Jogging in Georgia while black.

[JoeMorgue]

That's the glory of pro-guilt fan fiction. The person is always in the right in the alternative universe where he acted a different way.

If Arbery had ran faster you can bet your mortgage Thermal would be on page 4 of defending a hill where he should have run into the grass.

 

[Belz...]

You've been quite critical of others making leaps of logic here, but your repeated assertion that Arbery was somehow trying to stick it to these CHUDs deliberately is one hell of a whopper.

Hey, Occam's on his side now, so he can fill those blanks with anything he wants.

 

[dirtywick]

Arbery could have run through the yards to get off the street, and then he would have been shot for trespassing and the same people would be excusing it here, saying, "He should have just stayed on the public streets."

Indeed, it’s already been pointed out that hanging around a construction site is pretty suspicious.

 

[ponderingturtle]

Indeed, it’s already been pointed out that hanging around a construction site is pretty suspicious.

And at the same time totally normal and expected behavior. But clearly anyone in this thread who did that should be shot on principle for being suspicious.

 

[Thermal]

You've been quite critical of others making leaps of logic here, but your repeated assertion that Arbery was somehow trying to stick it to these CHUDs deliberately is one hell of a whopper.

No, you are screwing up in the same way the others are. I'm suggesting a way to interpret The Chase, based on what I see. I think it fits the facts better.

Others are making the unfounded assumptions and bald claims, such as that he was exhausted from running for his life. That's an assumption, and I don't think it holds up well, based on the time v distance covered.

I can think of a lot of more plausible explanations why someone being menaced in public might stick to public roads and not sprint off to a secluded area, and "toying" with his pursuers strikes me as especially implausible.

Perhaps Arbery thought he would be safer if he stayed in the public eye, perhaps he thought his pursuers would leave him alone if he continued his jog and ignored them, perhaps he thought others would see the situation and intervene on his behalf. Perhaps he thought the police may be on there way and hopefully defuse the situation.

All these explanations strike me as much more plausible than the idea that he was slowly jogging around "their turf" as some display of dominance. That somehow, the unarmed jogger being pursued by two separate chase vehicles that were steadily escalating the violence felt that he was in control of the situation, strikes me as patently absurd.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, the unspoken assumption by a lot of posters here is that he had to be meek and fearful. Not my starting assumption, especially considering his final run at Travis.

The funny part is, I'm not the slightest bit surprised that many here find it impossible that Arbery was courageous in the face of The Chase. I see no reason why he wouldn't be, especially if he didn't yet know they were armed and as dangerous as they turned out to be.

We know how the story ended, so you are assuming that he knew that ending at the time and acted accordingly. That's a bad assumption. At the time, Arbery had no reason to think this was anything but some fat rednecks flexing on him. And as I have argued, I have no reason to think he was so cowed.

 

[Belz...]

No, you are screwing up in the same way the others are.

Everybody is wrong except you!

 

[Thermal]

You have got to be kidding me.



Did you wake up with a wiped memory, or something? I repeat: finding one human that can do X does not support a claim that "humans do X all the time", for example. Your claim wasn't that "there are very few people who can do it in 4", but "actual runners can do it in 4 ergo the victim was not seriously running away". Not only is the claim wrong, the inferrence is nonsense.

Those extrapolations are only in your head; I don't say or "infer" them. The problem is your antenna.

But again: I retracted quickly and happily substituted 5 or six minutes to make the nitpickers happy. Done and done. So why are you still banging on about it?

 

[Thermal]

Said every woo proponent ever.

No, there are exactly as many blanks in the facts regardless of who's theorising. Sheesh, you've basically been broken rhetorically because of a simple failure to adjust a silly claim.

As pointed out to you repeatedly...Jesus Christ repeatedly....i adjusted right away. Why do you keel pretending otherwise? Pretty cheap.

It says a lot about you.

Yeah, and if you could expand your contributions beyond ad homes and other personal attacks on yours truly, that'd be great.

 

[Thermal]

Arbery could have run through the yards to get off the street, and then he would have been shot for trespassing and the same people would be excusing it here, saying, "He should have just stayed on the public streets."

I just love these hackneyed stereotypes y'all slip in. You don't even know you're doing it, do you?

You are quite literally assuming theorized randoms on the street of also being murderers. All those Southerners are the same, amirite?

 

[TurkeysGhost]

No, you are screwing up in the same way the others are. I'm suggesting a way to interpret The Chase, based on what I see. I think it fits the facts better.

Others are making the unfounded assumptions and bald claims, such as that he was exhausted from running for his life. That's an assumption, and I don't think it holds up well, based on the time v distance covered.

I can think of a lot of more plausible explanations why someone being menaced in public might stick to public roads and not sprint off to a secluded area, and "toying" with his pursuers strikes me as especially implausible.

Perhaps Arbery thought he would be safer if he stayed in the public eye, perhaps he thought his pursuers would leave him alone if he continued his jog and ignored them, perhaps he thought others would see the situation and intervene on his behalf. Perhaps he thought the police may be on there way and hopefully defuse the situation.

All these explanations strike me as much more plausible than the idea that he was slowly jogging around "their turf" as some display of dominance. That somehow, the unarmed jogger being pursued by two separate chase vehicles that were steadily escalating the violence felt that he was in control of the situation, strikes me as patently absurd.

Yeah, the unspoken assumption by a lot of posters here is that he had to be meek and fearful. Not my starting assumption, especially considering his final run at Travis.

The funny part is, I'm not the slightest bit surprised that many here find it impossible that Arbery was courageous in the face of The Chase. I see no reason why he wouldn't be, especially if he didn't yet know they were armed and as dangerous as they turned out to be.

We know how the story ended, so you are assuming that he knew that ending at the time and acted accordingly. That's a bad assumption. At the time, Arbery had no reason to think this was anything but some fat rednecks flexing on him. And as I have argued, I have no reason to think he was so cowed.[/QUOTE]

People generally find being stalked unnerving, and they certainly would understand that they were in danger after the chase escalated to the point of being hit by a truck in an effort to forcibly detain him.

The initial confrontation may have been thought of as simply a rude intrusion, but it's beggars belief that Arbery would have treated being continuously stalked by 3 men and sideswiped by a truck unseriously.

If Arbery had a cavalier attitude about his attackers, I imagine it didn't last very long into the chase. I very much doubt Arbery was "toying" with these killers, but rather learning, over the course of their escalating violence, how seriously they intended him harm.

 

[Thermal]

Everybody is wrong except you!

Yeah, because I mentioned a 4 min mile! Just unholy!

Why don't you take a crack at how the chase went? How do trucks chase a guy on foot? Do they cruise behind him at 10 mph while he jogs along? I'm not seeing some action-adventure movie chase scene, like you guys do. I'm trying to picture how it would physically look. And it sounds more like this not being a Starsky and Hutch screeching tires montage. I don't think Arbery had to do much at all but keep trotting around to keep the butterballs occupied.

 

[catsmate]

Absolutely. No serious runner ever on history has ever approached anything like four minutes for a mile. Utterly ludicrous for me to have used it as a loose comparison of running time versus distance to establish a pace. Complete fabrication on my end. Mea culpa. Happy?

And know you're attempting comic exaggeration to wallpaper over your errors.
Rather pathetic really.

You have any substantial contributions to the discussion or is that about it for you?

 

[TurkeysGhost]

Why don't you take a crack at how the chase went? How do trucks chase a guy on foot? Do they cruise behind him at 10 mph while he jogs along? I'm not seeing some action-adventure movie chase scene, like you guys do. I'm trying to picture how it would physically look. And it sounds more like this not being a Starsky and Hutch screeching tires montage. I don't think Arbery had to do much at all but keep trotting around to keep the butterballs occupied.

You've seen how. One car follows at a slow pace while another moves ahead to create a road block. One such roadblock was the one seen in the video capturing Arbery's murder.

From Roddie's own mouth, back before he realized he was culpable for a murder:

“When I see him, I knew, hate that people were getting broken into out here, you know. So, I hollered at them and said, ‘Y’all got him?’ And he just kept running. He was full blown running,” Bryan said to police. “… They got down to the end down there somewhere, must’ve past him. Because I pulled out of my driveway, was going to try to block him. But he was going all around. I made a few moves at him, you know. And he didn’t stop.”

https://www.actionnewsjax.com/news/local/glynn-county/exclusive-william-roddie-bryan-told-police-he-tried-block-ahmaud-arbery-body-camera-video-shows/SUSTXZ2BD5H77GCCMFOZBM2DO4/

 

[catsmate]

Apparently not

I'd consider myself a fairly serious runner - up to 2,000 miles a year and there's no way on Earth I'd be able to run a sub 6-minute mile, much less a sub-4.

That's because I train for distance and while I can run 20 7:45 minute miles anything much quicker gets difficult very quickly.

If I had to run 400 metres flat out, I'd be useless for a while afterwards

What you need is motivation. After the lockdown is done pop over to Dublin; I know a quiet beach and I'll bring a .22.....

 

[Belz...]

Those extrapolations are only in your head; I don't say or "infer" them. The problem is your antenna.

Do you want me to check with the other Thermal to see if he agrees with you?

Just give it up, admit to having being wrong about this trivial matter, and make a better argument instead. I guarantee no one's going to ridicule you for being wrong after that.

Foe pete's sake you keep denying to have said what you said because you can't accept that what you actually said was wrong.

 

[catsmate]

Liar. Never said or implied "any".

Right....

And an actual runner can drop a mile in four minutes.

 

[Belz...]

As pointed out to you repeatedly...Jesus Christ repeatedly....i adjusted right away. Why do you keel pretending otherwise? Pretty cheap.

Because IT'S A LIE. When you were called on it you said school kids do it nowadays! When you were called on _that_ you continued for several posts to insist that it wasn't complicated... then only after a lot of nonsense you moved the time up, complaining that we were ignoring your larger point and blah blah blah. That's not "right away." We had to grill you quite a bit to get that small concession.

Yeah, and if you could expand your contributions beyond ad homes and other personal attacks on yours truly, that'd be great.

We'll add "ad homs" to the list of terms you don't understand. I'm not saying that you're wrong because you refuse to admit your mistake. I'm pointing out that you refuse to admit your mistake. That's not an ad hom.

 

[The Don]

Right....

Maybe we'll have a 10 page bicker-fest about the meaning of the word "actual".

I interpreted it as "an enthusiastic amateur" (such as Arbery). Maybe Thermal's meaning is "nationally ranked specialist middle distance athlete"

 

[Belz...]

Right....

Oh, he just meant "there exists sch a runner in the world", I'm sure.

 

[Thermal]

Yeah, the unspoken assumption by a lot of posters here is that he had to be meek and fearful. Not my starting assumption, especially considering his final run at Travis.

The funny part is, I'm not the slightest bit surprised that many here find it impossible that Arbery was courageous in the face of The Chase. I see no reason why he wouldn't be, especially if he didn't yet know they were armed and as dangerous as they turned out to be.

We know how the story ended, so you are assuming that he knew that ending at the time and acted accordingly. That's a bad assumption. At the time, Arbery had no reason to think this was anything but some fat rednecks flexing on him. And as I have argued, I have no reason to think he was so cowed.

People generally find being stalked unnerving, and they certainly would understand that they were in danger after the chase escalated to the point of being hit by a truck in an effort to forcibly detain him.

The initial confrontation may have been thought of as simply a rude intrusion, but it's beggars belief that Arbery would have treated being continuously stalked by 3 men and sideswiped by a truck unseriously.

If Arbery had a cavalier attitude about his attackers, I imagine it didn't last very long into the chase. I very much doubt Arbery was "toying" with these killers, but rather learning, over the course of their escalating violence, how seriously they intended him harm.

It depends on if you consider yourself stalked, or if it's a couple fat rednecks floundering around like the Keystone Cops.

And re: being hit: we still don't know that. There is a palm print on the truck. Not a swipe or smear, an identifiable print. Does that sound to you like the vehicle might have been stationary, to leave a clean print? I think it's a possibility, and fits better with Roddys claim that Arbery was trying to get in the truck.

We still don't know anything about this dent, or even if Arbery made it. Some incidental fibers can get on the vehicle from any incidental contact, even from trying to forcibly enter.

The evidence about being run down is completely consistent with trying to force his way in, per Roddys claim. No broken bones or even a scratch mentioned on Arbery from the alleged running over. Not a drop of blood.

Do you disagree that the evidence presented equally supports either version?