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How do you fight?

Kiwiwriter said:
You might, in addition to the material above, point out to your brother how many times in human history there have been opportunities for the glorious New World Order conspiracy (and it's the same conspiracy all through, it just changes names to fit present politics) has been on the edge of taking over everything, but somehow failed. Look at the nutty stuff put out in the 1920s by Henry Ford about "The International Jew." It's exactly the same as the anti-Semitic drivel of today, with just the names changed.
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Not to mention the NWO (presumably) were the power behind the Romans, so at one point they DID rule the world (the bits anyone knew about, anyway) and yet they screwed it all up.

After the Great Plague of the 14th C probably would have been an excellent opportunity aswell.

-Gumboot
 
Roland;

If you havent already found them, there are a number of typed up articles by a user named "Gravy" aka Mark Roberts. He is one of the best researchers here, and also acts, intentionally or not (not sure), as the bane of the truth movement. Anything written by him you can take to the bank wrt reliability, and thoroughness. His paper on WTC7 is PARTICULARLY thorough.

TAM:)
 
JAStewart said:
I was just wondering what are your ways of combatting conspiracy theorists? I ask because for the second time in a month, I've been at uni and glanced over at someones computer only to see them watching a 9/11 video and so I tear a lil' bit of paper outta my notepad and just silently hand them a list of sites: 911 myths, this forum section, SLC, WTC7 lies paper, lolloosechange.
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I do what I can. Debating conspiracy theorists on this forum. Me? I'm a 911 truther. We don't believe in the Bush adm conspiracy theory. We use our rational and critical faculties to expose such baseless fantasies.

To believe in such BS, after all the lies,you have to be a real Bush lover.
 
pagan said:
I do what I can. Debating conspiracy theorists on this forum. Me? I'm a 911 truther. We don't believe in the Bush adm conspiracy theory. We use our rational and critical faculties to expose such baseless fantasies.

To believe in such BS, after all the lies,you have to be a real Bush lover.
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I haven't seen you use your rational and critical faculties yet. You just repeat yourself and troll (and yes, I'm falling for it).

To repeat the rebuttal to your statement:

1. it's evidence that counts, not who it appears to favour; hence

2. plenty of posters here disapprove of Bush, personally I think he is a disgrace.

Do you get a kick out these idiotic repetitive postings?
 
Twice students told me, "Miss, you have to watch LC, the government did it!". So I watched it and I was horrified. It would be ethically unacceptable for me to say, "Kids, 9/11 was NOT an inside job, you're wrong." Instead, I had them pick any conspiracy theory they wanted, research information on both sides, and using logical arguments we had discussed in class, come to their own conclusions on what was evidence and what was Internet BS.

Not one of these 16 & 17 year-olds who researched 9/11 came away from the assignment believing it was an inside job.

I'm going to do this assignment every year for the rest of my teaching career and encourage my colleagues to do the same.

Thank you Dylan Avery, thanks to your dumb movie, thousands and thousands of NYC high school students will NEVER believe your lies.
 
Alt+F4 said:
Twice students told me, "Miss, you have to watch LC, the government did it!". So I watched it and I was horrified. It would be ethically unacceptable for me to say, "Kids, 9/11 was NOT an inside job, you're wrong." Instead, I had them pick any conspiracy theory they wanted, research information on both sides, and using logical arguments we had discussed in class, come to their own conclusions on what was evidence and what was Internet BS.

Not one of these 16 & 17 year-olds who researched 9/11 came away from the assignment believing it was an inside job.

I'm going to do this assignment every year for the rest of my teaching career and encourage my colleagues to do the same.

Thank you Dylan Avery, thanks to your dumb movie, thousands and thousands of NYC high school students will NEVER believe your lies.
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I think it's a good lesson in logic and critical thinking- and in a sense- skepticism. If I were a teacher, I would do exactly what you're doing. Telling them "it's wrong" accomplishes nothing, but helping them understand will prepare them for similar fights in the future, I think.

Thank you for that.
 
Totovader said:
I think it's a good lesson in logic and critical thinking- and in a sense- skepticism. If I were a teacher, I would do exactly what you're doing. Telling them "it's wrong" accomplishes nothing, but helping them understand will prepare them for similar fights in the future, I think.

Thank you for that.
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Well I try...One kid is still convinced, beyond a doubt, that the Loch Ness monster is real. :)
 
Alt+F4 said:
Twice students told me, "Miss, you have to watch LC, the government did it!". So I watched it and I was horrified. It would be ethically unacceptable for me to say, "Kids, 9/11 was NOT an inside job, you're wrong." Instead, I had them pick any conspiracy theory they wanted, research information on both sides, and using logical arguments we had discussed in class, come to their own conclusions on what was evidence and what was Internet BS.

Not one of these 16 & 17 year-olds who researched 9/11 came away from the assignment believing it was an inside job.

I'm going to do this assignment every year for the rest of my teaching career and encourage my colleagues to do the same.

Thank you Dylan Avery, thanks to your dumb movie, thousands and thousands of NYC high school students will NEVER believe your lies.
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Interesting.

A similar experience was behind the Zembla-program on 9/11 (the Dutch program Truthers only remember because of Jowenko's statement).

Students at the Delft University of Technology saw Loose Change, were convinced, and went to their professor to get his opinion. Instead of saying it's BS, he made it into a small summer project.
For two weeks they studied the physics of the WTC collapse and the Pentagon crash, and of course concluded that the standard version was accurate.
In the program the students reported on their studies, and vented their anger at Loose Change for lying to them.
 
You guys are Top Shelf. Top Notch. I appreciate you all. The different viewpoints are only solidifying my research/ammo gathering. Thank you. It is amazing just how easy it is to sway people these people with crap information. I don't claim to be a doctor, or an engineer, but I do have two degrees, several technical certs, and cannot for the life of me understand why people buy the Theory BS so easily. Feelings of inadequacy? Low self esteem? Social inadequacy?

The member gathering tactics rival those that Al Qaeda uses to bring in their "members."
 
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Alt+F4 said:
Twice students told me, "Miss, you have to watch LC, the government did it!". So I watched it and I was horrified. It would be ethically unacceptable for me to say, "Kids, 9/11 was NOT an inside job, you're wrong." Instead, I had them pick any conspiracy theory they wanted, research information on both sides, and using logical arguments we had discussed in class, come to their own conclusions on what was evidence and what was Internet BS.

Not one of these 16 & 17 year-olds who researched 9/11 came away from the assignment believing it was an inside job.

I'm going to do this assignment every year for the rest of my teaching career and encourage my colleagues to do the same.

Thank you Dylan Avery, thanks to your dumb movie, thousands and thousands of NYC high school students will NEVER believe your lies.
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Heh. I do the same thing in my public speaking classes at FAMU and FSU.
 
RolandtheGunslinger said:
The member gathering tactics rival those that Al Qaeda uses to bring in their "members."
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Actually that's a good point. I am sure you could draw enormous parallels between Terrorist recruitment tactics and those employed by the Truth Movement. (Such as building on pre-existing bias, misrepresenting information, quote mining, etc...)

-Gumboot
 
Sadly, I know several CTers, and worse, they're my friends! One believes in David Icke's 'the world is run by shape-shifting lizards' another is a 9/11er and another is convinced the moon landings were faked. I try to talk calmly and reasonably with them, but they always just dismiss any arguements I come up with and it often ends in an awful shouting match.

It's fascinating that someone with, like, no interest in the space program at all can become an 'instant expert' on exactly how things should behave on another world. Much as I love 'em, I'm trying desperately to use these CTer friends to improve my skeptical skills and learn to argue more effectively.

This forum is kinda like my sanctuary of rationalism when I'm overwhelmed with despair at my otherwise quite intelligent mates. The brilliant ideas I read here are like an oasis of clear, critical thinking in a woo-woo world.
 
Sorry, accidental multiple posting due to dodgy connection and I don't know how to delete!
 
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Sorry, accidental multiple posting due to dodgy connection and I don't know how to delete!
 
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Sorry, accidental multiple posting due to dodgy connection and I don't know how to delete!
 
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