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Merged Instinct & Immunity? / Innate immunity?

RenaissanceBiker said:
Kumar, please don't wait until this thread reaches 12 pages before you tell us what primitive superstition or ancient philosophy you base these claims on. Go ahead and tell us now why you think these things. I'm not going to play guessing games with you anymore.
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Oh god please! Kumar has to be a troll - surely nobody can be that stupid...:jaw-dropp
 
Entropydave said:
Oh god please! Kumar has to be a troll - surely nobody can be that stupid...:jaw-dropp
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Not keeping eye open & not thinking differently can be the enemy of inventions esp when old inventions are not yet become absolute & final.

"Those who can't contribute or don't want to contribute, should not resist or stop others contributing"

I think from pub med.
 
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Kumar said:
Mojo, Just contribute.
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Why not contribute something yourself, such as an answer to the question I asked you. Do you include the definitions of "medicine" that you posted in your "Any odd exposure which is not natural to us, to which we don't have inharent sense of right & wrong ot to which we are neither evolved nor habituated"?
 
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Mojo said:
Why not contribute something yourself, such as an answer to the question I asked you. Do you include the definitions of "medicine" that you posted in your "Any odd exposure which is not natural to us, to which we don't have inharent sense of right & wrong ot to which we are neither evolved nor habituated"?
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I don't understand your posts or find your questions as irrelevant. Just contribute as few other posters contribute. We don't have time to waste in TTTT.
 
Kumar said:
??

You may also consider & comment on following part:-
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The quote in your post seems to relate how continous stimulation of a cell by a certain stimuli may with time cause it to react in a diminished manner to further changes in the same stimuli. In this context it most readily applies to how exogenous (i.e. Pharmaceuthical) and enogenous corticosteroids both cause immunosuppresion with long-time exposure.
 
Sawbones79 said:
The quote in your post seems to relate how continous stimulation of a cell by a certain stimuli may with time cause it to react in a diminished manner to further changes in the same stimuli. In this context it most readily applies to how exogenous (i.e. Pharmaceuthical) and enogenous corticosteroids both cause immunosuppresion with long-time exposure.
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Yes look like so but simply endogenous stress harmones & odd/unnatural exposures which can cause stress. Normal Foods or other natural exposures to us don't cause such effect even on prolonged intake.
 
Kumar said:
Yes look like so but simply endogenous stress harmones & odd/unnatural exposures which can cause stress. Normal Foods or other natural exposures to us don't cause such effect even on prolonged intake.
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What would you consider natural exposures? The way I see it, the word "natural" is pretty tricky to define when it comes to humans and our environment.
I get the feeling that what you're maybe misinterpreting the page you posted to mean that medications in themselves compromise the immune system, when it actually uses drug tolerance as an example to describe modulation of a cellular response in a wider sense.
 
Sawbones79 said:
What would you consider natural exposures? The way I see it, the word "natural" is pretty tricky to define when it comes to humans and our environment.
I get the feeling that what you're maybe misinterpreting the page you posted to mean that medications in themselves compromise the immune system, when it actually uses drug tolerance as an example to describe modulation of a cellular response in a wider sense.
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I meant:- "natural to us"--i.e. to which we have inharent sense of right & wrong--whatever our body can process with such inharent sense. If a thing is not natural to us, our body can't process it with pre-informed sense so odd(confused, shocking, adverse) effects should be possible which should be stressful. Actually it is difficult to say that anything can be unnatural because all things have come from nature BUT natural to us is important here.
 
Kumar said:
I meant:- "natural to us"--i.e. to which we have inharent sense of right & wrong--whatever our body can process with such inharent sense. If a thing is not natural to us, our body can't process it with pre-informed sense so odd(confused, shocking, adverse) effects should be possible which should be stressful. Actually it is difficult to say that anything can be unnatural because all things have come from nature BUT natural to us is important here.
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Inherent sense of right and wrong? You mean exposures that FEEL unnatural? Because what feels "right" is rather defined bt learning and habit than any inborn instincts.
 
Mojo said:
Why not contribute something yourself, such as an answer to the question I asked you. Do you include the definitions of "medicine" that you posted in your "Any odd exposure which is not natural to us, to which we don't have inharent sense of right & wrong ot to which we are neither evolved nor habituated"?
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Kumar said:
I don't understand your posts or find your questions as irrelevant. Just contribute as few other posters contribute. We don't have time to waste in TTTT.
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Yes we do have time to waste when you are not clear. Mojo asked a clear question. Would you consider insulin to be a drug? What about caffeine?

Kumar said:
Yes look like so but simply endogenous stress harmones & odd/unnatural exposures which can cause stress. Normal Foods or other natural exposures to us don't cause such effect even on prolonged intake.
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As it has already been mentioned, please tell us what "normal foods" are. Would a potato be a natural food? What about butter? What about french fries / chips? What about HákarlWP? What about grape juice? What about wine?


Kumar said:
I meant:- "natural to us"--i.e. to which we have inharent sense of right & wrong--whatever our body can process with such inharent sense. If a thing is not natural to us, our body can't process it with pre-informed sense so odd(confused, shocking, adverse) effects should be possible which should be stressful. Actually it is difficult to say that anything can be unnatural because all things have come from nature BUT natural to us is important here.
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This makes no sense. You have not defined "natural to us" clearly, let alone defined "natural". Traditionally, the Jewish religion is forbidden to eat pork. Is pork "natural" to them?
 
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Little 10 Toes said:
Yes we do have time to waste when you are not clear. Mojo asked a clear question. Would you consider insulin to be a drug? What about caffeine?
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First I am asking questions. So posters can reply instead of bouncing. Insulin should be replacement or supplement. Coffee or other foods, which we take since long back and to which our body system has inharent sense of wrong or right, should not be a drug. Unnaturality to us can lie in quality &/or quantity, which is not normal to us. Eg. Insulin & Caffeine in excess quantity is harmful & unnatural to us.

As it has already been mentioned, please tell us what "normal foods" are. Would a potato be a natural food? What about butter? What about french fries / chips? What about HákarlWP? What about grape juice? What about wine?
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Look above.



This makes no sense. You have not defined "natural to us" clearly, let alone defined "natural". Traditionally, the Jewish religion is forbidden to eat pork. Is pork "natural" to them?
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I had defined "unnatural to us" many time. It means, to which we do not have inharent sense of wrong or right OR which our body system can not process normally--pre-informed. Such unnatural things to us, can cause odd results--confused, adverse, shoking, healing etc. As all things have come from nature, we can't say that anything can be unnatural, though unnatural form can be possible, if processed.
 
Sawbones79 said:
Inherent sense of right and wrong? You mean exposures that FEEL unnatural? Because what feels "right" is rather defined bt learning and habit than any inborn instincts.
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I think my last reply tp Little 10 Toes will give awnser to above.
 
Kumar said:
First I am asking questions. So posters can reply instead of bouncing. Insulin should be replacement or supplement. Coffee or other foods, which we take since long back and to which our body system has inharent sense of wrong or right, should not be a drug. Unnaturality to us can lie in quality &/or quantity, which is not normal to us. Eg. Insulin & Caffeine in excess quantity is harmful & unnatural to us. ...

I had defined "unnatural to us" many time. It means, to which we do not have inharent sense of wrong or right OR which our body system can not process normally--pre-informed. ...
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Clipped for brevity.
How long back does a food need to have been added to our diets to become 'normal'.
I love honey, yet my daughter can't touch it on account of a violent allergy.
But she's not the only one I know such an intolerance- I have a colleague who was taken to hospital after imbibing propolis on the advice of a naturopath (quack)

How about celiacs, who simply can't absorb gluten.
I'm confused by your lack of precision here and I really don't understand what you mean by 'inharent'.
 
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Little 10 Toes said:
This makes no sense. You have not defined "natural to us" clearly, let alone defined "natural". Traditionally, the Jewish religion is forbidden to eat pork. Is pork "natural" to them?
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It's natural to me,especially when I get the crackling just right.
 
pakeha said:
Clipped for brevity.
How long back does a food need to have been added to our diets to become 'normal'.
I love honey, yet my daughter can't touch it on account of a violent allergy.
But she's not the only one I know such an intolerance- I have a colleague who was taken to hospital after imbibing propolis on the advice of a naturopath (quack)

How about celiacs, who simply can't absorb gluten.
I'm confused by your lack of precision here and I really don't understand what you mean by 'inharent'.
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Hello. Inharent means:- Existing as an essential constituent or characteristic; intrinsic : inborn; forming a natural or inseparable part or quality.

It may take generations to justify anything to be natural to us. Though honey is natural to us but if one had taken a lot in previous times, he can be allergic. Similarily other foods. Either or both odd in quality & quantity, can cause disorders.
 
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