Merged Hugo Chavez Esta Muerto

[Ziggurat]

Well, he was a Rolex man. Along with Castro and Che.

 

[trustbutverify]

Well, he was a Rolex man. Along with Castro and Che.

I guess today's defender of the impoverished is required to wear an imperialist produced timepiece costing as much as an expensive car.

 

[JihadJane]

'Chavez: farewell to neoliberalism's nemesis

Chavez proved that radical policies work and win support and that defiance of US imperialism is possible and popular - Chris Nineham writes on why he will be missed in every corner of the globe'

One of the great figures of the 21st Century has died. At a time of universal mediocrity and ubiquitous buy-in to neoliberal orthodoxy, Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez stood out amongst politicians as a massive personality of independence, principle and courage. He didn’t just speak about socialism and social justice, he ensured his successive governments delivered measures that genuinely improved the lives of millions of people in his country, particularly the poorest. His charisma and radicalism was such that it is no exaggeration to say his example helped produce progressive governments and movements across the region.

His galvanising presence and his left wing politics were themselves the product of a widespread grass-roots radicalisation. The neoliberal policies that Pinochet brutally pioneered in Chile in the 1970s were rolled out accross the continent from the early 1980s onwards. Venezuelan President Carlos Andrez Perez broke with his corporatist past to introduce the IMF backed ‘Great Turn’ at the end of the 1980s. Between 1981 and 1997 the richest 10% of Venezuelans saw their share of national income grow from 22 to 33%. The Venezuelan poor responded to the turn too with occupations, mass protests and riots popularly known as the Caracazo.

Inspired by this movement, the young Hugo Chavez, then a junior officer in the Venezuelan army, launched a long-prepared coup attempt in 1992. The coup had popular support, but was headed off by the Perez government. On his arrest Chavez made a characteristically courageous statement, “unfortunately” he said, “for the moment the objectives that we set ourselves have not been achieved…New possibilities will arise and the country will be able to move definitely towards a better future.” Instantly the red beret of Chavez’s parachute regiment and the phrase ‘for the moment’ became symbols of resistance amongst the country’s poor.

 

[Virus]

Wouldn't Chavez's Venezuela be an argument for neoliberalism? Since he trashed the economy with iron-fisted economic controls?

 

[L.Y.S.]

If that were true, Chavez wouldn't get out of prison in 1994.
The opposition aren't saints, but they are vastly better. Not that it's hard.

McHrozni

Not really bro, people were overpaying for basic necessities like water and food. And it pushed most average people to the brink. Hence why Chavez's was more attractive to most. And despite the fact, Chavez has actually done SOMETHINGS in comparison to other régimes. The previous couple of régimes were far more inadequate than Chavez's.

 

[McHrozni]

Wouldn't Chavez's Venezuela be an argument for neoliberalism? Since he trashed the economy with iron-fisted economic controls?

It's the usual idiocity - the poor have a slightly bigger piece of cake, thus Hugo good, neoliberals bad. That the cake became much smaller, despite record breaking oil profits is ignored, imperial propaganda and so on.

The best thing you can do is not to feed the troll.

McHrozni

 

[L.Y.S.]

Wouldn't Chavez's Venezuela be an argument for neoliberalism? Since he trashed the economy with iron-fisted economic controls?

Dumb ass, neoliberalism is deregulation and laissez-faire economics. The exact opposite of iron-fisted controls.

 

[McHrozni]

Not really bro, people were overpaying for basic necessities like water and food. And it pushed most average people to the brink. Hence why Chavez's was more attractive to most. And despite the fact, Chavez has actually done SOMETHINGS in comparison to other régimes. The previous couple of régimes were far more inadequate than Chavez's.

Maybe, but if the previous regime were as bad as Hugo, he'd either die in prison, or be forced into exile. Hugo has made some small improvements, but the price was completely out of proportions to the benefits. He ruined a fledgling democracy and run the economy in the ground. This wlill hurt Venezuelan poor in the long run far, far more than they will ever benefit from the 'socialism'.

McHrozni

 

[L.Y.S.]

Maybe, but if the previous regime were as bad as Hugo, he'd either die in prison, or be forced into exile. Hugo has made some small improvements, but the price was completely out of proportions to the benefits. He ruined a fledgling democracy and run the economy in the ground. This wlill hurt Venezuelan poor in the long run far, far more than they will ever benefit from the 'socialism'.

McHrozni

The economy was already destroyed from the inception of Venezuela. It didn't matter if it was a conservative military junta or a liberal communist coup. It was the same crap. The problem lies in Venezuela itself.

 

[McHrozni]

The economy was already destroyed from the inception of Venezuela. It didn't matter if it was a conservative military junta or a liberal communist coup. It was the same crap. The problem lies in Venezuela itself.

Except, of course, that all sectors of the economy declined, across the board. The only thing that kept the illusion of prosperity going have been the historically high oil prices. Yes, Venezuelan economy was bad before Hugo, but it's significantly worse now, mainly due to his actions. There is no excuse for that.

McHrozni

 

[dudalb]

That Chavez's policies have pretty much wrecked Venezula's policies seems beyond the capacity of some people to understand.

 

[JihadJane]

An in-depth look at Chávez' legacy:

'What Chávez Left Behind: The Streets of a Continent and a Bolivarian Revolution of Everyday Life'

Beyond this regional influence, some of Chávez’s greatest legacies are not in the presidential palace, but in the streets, factories and neighborhoods of Venezuela, among the activists, workers and neighbors who have built the Bolivarian Revolution from the bottom up.

 

[dudalb]

An in-depth look at Chávez' legacy:

'What Chávez Left Behind: The Streets of a Continent and a Bolivarian Revolution of Everyday Life'

Funny, we hear this about every Marxist Regime just before it collapses.....

 

[tyr_13]

He left behind a staggering murder rate, inflation and devaluation of the currency, massive food shortages, the need for price controls on more than 400 items so that the poor can eat, the elimination of all exports besides oil, rolling blackouts despite nationalization of the electric companies and being an energy exporter, and crumbling infrastructure. Even compared to other Latin American countries it's bad.

I had always assumed that much of the criticism of him was just right-wing hatred, although I also thought he was bad. His death has given me reason to research a little though, and the above is just the obvious quantifiable stuff. It doesn't even include the Jew-bashing and destruction of journalistic freedoms or the damage to the long term political ecosystem.

 

[Virus]

An in-depth look at Chávez' legacy:

'What Chávez Left Behind: The Streets of a Continent and a Bolivarian Revolution of Everyday Life'

You can't eat a "Bolivarian Revolution of Everyday Life".

 

[Arcade22]

He left behind a staggering murder rate, inflation and devaluation of the currency, massive food shortages, the need for price controls on more than 400 items so that the poor can eat, the elimination of all exports besides oil, rolling blackouts despite nationalization of the electric companies and being an energy exporter, and crumbling infrastructure. Even compared to other Latin American countries it's bad.

But he gave the poor bread, circuses and hope so we must have respect for him!

 

[angrysoba]

Actually, David Aaronovitch had an interesting article on Chavez, in particular explaining why it was that so many people still enthusiastically voted for him, which they did despite claims that Chavez was dictator.

It also appears that he didn't kill anyone, which is odd because I have heard him being compared to Josef Stalin!

 

[McHrozni]

It also appears that he didn't kill anyone, which is odd because I have heard him being compared to Josef Stalin!

An odd claim, to say the least.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...uela/9769897/Venezuela-murder-rate-soars.html

He has about a hundred thousand excess violent deaths under his belt. It's not Stalin or Pol Pot, but hardly a paragon of virtue. You could claim he never personally murdered anybody, but you could also say the same about Stalin.

McHrozni

 

[angrysoba]

An odd claim, to say the least.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...uela/9769897/Venezuela-murder-rate-soars.html

He has about a hundred thousand excess violent deaths under his belt. It's not Stalin or Pol Pot, but hardly a paragon of virtue. You could claim he never personally murdered anybody, but you could also say the same about Stalin.

McHrozni

Stalin ordered the deaths of millions, so yes he did murder people. To claim that Stalin was not a murderer is a lie. To claim that Chavez is not a murderer is not.

The deaths you are pointing to are from violent crime. You may as well look at violent crime figures in the US and say that the victims were killed by the president of the US.

 

[blobru]

Actually, David Aaronovitch had an interesting article on Chavez, in particular explaining why it was that so many people still enthusiastically voted for him, which they did despite claims that Chavez was dictator. --

Site's asking me for a login; here's one where they're not.

And the Neruda poem, "The United Fruit Co.", cited.

How exploitation begat dictatorship. Good article.