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Income adjusted traffic violation fines

Trausti said:
Of course, it's malicious envy.
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You seem only to be fixating on how this affects very wealthy people. The world is not the super-rich plus everyone else.
If the court fines the guy making a hundred grand more than the guy making seventy, it's not because the judge is jealous of such riches. It's because it stings both transgressors similarly.

I also got the impression earlier that you imagined some dystopia where a roadside cop got to demand to know your income so he could choose an on the spot fine. I don't imagine that's the law anywhere they have income based fines.
 
theprestige said:
Relax, dude. We're all internet pundits here.
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We are. But my point wasn't about that. It was about your remark about seeing repeat offenders. Something you either have actual experience with or you don't. And given you really didn't address how you know what you said was factual, I can only assume you made it up.
 
acbytesla said:
We are. But my point wasn't about that. It was about your remark about seeing repeat offenders. Something you either have actual experience with or you don't. And given you really didn't address how you know what you said was factual, I can only assume you made it up.
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I'm guessing he's going from the SovCit videos, where all of the things mentioned are indeed pretty much standard.
 
Brainster said:
I'm guessing he's going from the SovCit videos, where all of the things mentioned are indeed pretty much standard.
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I don't know about that. I want to give Prestige the benefit of the doubt. But I do think he's making a broad generalization based on one or two anecdotes he has heard.
 
acbytesla said:
We are. But my point wasn't about that. It was about your remark about seeing repeat offenders. Something you either have actual experience with or you don't. And given you really didn't address how you know what you said was factual, I can only assume you made it up.
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YouTube has a vast catalog of police body cam footage, and traffic court footage too. Things like driving with suspended license, or multiple DUIs, come up all the time.

And again, relax.
 
Brainster said:
I'm guessing he's going from the SovCit videos, where all of the things mentioned are indeed pretty much standard.
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acbytesla said:
I don't know about that. I want to give Prestige the benefit of the doubt.
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Nah, Sovcits are a whole other can of worms. I see a ton of those videos, too. But right now I'm just talking about regular, run-of-the-mill repeat offenders, a lot of whom are not too rich to care. They just don't care.

acbytesla said:
But I do think he's making a broad generalization based on one or two anecdotes he has heard.
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You seem to be pretty invested in the narrative that traffic fines deter the non-rich. I'm sure they do deter the non-rich. The law-abiding non-rich, that is.
 
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theprestige said:
Nah, Sovcits are a whole other can of worms. I see a ton of those videos, too. But right now I'm just talking about regular, run-of-the-mill repeat offenders, a lot of whom are not too rich to care. They just don't care.
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What evidence do you have for your assertion? Would it be from cherrypicked news stories?
 
theprestige said:
Nah, Sovcits are a whole other can of worms. I see a ton of those videos, too. But right now I'm just talking about regular, run-of-the-mill repeat offenders, a lot of whom are not too rich to care. They just don't care.


You seem to be pretty invested in the narrative that traffic fines deter the non-rich. I'm sure they do deter the non-rich. The law-abiding non-rich, that is.
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No I'm not. I just know that I don't know and most likely, you don't either. And you keep enforcing my conclusion. Since you still haven't addressed my first and most salient question. That is, how do you know what you said you knew about repeat offenders?
 
i know and have known enough people that don't really care about getting tickets or fines and will just keep doing illegal stuff and drive around with no insurance and plates and all that to know that there's plenty of people out there like that
 
dirtywick said:
i know and have known enough people that don't really care about getting tickets or fines and will just keep doing illegal stuff and drive around with no insurance and plates and all that to know that there's plenty of people out there like that
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Sure you do. I've known people who get a ticket and can't afford to pay the ticket but keep on driving as they need transportation to get to work and other necessities and then they get pulled over because they couldn't pay the ticket and the world crashes on top of them. They lose their car, they lose their job, they lose their shelter.
 
acbytesla said:
Sure you do. I've known people who get a ticket and can't afford to pay the ticket but keep on driving as they need transportation to get to work and other necessities and then they get pulled over because they couldn't pay the ticket and the world crashes on top of them. They lose their car, they lose their job, they lose their shelter.
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it seems like you're trying to say you don't believe me?

i don't think it's a great situation and i'm not arguing pro fines. but if you argument is that these people don't exist and it's a straw man to say they do, you're wrong. some people are just ◊◊◊◊◊◊ people, that's how it is.
 
acbytesla said:
Pointing to random videos on YouTube is cherrypicking.
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I'm not pointing to random videos. There's whole channels devoted to this sort of content. It makes up about half of my second-screen playlist on any given day. There are a *lot* of traffic violation repeat offenders out there. Not all of them are too rich to care. I've seen far too much of this kind of footage to accept the claim that poverty is an effective deterrent to commit traffic violations.

Why is this such a difficult concept for you to entertain?
 
acbytesla said:
Sure you do. I've known people who get a ticket and can't afford to pay the ticket but keep on driving as they need transportation to get to work and other necessities and then they get pulled over because they couldn't pay the ticket and the world crashes on top of them. They lose their car, they lose their job, they lose their shelter.
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A lot of jurisdictions will make an exception for necessary driving. There's special kinds of driving permits for exactly that situation. But obviously, that privilege only applies as long as you're driving within the law. And it's not the law's fault that someone who can't afford to pay a ticket decided to drive outside the law anyway.
 
theprestige said:
I'm not pointing to random videos. There's whole channels devoted to this sort of content. It makes up about half of my second-screen playlist on any given day. There are a *lot* of traffic violation repeat offenders out there. Not all of them are too rich to care. I've seen far too much of this kind of footage to accept the claim that poverty is an effective deterrent to commit traffic violations.

Why is this such a difficult concept for you to entertain?
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It is still cherrypicking. I'd agree that the videos could be evidence that a certain number of drivers don't care, but that's different. I don't know about the US but in the UK at least, driving whilst banned is far a more serious criminal offence.
 
I'm generally for it. I've been quite poor and there was a time when a ticket would have been devastating, now, not so much. I'm also for escalating fines for repeat offenders which should address some concerns in this thread.

Also, youtube videos aren't random, they are posted on account of someone's agenda. The state will post videos of cops looking like the good guys and citizens will more likely post footage of cops being ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊, especially if its particularly gross. So, sure, I'm sure your feed might be full of videos of ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊.
 
dirtywick said:
it seems like you're trying to say you don't believe me?

i don't think it's a great situation and i'm not arguing pro fines. but if you argument is that these people don't exist and it's a straw man to say they do, you're wrong. some people are just ◊◊◊◊◊◊ people, that's how it is.
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I don't disagree with the point that people get tickets and continue driving. I know that happens. My point isn't that there shouldn't be ramifications. But if we're going to have ramifications like that for some, we should have real ramifications for others.
 
jimbob said:
It is still cherrypicking. I'd agree that the videos could be evidence that a certain number of drivers don't care, but that's different.
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It's a lot of cherries. I'm sure the fear of crippling fines deters a lot of law-abiding poor people, though.

jimbob said:
I don't know about the US but in the UK at least, driving whilst banned is far a more serious criminal offence.
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US drivers have to work very hard, over many many traffic infractions, to graduate to serious criminal offenses.
 
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