Jared Loughner charges: what about the other shooting victims?

[NWO Sentryman]

i have a feeling that Loughner is going to be in solitary confinement, because he wouldn't survive in the general prison population very long (child killers are considered to be among the lowest of the low in us prisons IIRC, and given that he also shot a representative...)

 

[Spindrift]

Possible consideration: insanity plea? Different state vs fed?

Big consideration in this case.

Arizona has one of highest standards for Not Guilty due to insanity/mental defect and the Federal government the lowest.

So if the Federal case gets him off by reason of insanity, Arizona could still convict him and send him off to lethal injection or whatever it is they use. I'm sure that would cause some interesting and rather long appeals.

 

[Fnord]

Possible consideration: insanity plea?

Not according to a CNN article ("Badly wounded Arizona lawmaker is 'holding her own"):

Experts said Tuesday the alleged shooter in the massacre may have difficulty making the case for a successful insanity plea.

Paul Callan, a criminal defense attorney and a former prosecutor, and Jeff Gardere, a clinical and forensic psychologist, told CNN's "American Morning" on Tuesday they have doubts that an insanity plea would stand.

With the "amount of planning that went into this assassination," Callan believes "it's highly unlikely he will meet the legal insanity defense threshold."

"It's very hard to prove insanity at trial," Callan said. "You really have to prove that your mental illness is so severe that you don't even understand that you're committing a criminal act. And it's almost impossible to prove that."

Gardere emphasized that "premeditation will work against him in this one as far as getting an insanity plea."

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

i have a feeling that Loughner is going to be in solitary confinement, because he wouldn't survive in the general prison population very long (child killers are considered to be among the lowest of the low in us prisons IIRC, and given that he also shot a representative...)

Some people might give him a medal for that.

 

[LTC8K6]

No, As long as the evidence was collected appropriately, he can say anything he wants. Only issue would be jury selection, and that is not insurmountable at all.

He may be creating a defense/alibi for Loughner. No doubt in my mind that the Sheriff's words will come up at trial.

Also, it's been reported that Law Enforcement was aware of behavior on Loughner's part that should have made them intervene and should also have halted his handgun purchase. His Mom's position with the government supposedly got him special treatment.

So Dupnik's comments may be for his own defense.

 

[Fnord]

... So Dupnik's comments may be for his own defense.

"Thou shalt protect thine ass, and thine oxen, and thy manservant." -- Book of Impedicles V:XVII

 

[brenn]

My question is: Why hasn't he been charged with the murder (and attempted murder) of the other non-governmental citizens, like the little girl? I will assume that the prosecutors know what they're doing, but what's the strategy here, legally?

Because he is in federal custody and murder is not a federal crime without a connection, like "federal employee/etc."

As he may get death in federal court, to charge him with the state murders would only delay the penalty. If he does not get death in federal court, the state can always charge him with murder.

 

[brenn]

"Thou shalt protect thine ass, and thine oxen, and thy manservant." -- Book of Impedicles V:XVII

Unfortunately for Dupnik, calling attention to your ass may not be the best way to protect it, when you aren't on very solid ground.

 

[WildCat]

Not according to a CNN article ("Badly wounded Arizona lawmaker is 'holding her own"):

There's 2 levels of inasanity. If you are found not guilty by reason of insanity, it's because you're so far gone you didn't even realize what you did was wrong. Likely you get sent to a mental institution, like Hinckley was. Then there's "guilty but insane", which means you did know what you did was wrong. You then get sent to a mental institution until you're "cured", then go to prison.

Of course, it varies from state to state. Many states don't have the latter.

 

[deepatrax]

(Also, Deeptrax seems to have infected and derailed that thread quite effectively, and I didn't want to get lost in the static).

derailed and infected = showing the hypocrisy of the Left who use the SAME type of vitriolic rhetoric.

thanks!

 

[BenBurch]

When you act like an obnoxious troll, don't be surprised when people take you for one.

 

[Dorian Gray]

Did everyone know that the lawyer representing Loughner is the same lawyer who represented the Unabomber?

 

[Tumblehome]

That's one of the positive things I've seen come out of this tragedy. The justice department actually requested her because of her experience with other defendants potentially facing the death penalty, including the Unabomber. In the interests of real justice, they wanted to make sure Loughner got good representation. At least, that's my take on it.

 

[Fnord]

... Then there's "guilty but insane", which means you did know what you did was wrong. You then get sent to a mental institution until you're "cured", then go to prison. Of course, it varies from state to state. Many states don't have the latter.

Well, there's the problem! Jared Loughner's currently charged in federal court, where the states have no authority, and where there is no "Guilty, but Insane" verdict (afaik).

 

[Aoidoi]

That's one of the positive things I've seen come out of this tragedy. The justice department actually requested her because of her experience with other defendants potentially facing the death penalty, including the Unabomber. In the interests of real justice, they wanted to make sure Loughner got good representation. At least, that's my take on it.

Maybe she just has a VERY specific practice?

 

[Travis]

No they don't want the guy to be able to appeal claiming he had incompetent representation.

 

[WildCat]

Did everyone know that the lawyer representing Loughner is the same lawyer who represented the Unabomber?

Also represented Tim McVeigh.

 

[dtugg]

He's going to get the needle.

 

[KingMerv00]

That's one of the positive things I've seen come out of this tragedy. The justice department actually requested her because of her experience with other defendants potentially facing the death penalty, including the Unabomber. In the interests of real justice, they wanted to make sure Loughner got good representation. At least, that's my take on it.

No they don't want the guy to be able to appeal claiming he had incompetent representation.

That's another way of illustrating the same point.

 

[fuelair]

the state saves money.

In addition, it gives you a backup plan. If a guy murders 6 people, and you charge him with all 6, if you get a stupid jury (see: Oj) who for some reason decides to "send a message" and find him not guilty, you are done.

If you charge him with only one murder, and the jury does as above, it's no big deal. You just charge him with the next one in front of a new jury.

:d:d:d ^^^ :d:d:d e.t.a.idiot thing isn't working again