Ed Indictment in Breonna Taylor case.

Delphic Oracle said:
Because we live in a country where you aren't supposed to get your door kicked in by armed agents of the state while you're asleep based on thin pretext.

There are many different life experiences in the geographic space the U.S. fills.
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Please explain in detail using facts from the investigation how you come to your conclusion.
Please quote specific statements by the police officers involved in obtaining the warrant, the statements used to obtain the warrant, and the vetted evidence you have to the contrary.
 
Bogative said:
Taylor's residence was one of five being searched that night. Why would you expect them to sit outside and wait for her, potentially giving her several hours to destroy evidence of criminal activity?
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Why go in at night in the first place?

No, the point of these warrants is to shock&awe, to stop the occupants from calling their lawyers.
 
The basic fact is that in today's America, any interaction with the police can result in a shooting and death.


the expected weight of the evidence from a warrant and the subsequent benefit for society from a conviction better be worth that trade-off.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
Beg to disagree, big time.

- why would not every future intruder shout "POLICE" the moment he sees movement in the house?
- the fact that you are being associated with criminals doesn't nullify all your constitutional rights.



No, the basic failure here was for the police not to investigate and surveilled more: they should have staked out the home and entered with
Taylor when she came home: going into an place where you do not know who is inside is needless reckless.
Police budgets are all screwed up to favor going hard instead of smart.
And results like in this case will happen again and again until the police will focus on detecting instead of gatecrashing.
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So...you equate a number of police officers wearing their gear and who identified themselves as police long before they battered the door down with a lone intruder sneaking about a house? Seriously? :confused:

You seem to think police have unlimited resources and time. Perhaps in a utopian world where there is almost no crime and unlimited resources could police set up surveillance and wait for someone to enter a building before executing a search warrant in all cases. That would be nice.
But, in the real world while investigating and looking for evidence of drug dealing that could be tied to a murder - police do not always have that luxury. You do what you can do given the time and resources allocated.
It's called reality.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
The basic fact is that in today's America, any interaction with the police can result in a shooting and death.


the expected weight of the evidence from a warrant and the subsequent benefit for society from a conviction better be worth that trade-off.
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Yep. That is why it is important to obey the commands of a police officer and not give them reason to believe you are a danger to them.

There are a million or so police/citizen interactions in the US every day. The statistical odds of getting shot and killed by a police officer during one of these interactions is incredibly small.
 
If the police has limited resources, than that's the issue that needs fixing.
Not having the time or manpower doesn't give you the right to use a constitutionally questionable shortcut.

Furthermore, crime, especially homicide, is way down, but police budgets are not.
Crime clearance rates are abysmal.
US Police is just plain bad at detecting, which is why they have to hope to catch people red-handed trying to hide or destroy evidence.

US policing needs to be completely overhauled with a focus on detective work before the fishing expedition with battering rams and guns starts.
That would be much safer for the cops, too.
 
Bogative said:
No, the point of these warrants is to gather evidence before it can be destroyed.
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nope.
The point is to have a reason to arrest the occupants for resisting arrest or trying to hide/destroy evidence.

There are much better and safer ways to execute a warrant, as can be seen with EVERY white-collar crime.
 
rockinkt said:
Who else stated this as fact besides the guy who opened fire on the police officers?
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So they knocked and identified themselves (even though they felt they needed a no-knock warrant) and the boyfriend shot at them because it was so clear they were the cops.

Is that your position?

What if all the bullets that hit Breonna came from the cop that was shooting wildly? Is it your position they fired this guy because a round or two hit a neighbor's apartment even though the shooting itself was warranted?
 
Bogative said:
Taylor's residence was one of five being searched that night. Why would you expect them to sit outside and wait for her, potentially giving her several hours to destroy evidence of criminal activity?
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Wait a minute. She wasn't the subject. She wasn't associated with any criminal activity. Nobody was looking for her. The ex-boyfriend they were looking for was already in jail. What I expect from cops is that they do whatever they have to do so they don't kill people for no reason.
 
rockinkt said:
Please explain in detail using facts from the investigation how you come to your conclusion.
Please quote specific statements by the police officers involved in obtaining the warrant, the statements used to obtain the warrant, and the vetted evidence you have to the contrary.
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She had no drugs, wasn't a user, but became a target merely because she visited the house where drugs were found when it was under surveillance. They did not see her buying drugs. It's not hard to do a minimum bit of checking to see who lived at Breonna's apartment and if they had any history of criminal offenses before they added her address to the warrant.
 
rockinkt said:
Ummm... because that is the way to get evidence that may be gone in the morning?
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That is a straw man. Why would the drugs that were supposedly there earlier in the day be gone if they didn't bust in in the middle of the night?
 
Bogative said:
Are you saying the one neighbor is lying?

Should the other neighbors have heard the police as well? If so, what do you base that expectation on?
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According to the family's lawyer, at his first interview with police he said he didn't hear anything. At his second interview with the police, he said he didn't hear anything. He told reporters who talked to everybody in the building that he didn't hear anything. But at his third interview with police two months after the killing, he remembered hearing the cops announce themselves and wait to be admitted. Gee, what should we believe?
 
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Skeptic Ginger said:
She had no drugs, wasn't a user, but became a target merely because she visited the house where drugs were found when it was under surveillance. They did not see her buying drugs. It's not hard to do a minimum bit of checking to see who lived at Breonna's apartment and if they had any history of criminal offenses before they added her address to the warrant.
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They added her address to the warrant because Jamarcus Glover used it as his own on his bank account.
Packages with his name were shipped there regularly.
He was seen at that address regularly.
He gave her phone number to the police as his own.
He called her from jail regularly.
He was surveilled driving her car.
 
Two cops shot last night night during the Louisville protests. The state and the cops might not see the 100% avoidable killing of Taylor as reason to change their ways, perhaps they'll change their tune when they are the ones in danger
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
She had no drugs, wasn't a user, but became a target merely because she visited the house where drugs were found when it was under surveillance. They did not see her buying drugs. It's not hard to do a minimum bit of checking to see who lived at Breonna's apartment and if they had any history of criminal offenses before they added her address to the warrant.
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You seem to be unaware of a major fact:

"But a judge had also signed a warrant allowing the police to search Ms. Taylor’s residence because the police said they believed that one of the men had used her apartment to receive packages. Ms. Taylor had been dating that man on and off for several years but had recently severed ties with him, according to her family’s lawyer."https://www.nytimes.com/article/breonna-taylor-police.html
 
Bikewer said:
Just announced, one of the officers was indicted for “reckless endangerment” for apparently shooting into adjacent apartments.
None of the officers actually involved in the shooting were charged, the investigation showed they were acting properly.

This has been pretty apparent from the time that fairly detailed accounts of the incident became public.... The death of Taylor was a tragic accident but not criminal. The officers did not go to the wrong address, they were looking for Taylor’s boyfriend.
They did have a “no knock” warrant, and the boyfriend did open fire on them as they forced their way in.
They returned fire and Taylor caught a bullet. Tragedy, but no “murder”...
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Yep when sleeping people get shot it is normal, hence why it is outrageous that face any consequence at all. They should be treated like great officers like Philip Brailsford when he was totally justified in his shooting of Daniel Shaver.

It is outrageous to think that cops should ever have to worry about where they bullets go.
 
SuburbanTurkey said:
Two cops shot last night night during the Louisville protests. The state and the cops might not see the 100% avoidable killing of Taylor as reason to change their ways, perhaps they'll change their tune when they are the ones in danger
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Hilariously devoid of any rational thought!
Why not just come out and admit that you hate cops for whatever personal reasons you may hold?
 
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