Insulting Ad about Nurses by Johnson and Johnson

[Skeptic Ginger]

OK I'm ready to go on a rampage about this ad, it so angered me.

That's all I got right now but I'll post updates on my progress voicing my disgust to J&J.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

I sent this email to J&J: "I am particularly disturbed by your TV ad implying nurses believe superstition "stacks the deck". (4 leaf clover ED ad). As a member of the science based medicine community and as a nurse, I believe promoting this message is insulting. You are sending the message that DESPITE nursing being science based we are still clinging to superstitious nonsense. BTW, prayer has been shown to have no effect on healing either so this isn't about offending my beliefs. This is about demeaning nurses by implying we believe in superstition and magic."

Please send them your own comments if you are so inclined.
https://secure-www.jnj.com/wps/wcm/jsp/contactUs.jsp


And perhaps we can get some interest in this issue from our colleagues by spreading the word here. Thanks.

 

[madurobob]

Is it that the nurse says she believes in "stacking the deck" and what she is really conveying is that she believes silly superstitions in addition to science?

I don't think that's the only way to interpret it. My first reaction was that it was meant to show a human aspect - compassion - in addition to medical knowledge. Or, put another way, since nurses spend more time with patients than anyone else they need to have excellent interpersonal skills in additional to years of medical training... and that's why we need to support nurses.

ETA: But, I have to admit I'd probably be less on the fence here if it had been a crucifix rather than a shamrock.

 

[DallasDad]

If you hadn't pointed out it could be interpreted as the nurse supporting superstitition, I wouldn't have thought of it. I interpreted the action as showing compassion, trying to make the patient feel better, etc., even if the nurse found the ideas silly.

Now I'm conflicted. Someone could easily interpret it the first way.

 

[Rasmus]

If you hadn't pointed out it could be interpreted as the nurse supporting superstitition, I wouldn't have thought of it. I interpreted the action as showing compassion, trying to make the patient feel better, etc., even if the nurse found the ideas silly.

Now I'm conflicted. Someone could easily interpret it the first way.

I would - why should the ad have a lucky charm rather than any other object the patient could have dropped? And why would compassion need to be contrasted with science?

 

[madurobob]

Now I'm conflicted. Someone could easily interpret it the first way.

Yup - same boat.

It is easy to see how someone might be offended. So easy, Johnson & Johnson should have picked up on it as well.

 

[madurobob]

And why would compassion need to be contrasted with science?

Well, that is more cultural. We always talk about "cold hard science" and "human warmth". You have to really be looking to be offended to take issue with that alone in this ad. Its a selling point - the ad is selling the idea of nursing and compassion is something everyone can recognize as a good quality in a nurse.

 

[Monketi Ghost]

Rn's believe in all sorts of paranormal crapola. Full-moon effect, number 13, you name it and an idiot nurse believes it.

Sorry but it's true. I've done informal polls quietly, and listened. Yesterday a bunch of Rn's were sitting around at the nurse's station babbling about their experiences with haunted houses and ghosts.

 

[Emet]

Here's J&J's Discover Nursing site:

http://www.discovernursing.com/

 

[JohnnyG]

I didn't take it to mean that the nurse believes in superstition, but when she noticed the four leaf clover she realized that the patient may be a believer. She puts it in his hand for his reassurance, not because she is superstitious. The ad is basically saying that compassion is an important part of nursing in addition to science.

I think this ad is a trivial thing to go on a rampage about. If Johnson & Johnson were marketing a four leaf clover for the enhanced treatment of ER patients, yes...I'll stand with you. But this? Meh.

 

[Psi Baba]

I first saw that commercial a week or two ago, and also immediately took it as supporting superstition. I was quite surprised to see that, actually. I see the point about showing the compassion aspect, which certainly is an important part of all that nurses do, but I think that could have easily been depicted without the use of a lucky charm. In the ad, the patient doesn't appear to be conscious and so is not likely aware that the nurse placed his keyfob in his hand. Showing her holding his hand should have been sufficient. If they had shown the man's face mouthing the words, "thank you," or something like that, you could argue that the nurse figured the object had meaning to him even if not to her, and that's where the compassion figures in. But the way it plays out, it doesn't come off that way.

Imagine if a doctor handed you a scrip and a four-leaf clover, or he hands you one while you're on the operating table just before being put under and says,
"Here, hold onto this . . . you know, just to stack the deck."

 

[Emet]

I think this ad is a trivial thing to go on a rampage about. If Johnson & Johnson were marketing a four leaf clover for the enhanced treatment of ER patients, yes...I'll stand with you. But this? Meh.

You'd be surprised what folks go on rampages about.

I'm a vet. When this movie was released, letters to the editor started pouring in to JAVMA about the vet being depicted in a bad light. I think he was the bad guy in the film.

 

[nimzov]

Quite a few nurses organisations support therapeutic touch.

 

[Monketi Ghost]

In fact, I don't mean to be a hater, but nurses just love the kind of stuff we ridicule here.

 

[JohnnyG]

Imagine if a doctor handed you a scrip and a four-leaf clover, or he hands you one while you're on the operating table just before being put under and says,
"Here, hold onto this . . . you know, just to stack the deck."

But she isn't handing him a lucky charm, she is giving him back HIS lucky charm that fell out of his pocket.
I don't think a company that makes science-based medical products would make an ad endorsing lucky charms. It certainly wasn't the best choice to demonstrate compassion, but I doubt they intended to endorse anything supernatural. The fact that some take it that way is more a reflection of their own hypersensitivity than evidence J&J thinks nurses should support woo.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

I would - why should the ad have a lucky charm rather than any other object the patient could have dropped? And why would compassion need to be contrasted with science?

Exactly. How about a picture of his kids or something. If I wasn't a sensitized skeptic, yes the "we care" message might have dominated, but the "stack the deck" is the clincher.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

In fact, I don't mean to be a hater, but nurses just love the kind of stuff we ridicule here.

You forgot your smiley:


You have no basis for that insulting stereotype if you were serious. Nurses are no more nor less irrational than any other profession with an equivalent level of science in it.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Well, that is more cultural. We always talk about "cold hard science" and "human warmth". You have to really be looking to be offended to take issue with that alone in this ad. Its a selling point - the ad is selling the idea of nursing and compassion is something everyone can recognize as a good quality in a nurse.

You don't have to really be looking. You merely need to be sensitized to rational and irrational thinking.

 

[Rasmus]

Exactly. How about a picture of his kids or something. If I wasn't a sensitized skeptic, yes the "we care" message might have dominated, but the "stack the deck" is the clincher.

Yes, the ad makes the most sense if i assume that they are at least openly approving of the woo.

I often notice a tendency to always assume that whatever was just said or displayed didn't come from a blithering idiot - but sometimes, that is the best explanation

 

[Monketi Ghost]

You forgot your smiley:


You have no basis for that insulting stereotype if you were serious. Nurses are no more nor less irrational than any other profession with an equivalent level of science in it.

I am serious. But it's only my experience. In the hospital where I work there are no room 13's. Dead serious, the room numbers go from 12 to 14.

In fact, and this is only my experience, nurses are among the most superstitious people I've ever met. And for all the education it requires, many of them are box-of-rocks stupid in areas other than their expertise.