Illinois Nazi Wins GOP Nomination...

[LTC8K6]

The GOP is apparently going to back an Independent or Write-in candidate in the election, so it will be hard for the Dems to make hay out of Jones, imo.

GOP ads will be for someone other than Jones, and Jones won't have much money to play with.

 

[Belz...]

Not at all. The reality we can take as our guide can be a reasonable one

Eta: you actually just gave a great example of leaping to the extreme, BTW

I see you're new to this poster.

 

[ponderingturtle]

Not at all. The reality we can take as our guide can be a reasonable one

Eta: you actually just gave a great example of leaping to the extreme, BTW

Sticking to promoting fake news like the new york times is a partisan attack and a pure example of the kind of partisanship polarizing you are fighting against though. We have to use more broadly respected sources like breitbart and infowars not fake new like CNN. Doing so is partisan polarization.

 

[ahhell]

You forgot senile as an option. He might have no idea who anyone is anymore broadly speaking.

That's really what I meant by demented. I hate to speculate on a subject I know very little about but, age related dementia would account for the noticeable decline in his public speaking over the last 20ish years and his lack of impulse control.

Maybe nations get age related dementia after 230 years or so?

 

[Thermal]

Sticking to promoting fake news like the new york times is a partisan attack and a pure example of the kind of partisanship polarizing you are fighting against though. We have to use more broadly respected sources like breitbart and infowars not fake new like CNN. Doing so is partisan polarization.

Or...just spitballing here...treat infowars like the outlier extreme it is and focus on real subjects? Like if a conservative says ' build the Wall!' maybe don't shout back 'Nazi!' Maybe start with, 'yeah, illegal immigration has some real problems...' and go from there?

 

[quadraginta]

<snip>

Eta: in practical terms, you are right and a sophisticated observer would get what happened. But branding is a real thing, and enough of it will give credence to the belief that Republicans are closet nazis.

That they seem to be standing there with the door open also lends credence to it.

I'm not sure if this is better or worse than when they kept the door closed and stayed in the closet. Better, I suppose, since at least it's out in the open, sort of.

 

[quadraginta]

Yes, many reasonable people will see it that way. Some observers, who may be concerned that the GOP is leaning more hard right, will see this as ominous. The President was recently criticized for saying there were good people on both sides in Charlottesville. I'm sure he was attempting to appear impartial or at least optimistic, but it came across as Nazi sympathizing. Isn't there enough needless demonizing without actual nazis allowed to run with an implied Repuclican endorsement?

It came across that way because that is what it was.

 

[ponderingturtle]

Or...just spitballing here...treat infowars like the outlier extreme it is and focus on real subjects? Like if a conservative says ' build the Wall!' maybe don't shout back 'Nazi!' Maybe start with, 'yeah, illegal immigration has some real problems...' and go from there?

And when the campaign slogan of building the wall is literally being used to harass students in our schools?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2016/11/17/white-texas-teens-chant-build-that-wall-at-hispanics-during-high-school-volleyball-match/?utm_term=.03e752313574

Yep remember nothing at all racist about that. Just a everyday political difference of who is a real american.

 

[theprestige]

I don't see how this is not obvious. It isn't about this district, which was going to go to the Democrat in November anyways. It is about public relations, and image. It is about how the Democrats can now beat the Republicans over the head with this because, as should be obvious from this thread, it looks really bad.

That's my point, though. It doesn't look really bad, unless it's hyped that way.

I mean you don't think it looks really bad, because you know the reality of the circumstance. You won't beat Republicans over the head with this, because you know it's not remotely as bad as some people want it to look. Right?

 

[quadraginta]

<snip>

Anyway I want to believe Jones will manage to get some 20 or even 30% of the votes. In the current political environments, he would have to be a total cretin to fail to achieve that goal.

Or publicly declare himself to be an atheist. That would do it.

Nazism, racism, pedophilia, sexual assault, giving aid to hostile foreign powers, etc., etc., those are all forgivable lapses to the modern Republican mindset.

As long as it's a Republican doing it, of course.

 

[quadraginta]

Reagan is turning over in his grave at what the GOP has become.

At this point it'd be profitable to install a turbine around him to generate electricity.

If that's the case then Eisenhower could probably power the entire country.

 

[Thermal]

That they seem to be standing there with the door open also lends credence to it.

I'm not sure if this is better or worse than when they kept the door closed and stayed in the closet. Better, I suppose, since at least it's out in the open, sort of.

Some are, certainly. But not all, or even most. I am not willing to paint all conservatives with the Nazi brush anymore. No one deserves to be backed into that corner by default.

 

[quadraginta]

Or...just spitballing here...treat infowars like the outlier extreme it is and focus on real subjects? Like if a conservative says ' build the Wall!' maybe don't shout back 'Nazi!' Maybe start with, 'yeah, illegal immigration has some real problems...' and go from there?

Been there. Done that. Whole tee shirt factories at full production.

You must not have been paying much attention. Trying to have reasoned discussion on the topic has been tried.

No Republican aspirant to public office would ever survive a primary if he stuck to trying to have reasoned discussion, or even tried it at all.

About anything, much less hot-button issues like immigration.

 

[Thermal]

And when the campaign slogan of building the wall is literally being used to harass students in our schools?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2016/11/17/white-texas-teens-chant-build-that-wall-at-hispanics-during-high-school-volleyball-match/?utm_term=.03e752313574

Yep remember nothing at all racist about that. Just a everyday political difference of who is a real american.

Yes. They are the extremes who should not factor in to civilized discourse. If someone advocates fiscal responsibility, small govt, and other traditionally conservative positions, I will not lump them in with the groups you keep bringing up. That is exactly the problem, thanks for demonstrating it so clearly.

 

[aleCcowaN]

It's an overwhelmingly Democratic district. The Republicans don't really have the votes to win the general election. Why would they want to waste time and money on an empty gesture?


The only void was the party not bothering to put forward a candidate for an election they wouldn't win anyway. Jones was not a "more extreme" candidate. Just a vanity candidate.

The candidate Republicans presented against centre-rightist Lipinski in 2014 gathered one third or the total vote, so I am not seeing the same you are.

That's why this Nazi likely is gonna get 20 to 30% of the votes -take it as a pre-prediction-, that is, some 35,000 to 55,000 votes (he already got 20,000 in the primaries).

 

[Fizil]

That's my point, though. It doesn't look really bad, unless it's hyped that way.

I mean you don't think it looks really bad, because you know the reality of the circumstance. You won't beat Republicans over the head with this, because you know it's not remotely as bad as some people want it to look. Right?

Are you saying you think Democratic strategists are like me, and won't want to exploit the stupid decision these primary voters made? It isn't like he won by default because he was the only candidate and got 1 vote. He got 20,000. You think they won't want to make hay about that?

Are you saying you think the average voter really thinks that deeply about politics? If they did, campaigns wouldn't take millions of dollars because ads would be near useless. While I usually like to look at things from the point of view that I probably represent a fairly average person, in this case I don't think I do. I may not be even remotely the most politically informed person on this board, I am certainly more politically informed than at least 2/3 of the people I interact with in my day to day life.

 

[aleCcowaN]

Or publicly declare himself to be an atheist. That would do it.

Nazism, racism, pedophilia, sexual assault, giving aid to hostile foreign powers, etc., etc., those are all forgivable lapses to the modern Republican mindset.

As long as it's a Republican doing it, of course.

Yes, but Democrats ain't no saints either.

 

[Thermal]

Been there. Done that. Whole tee shirt factories at full production.

You must not have been paying much attention. Trying to have reasoned discussion on the topic has been tried.

No Republican aspirant to public office would ever survive a primary if he stuck to trying to have reasoned discussion, or even tried it at all.

About anything, much less hot-button issues like immigration.

Yeah, I resigned to camping out in the gutter too. You simply cannot win down there. As fruitless as it may seem, the high road is the only way out.

Eta: you recall any of the Republican presidential candidates having reasonable positions? I can

 

[Dr. Keith]

It's an overwhelmingly Democratic district. The Republicans don't really have the votes to win the general election. Why would they want to waste time and money on an empty gesture?

As others have mentioned it looks bad to hear "GOP candidate and avowed Nazi" even if one understands the system.

More importantly: **** happens. No one thought Jones could beat Moore. No one thought Jack Ryan would have to withdraw and let Obama walk right over the GOP. I'm sure there are better examples, but those two were what came to mind.

Candidates are human and stuff comes out that voters care about. You have to have a decent candidate in the box ready to take advantage of those situations or you just look amateur.

 

[quadraginta]

Some are, certainly. But not all, or even most. I am not willing to paint all conservatives with the Nazi brush anymore. No one deserves to be backed into that corner by default.

I see that you switched from "Republican" to "conservative". Maybe you should sit down and rest for a little bit. Shoving those goal posts around like that has got to be exhausting.

My path has been in the other direction. I was willing to accept the idea that there were some Republicans who had not gone over to the dark side in the past, but at this point, after the displays of the last few years, I can no longer extend that benefit of the doubt.

Anyone who continues to choose to align themselves with the GOP after what we have seen done by that party and their leaders is not being "backed into a corner". They are consciously, mindfully choosing to go to it.

And openly sympathizing and supporting Nazis is only one expression of the direction they have taken.

Across the board, from the top of their Congressional leadership down to the lowest councilcretin they have made it clear that no lie is too extreme, no slur is too low, no action too unethical or immoral, even by their own standards ... such as they are.

And the people who vote for them no longer have any right to claim to be better. They are enablers. Knowing, willing enablers.