I called my husband and told him to get out of the city asap as I turned on the tv and saw the news coverage. Sat at the kitchen table with my 9 month old son and watched the coverage. Made calls to my Dad who was in NYC with his car...he then attempted to contact and arrange to meet my husband and other sister-in-law to get them out of the city. My husband had already been able to get a cab out but my Dad brought my sister in law home. There are specific things I cannot remember such as exact times or even the color shirt I was wearing. I recognize that I cannot recall some specifics but I also recognize that my inability to recall some of the other stuff does not invalidate the major points of my 9-11 story that I do and always will remember.

On a different note, it was Remie who opened this thread and I think Remie should be the one to close it. Remie, please share your current thoughts on whether you believe John Edward may be real or definitely not. Thanx!

 

[Resume]

I recognize that I cannot recall some specifics but I also recognize that my inability to recall some of the other stuff does not invalidate the major points of my 9-11 story that I do and always will remember.

I wonder how many different ways there are to misunderstand the point.

 

[John Jones]

I wonder how many different ways there are to misunderstand the point.

I was wondering the same thing. It's as if someone claimed that most people walk around in a state of amnesia.

I remember a lot of details from Sept 11, 2001, but I wouldn't be a bit surprised if it turned-out that I remembered wrong.

 

[Garrette]

My hubby's sister from Colorado called me to find out if my husband who works in NYC was OK the morning of 9-11. That is how I found out what was happening...was feeding my son a bottle at the time. I called my husband and told him to get out of the city asap as I turned on the tv and saw the news coverage. Sat at the kitchen table with my 9 month old son and watched the coverage. Made calls to my Dad who was in NYC with his car...he then attempted to contact and arrange to meet my husband and other sister-in-law to get them out of the city. My husband had already been able to get a cab out but my Dad brought my sister in law home. There are specific things I cannot remember such as exact times or even the color shirt I was wearing. I recognize that I cannot recall some specifics but I also recognize that my inability to recall some of the other stuff does not invalidate the major points of my 9-11 story that I do and always will remember.

On a different note, it was Remie who opened this thread and I think Remie should be the one to close it. Remie, please share your current thoughts on whether you believe John Edward may be real or definitely not. Thanx!

The point may be a bit more clear if we bring it back to your original point about proof of JE.

You have yet to respond to the differing descriptions of your JE experience that you wrote on your own blog. For instance, you have repeatedly insisted that JE spoke directly to you, yet a blog post states it was directed to a group of four people. There is a similar discrepancy regarding the man with the tooth.

These differences are not our doing; they are your own words on your own blog written at your own leisure when you had time to reflect. The general idea is the same: you saw JE, and he impressed you, yet the details make all the difference.

Clearer now?

 

[kerikiwi]

... There are specific things I cannot remember such as exact times or even the color shirt I was wearing. I recognize that I cannot recall some specifics but I also recognize that my inability to recall some of the other stuff does not invalidate the major points of my 9-11 story that I do and always will remember.

If you do not remember certain things, then those certain things are not part of your memory.
It is the actual memory which can be at fault, the details of the memory.
You say you do, and always will remember. Firstly, the point is that you may not be remembering accurately, no matter how convinced you are.
Secondly, you cannot know that you always will remember. Once you stop remembering, ie forget, you will have no memory of what it is you have stopped remembering.

 

[Robin1]

The point may be a bit more clear if we bring it back to your original point about proof of JE.

You have yet to respond to the differing descriptions of your JE experience that you wrote on your own blog. For instance, you have repeatedly insisted that JE spoke directly to you, yet a blog post states it was directed to a group of four people. There is a similar discrepancy regarding the man with the tooth.

These differences are not our doing; they are your own words on your own blog written at your own leisure when you had time to reflect. The general idea is the same: you saw JE, and he impressed you, yet the details make all the difference.

Clearer now?

Garrette, remember when I started my own thread and I stated that you need to read my blog AND ALL the comments to get the full picture? I even stated that more than once. So I do get that the details can make all the difference when evaluating the validity of a medium. If you go back and read the comments on my blog you will see that I explained that John knew he was with someone in my group of 4 and then after he gave some info I said I didn't know but maybe could be me. Then John hesitated and asked me if I just bought a new refrigerator. That was directed at me only. As a validation that yes indeed the reading was for me. You are not remembering the comment correctly. You are also not remembering the comment about the tooth guy correctly either. I did not say John directed that at him directly rather I said that John asked if someone on my side of the room had a big tooth in their pocket. And remember that was only validated by chance after the event. You have referenced my comments incorrectly before as well (can't remember exactly) and I am too lazy to go back and look. I really think there is not much else I could say here that would make a difference. So it's kinda a waste of time for both of us. I really am only waiting here now hoping that Remie will give us a current update as to whether she now believes John may be real. Or not. Dying to know! : )

 

[John Jones]

Garrette, remember when I started my own thread and I stated that you need to read my blog AND ALL the comments to get the full picture?

The one where you claimed proof of life after death, but never provide such proof? I think I remember that one.

Where is that proof anyway?

 

[Resume]

The one where you claimed proof of life after death, but never provide such proof? I think I remember that one.

Where is that proof anyway?

There's a whole burden of proof/comprehension thing going on in this thread lately. It's really annoying.

 

[tsig]

I didn't make it to the end of the thread, so I apologise if someone's already suggested this or if my suggestions have already been rendered impossible, but here are my thoughts"

A cold method: JE starts off with a name.. it could go anywhere at this point -- if he gets a Joshua, then fine, maybe he goes straight into a routine with that person's relatives. In this case, perhaps a combination of (a) the look of affirmation/recognition from Liam at Remie's table, (b) the look of bewilderment from other table members who have met Liam under the name "Liam" once he stands up [which seems to just be Remie.. did you react much, Remie? Did other people at the table react to Liam standing up?], and (c) JE's cold reading skills lead him to quickly notice someone semi-reluctantly acknowledging their name to be Joshua and standing up leaving their table partners looking bewildered. It is then pretty likely that Joshua didn't introduce himself that way to them. The most probable explanation for *that*, by far, is that they go by their middle name.

This theory relies on JE being pretty good at what he does, and probably seems easier in hindsight than it would be on the spot, but hey.. that's his job.

A hot method: Before and during the show, JE has people running plate numbers from vehicles in the carpark and cross-referencing details with some other info databases. I don't know how easy this is for non-LEOs in the states (I assume this is USA?). If you find that a car is registered to Joshua Liam Surname, and then you search some other (more open) national database and find a record with "Preferred Name: Liam", you've got a pretty sweet hot read to perform later.

This theory relies on some possibly not-entirely-legal behaviour if it's about running plate numbers.. but there are probably legal alternatives, depending on where else Liam has shared his personal information, what stickers he might have on his car, etc. etc.


Disclaimer: I don't know what I'm talking about and I've skipped most of the thread.

Extraordinary wisdom in one so young.

 

[tsig]

Okay Robin to start with I may have already stated as a teenager in the 70's I did attend a Silva Mind Control seminar. I didn't take it too seriously, only went because my parents made me, and rarely if ever practice any of the meditation techniques taught- though in one instance I will describe I did employ a rudimentary version of it.
Over the years my position has evolved to believing most paranormal is bogus, but we may have telepathy between humans as a simple tool- and it's vague and evasive-unless you can recognize it.

Okay, first example. About 10 years ago, there was a woman I was hanging around with, we were platonic friends but we were getting a little closer than that, but she had a boyfriend. We both felt we had a "connection" with each other.
One night she was leaving to go home, I felt that was an opportunity to get intimate that night. We had not previously discussed whether I wanted her to stay or go, she simply said okay till next time, I said goodbye and she walked out the door.
I didn't want her to go, and figured I'd play a little trick on her. I did a quick relaxation technique, to go into what Silva called "alpha" with a 10-1 count, slowed my breathing and heart rate considerably, and willed myself to project the thought:

"Jody. Come back..." I thought this three times and opened my eyes.

About 10 seconds later the door burst open and she looked at me with wide eyes and said, "WHAT?"

I said "did you hear me calling you?"

She said "Yes".

I said "But I didn't speak. and where were you? "

She said she had walked down the hall and out to the sidewalk, a good 150 feet by the time she "heard" me.

The incident ended with her saying "You **********!" with a smile. And no I didn't get laid.

That is the Gospel truth. Not a word came from my mouth.

Next example in a moment.

You made it up?

 

[tsig]

Batvette, you took a chance and should be treated with respect by others even if they disagree. That being said, I am going to follow your brave lead...and I know that means goin' down with the ship! But here goes nothin ( and I know that will be repeated in the responses). I had a dream which showed me some unimportant but unique event in a friend's life which turned out to be true. My friend couldn't believe I knew it (even though it was insignificant). I asked my dad how it is possible I knew that information and in another dream he told me that spirits can "impress" ideas upon people( but free will remains). So about a week later I am in a McDonalds's drive thru alone about to order dinner for me , my kids, and 2 friends who are visiting. As I am waiting in line I am having a conversation within myself about how I would love to have a big mac. Weight always being a problem with me I am having an internal debate as to whether I should just order the big mac and enjoy it and start my diet tomorrow. I decide to forget it and just order a cheeseburger for myself cause that diet should really be started ASAP ! I order food for 6 people...no big mac in the list. I get home open up the bag and everything I ordered is exactly what I ordered and the receipt matches it ( I saved the receipt) BUT there is one extra in the bag that I never ordered and was never charged for...a Big Mac.
And here's another one:
A few months later I am on a cruise with family...I had lost a lot of weight in anticipation of the cruise and was going to try not to gain it all back on the cruise. And so when I had a drink I tried to minimize the calories and would only drink vodka and seltzer with a splash of cranberry. On about the 5th day of the cruise we were in a big room waiting for a bingo game to start . I went up to the bar and for the first time on the cruise thought to myself I really want a pina coloda! But that is way too many calories. The bartender was helping someone else and I had another internal tug of war.. just get the pina coloda..then i thought no you worked so hard to lose weight get a drink with lesser calories. The bartender arrived and I ordered my usual vodka and seltzer with a splash of cranberry juice. After that, bingo is about to start but they make an announcement that they are going to use all the names (over 150) that purchased bingo cards and have a drawing to give away..of all things... a pina coloda...so who do you think won that pina coloda! At what point do coincidences become more than coincidences...and I know for some the answer is never. I have so many other "anecdotes" some too special to share ( and yes True That there was a Sixth Sense moment at that John Edward event..too personal and meaningful to share and have people attempt to discredit it) I do truly believe the only thing that matters in the end is being as kind as you can be. Whether you believe in God or not.

God is rigging bingo games so you can get a pina colada?

 

[tsig]

Your bitter contempt is not necessary, there are many people out there who honestly would like to find the truth about this, and do not pursue this as a vehicle for fraud and opportunism against the weak of mind.
I feel no need to make "pathetic excuses" for anyone's benefit, nor should I apologize for not meeting anyone's demands. If I was claiming I could inject thoughts in anyone's mind at any time you might have an argument there but that is not the case here.

I don't believe the "stress level" of the lab is nearly the total of all the barriers that may be present. What if it were a tool which only worked between specific and rare individuals- and only when they were on a certain level of well being (example, the pseudoscience of biorythms) and even then only when the subconscious detected an actual need for this to happen- as I offered with the analogy of superhuman strength in an emergency.

These are not "pathetic excuses" but possible factors any person with an open mind might choose to consider may come into play in a search for an elusive phenomenon.

If one has made up their mind that they don't want to ever isolate and identify such a phenomenon that is hardly a position to envy. You are free to disbelieve as you will, but since you cannot prove a null the question may never be answered. Exposing charlatans such as Edwards is one thing. Unlocking the potential of human physiology is another and hardly something to treat with such disdain.

Right, and when you get it unlocked please tell us.

 

[Resume]

God is rigging bingo games so you can get a pina colada?

Yeah, but he's a bastard arranging for her to win that calorific treat.

 

[tsig]

I'd admit to the possibility of either, but state I analyzed the event at the time, and have a poor memory for faces and names but near photographic memory for events and situations. This was about 10 years ago? I remember it like yesterday.
What you're asking is for me to admit the possibility I've twisted the facts to validate my beliefs and on that I am quite certain I have not. This event was pretty simple, what I did was spontaneous but quite intentional.
This (belief in one paranormal phenomenon) is not a religion for me, I don't need it in my life. I don't believe in ghosts or witchcraft, or eternal life as promised by the Christian religions. I don't go to casinos and try to read peoples' minds to win poker hands.
I do think a certain level of faith is involved here. If anything perhaps I should disbelieve the whole thing.



I didn't get laid that night or ever with her.

Can I say one thing, for anyone who wants to visualize this: Remember that episode of original Star Trek, with that guy "Charlie" who had abilities of telepathy to the point where he killed a couple of crew members (did they have red shirts? haha) and whenever he did something, he'd screw his face up with rage and intent, and his skin would get all red, projecting his power....

that is exactly the opposite of how it would happen. so you can see the dilemma of how difficult it might be to both become fully relaxed, and disassociate your mind from your body and all your senses AND intellectual thought processes... while at the same time trying to project a thought outward.

(which may even be useful for anyone wanting to project a thought at me to shut the hell up)

Let's see, believe your story or believe that science is wrong.

Y'know I'm not ready to throw out a a procedure that has worked well for 200 years over an unsupported anecdote on the internet.

 

[tsig]

This is something that I initially found hard to believe - that every time we remember something (let alone recount that memory to someone else) we essentially take it out of storage, change it a bit, and then put it back into storage with those changes incorporated. The more I've read about the subject the more I've had to accept that my memory of past events is nowhere near as reliable as I'd previously assumed.

Yes, we tend to make ourselves the hero of our stories.

 

[tsig]

Garrette, could love ever be proven to be real? Do you believe in love? Do you love your kids? Prove it.

What's love got to do with it?

http://search.yahoo.com/r/_ylt=A0oG.../**http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCBttS_y7lE

 

[tsig]

Maybe.

But can you find Rhode Island on a map?

No and I've never been convicted of murder on eyewitness testimony.

 

[tsig]

The claim was where people were and what they were doing when they heard about 9/11. He states that with no doubt to its accuracy. He then surrounds it with vague hints of doubt to support the premise of his article while not having to actually include himself in the percentage of people who made up or forgot ****. A group you don't seem to want to include yourself in either. I've explained this over and over, okay?

Your argument is complete baloney, arguing I cannot recall a simple event. The way I told it is the way it went down. End of story.

OK, I accept your story as true, how does it say anything about telepathy?