I Am Soul

jond said:
Well, let's see: smug, condescending, arrogant, knows all the answers, but they're hidden secrets that have to be unlocked if you open your mind and follow me. No, nothing like what you write. Sorry, my mistake.
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Your apology is accepted: You are mistaking me for in-articulett, but I understand your confusion.
 
"Sooner or later the moment comes, your consciousness opens its wings and flies towards its home" - Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh
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Home would be India after being convicted of immigration fraud and subsequent deportation.
 
Tricky said: Of course, but being an internet forum, there is little more that one can do besides tell. Even providing links to studies of OBEs and NDEs won't do much, because in the "internet of a trillion lies", you can find links that support almost any contention.

All we can do here is provide rationality and logic. I have seen them work before. It's a beautiful thing.
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hahaha the internet of a trillion lies .............Yes but you see....

I can still distinguish different aspects of people online and therefore determine whose reasoning best suits my belief system, so if someone is conveying a message with arrogance......well then......it sort of stops the process of understanding. It's just about subject positioning , some people say "Tell me, tell me how this can be so..........." in big booming voices..whereas another person person might say "Can you please show me how to do this?" or "Would you like me to show you how?" in a way that is not so over the top. This is what I mean when I say the difference between telling and showing. You can definately show how to do something on the internet. It happens all the time.

Being rigorously rational and logical is fantastic and with that, I know even though I say something as clearly as possible ....people will still hear something completely different to what I am intending to convey...you know????



Reason and logic and the soul....what a combination :D

and you lot are joking about that video......I can tell :)
 
breathe said:
I can still distinguish different aspects of people online and therefore determine whose reasoning best suits my belief system, so if someone is conveying a message with arrogance......well then......it sort of stops the process of understanding.
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I understand that completely. The messenger is the message. Most of us respond more positively to people who disagree with us if they are not arrogant in doing so. On these boards, we have believers who come in here to discuss and believers who come in here to preach. You can imagine which is better received. The same is true in reverse when a skeptic is talking to believers.

breathe said:
It's just about subject positioning , some people say "Tell me, tell me how this can be so..........." in big booming voices..whereas another person person might say "Can you please show me how to do this?" or "Would you like me to show you how?" in a way that is not so over the top. This is what I mean when I say the difference between telling and showing. You can definately show how to do something on the internet. It happens all the time.
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It depends on what it is. For example, Navigator and I have both had OBEs and we can both describe them, but neither can show that our description is an accurate one. I can point to links that show that my kind are common, he can do likewise. I feel like the difference is that my explanations rely on phenomenon that are known to exist, wheres his require some things that, by all accounts, are supernatural.

But all we can do is talk. We can't show. I can't (and wouldn't want to) make you have an OBE.

breathe said:
Being rigorously rational and logical is fantastic and with that, I know even though I say something as clearly as possible ....people will still hear something completely different to what I am intending to convey...you know????
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LOL. "Still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest." -- Paul Simon
Yeah. I know. It really is hard, especially in a forum where only words, not voice and body language, are conveyed. Still I like this medium for a number of reasons. It lets me consider carefully what I want to say before I push the "submit" button. It let's me screen out those voices that are shrill and low-content, and it allows me to respond point-by-point to what someone else has said. You can't do that in a chat room and certainly not in a "live" conversation.

breathe said:
Reason and logic and the soul....what a combination :D
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Yes, those are three very interesting human inventions.:D

breathe said:
and you lot are joking about that video......I can tell :)
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I am not sure to which video you refer. I often don't watch them. Not enough hours in my day. But people joke a lot around here. Some forget to use the smilies.:)
 
Tricky said:
I understand that completely. The messenger is the message. Most of us respond more positively to people who disagree with us if they are not arrogant in doing so. On these boards, we have believers who come in here to discuss and believers who come in here to preach. You can imagine which is better received. The same is true in reverse when a skeptic is talking to believers.
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This is human nature but to me it also infers that many people here actually are not so interested in discerning any truth that might exist. They simply react to information depending on how it is presented.

Someone who tells me they will not believe me unless I present them with something in a certain way, well, I'm going to need quite a big motivation to bother, personally. Essentially, they are saying "Please manipulate me."

It's very common, I find. Everyone believes what they feel is best, or most likely to be true, not based around assessing anything for themselves, but based around their judgments of the person presenting it to them. It is rather amusing for a forum that ostensibly prides itself on its objectivity.

Nick
 
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Nick227 said:
This is human nature but to me it also infers that many people here actually are not so interested in discerning any truth that might exist. They simply react to information depending on how it is presented.

Someone who tells me they will not believe me unless I present them with something in a certain way, well, I'm going to need quite a big motivation to bother, personally. Essentially, they are saying "Please manipulate me."

It's very common, I find. Everyone believes what they feel is best, or most likely to be true, not based around assessing anything for themselves, but based around their judgments of the person presenting it to them. It is rather amusing for a forum that ostensibly prides itself on its objectivity.

Nick
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I disagree. Most here only require compelling evidence for extraordinary claims. That evidence in never forthcoming.

M.
 
Nick227 said:
Someone who tells me they will not believe me unless I present them with something in a certain way, well, I'm going to need quite a big motivation to bother, personally. Essentially, they are saying "Please manipulate me."

It's very common, I find. Everyone believes what they feel is best, or most likely to be true, not based around assessing anything for themselves, but based around their judgments of the person presenting it to them. It is rather amusing for a forum that ostensibly prides itself on its objectivity.

Nick
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I do so-called believe that you believe what you believe to be true, but this does still not make it true.

I wish that I could find a short video of a South American backwoods tribesman talking about how he believes things in his world are, his reality, which if you heard you would know at once that this is not reality has we have found it to be. But for him it works, he survives with his memes, but in all honesty they are still wrong.

And when someone ask someone to prove a statement, this is being objective, it is not a judgment. It becomes a judgment when it is woo-woo.

Paul

:) :) :)
 
After some extreme experiences, there seems to be a fine line between interpreting it as objectively true or just settle for it to be subjective. What adds to the confusion seems to be how we talk about them. The following picture is probably well known, but in a way it serves to show how we cannot always trust our intuition to give us the correct analysis. The tables – their area – are identical, yet they seem so very different.


tables1.jpg
 
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