Cont: House Impeachment Inquiry - part 3

[acbytesla]

Of course! I know in my own personal life, when something goes wrong I generally get the best results from doing absolutely nothing and pretending as if everything is just A-OK.

I mean really? What are they supposed to do?

 

[Delphic Oracle]

I mean really? What are they supposed to do?

I reccomend exchanging a series of judgemental glances followed by staring at the ground and kind of shuffling our feet awkwardly.

Works every time, right?

 

[acbytesla]

I reccomend exchanging a series of judgemental glances followed by staring at the ground and kind of shuffling our feet awkwardly.

Works every time, right?

I really can't think of a worse strategy. No offense MM. Ignoring it would be more dangerous to not only the Democratic Party but more importantly the nation.

To the Democratic Party. It says you are weak. A lot of people turned out in the midterms and entrusted you with the House to hold the Orange Man in check. And what did you do? Nothing.

To the nation. Not responding to such a blatant abuse of power says to POTUS, they don't dare to challenge my power. I can do what I want. This is a guy who doesn't understand the Constitution and thinks it gives him unlimited power.

 

[P.J. Denyer]

It's off-topic, but i've never liked the accusation being made about a thread being 'bobbed'. it's personal by definition. my view is that BTC's arguments are sometimes confusing because we make assumptions about his base logic that are wrong. He is always civil and that counts for far more, in my view, than anything else. I've felt frustrated in arguments with him, only to realise that it was my own misunderstanding that caused it. [/o-t]

Yeah, he's a poster I'm often tempted to block, but then once in a while he makes a point, or asks a question, that cuts right to the heart of the matter. He certainly provides a different perspective.

 

[Cabbage]

But I only have one vote.



I do not think it's the most outlandish thing a president has ever done. I don't think it's a crisis that rocks America to its foundations.

Most importantly, if someone tells me that they don't see it as a scandal, or they see it as a very minor scandal of very little consequence, I don't hate them for it.


I don't think he ought to get away with it. However, by impeaching him, I fear that the Democrats will end up letting him get away with it. Some of you will find that combination of statements puzzling.

Oh, and just to be clear: I DO understand what you are saying. I am simply saying you are wrong.

 

[Aridas]

To be fair, the idea that Donald Trump could hold a conversation with someone and walk away not knowing who that person was or not remembering that person's role in the conversation doesn't seem implausible. He is both narcissistic and delusional. There's no particular reason to believe that he has actual awareness of who he is talking to at all times.

He's narcissistic. The delusional part is not so well evidenced, though, especially to the level that would warrant using it as relevant here.

And if he just happens to demand firing an ambassador during that conversation, for most people that would be a pretty big deal and strong evidence that they were actually engaged in that conversation as a serious matter, but for Trump it could just be an impulsive outburst forgotten before dessert. He obviously didn't act on his own demand that Yovanovitch be fired at the time, so it's quite possible that he just forgot, and no one reminded him. A year later, the subject came up again and this time she was actually fired.

Maybe. I'd suggest that it's much more likely that he later hit roadblocks to doing so, though. Roadblocks like staff dissuading him, quietly refusing to convey his orders, refusing to actually implement the orders, him not knowing that he actually had the power to directly fire her, him being too much of a coward to fire her directly and risk personal confrontation (like seems to be the case with a number of other firings that he did or tried to do, with additional "no hard feelings, I was forced to do it" apology calls after a firing actually happening at times), and so on.

Trump will weather this storm and be reelected. Watch for looting, rioting, assaults, and fires being set. The left-wingers aka Socialists are very sore losers.

It's very possible that rioting will happen if people lose faith in even the ballot box being a valid way to hold accountable a guy who's made it perfectly clear that he's trying to destroy the ability of the people to hold him accountable via the ballot box.

Yeah, wouldn't it be crazy if they started blowing up Federal buildings, assassinating doctors, firebombing black churches, shooting up synagogues, sending bombs in the mail, and murdering dozens in El Paso.

This delusions that 'the left' is going to 'start' the political violence is a truly pathetic attempt at owning victim-hood. Trump has encouraged violence. That is on him and supports just like you. Have some personal responsibility.

As Tyr notes, the extremists on the right have long since been engaging in terrorism to try to accomplish their goals that they don't think they can get to happen via the ballot box.

 

[acbytesla]

Yeah, he's a poster I'm often tempted to block, but then once in a while he makes a point, or asks a question, that cuts right to the heart of the matter. He certainly provides a different perspective.

The problem with engaging Bob even when he poses a good question or occasionally a good point is where he goes from there. He has a unique way of pushing anything beyond reasonable to the ridiculous. You'll find yourself discussing the absurd and the inane.

That is being "bobbed".

 

[Paul2]

I do not think it's the most outlandish thing a president has ever done. I don't think it's a crisis that rocks America to its foundations.

Only if you ignore the larger context - his lack of contrition, as well as all the other anti-democratic moves he has made up to this point, and the anti-democratic moves he will no doubt feel empowered to undertake once he is acquitted.

 

[TellyKNeasuss]

I do not think it's the most outlandish thing a president has ever done. I don't think it's a crisis that rocks America to its foundations.

Most importantly, if someone tells me that they don't see it as a scandal, or they see it as a very minor scandal of very little consequence, I don't hate them for it.

Do you also think this about the obstruction charge? Do you believe that a president ordering people who work for him to ignore legally-issued subpoenas and refusing to turn over documents for inspection by Congress, essentially asserting that a president is immune from any oversight or investigation by Congress, does not rock America to its foundations?

I don't think he ought to get away with it. However, by impeaching him, I fear that the Democrats will end up letting him get away with it. Some of you will find that combination of statements puzzling.

How would not impeaching Trump help prevent Trump from getting away with it?

 

[TellyKNeasuss]

According to the New York Times, the draft of John Bolton's new book states that Trump withheld aid to Ukraine for political purposes.


https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/26/...w47-CJ2yI98sMkbo3piQYRtIv-O8wCrEVZmu5VB1utG3Y


Of course, given that the book has to pass through an inspection by the NSA, any such statement is likely to be censored.

 

[Stacyhs]

According to the New York Times, the draft of John Bolton's new book states that Trump withheld aid to Ukraine for political purposes.


https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/26/...w47-CJ2yI98sMkbo3piQYRtIv-O8wCrEVZmu5VB1utG3Y


Of course, given that the book has to pass through an inspection by the NSA, any such statement is likely to be censored.

No wonder the WH is so frightened of Bolton and desperate to keep new witnesses from testifying.

If Bolton really cares about this country, he needs to go public with this immediately upon the Republican senators voting to disallow witnesses (which is likely).

 

[BrooklynBaby]

Why Schiff is hiding the 179 page transcript of his interview with ICIG Atkinson:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/brons...still-confident-trump-gets-acquitted-n2560132

 

[Minoosh]

How would not impeaching Trump help prevent Trump from getting away with it?

And not impeaching carried a risk of its own. I think it's fine that the House decided to draw the line where it did. The phone call and the circumstances around it were too blatant to just ignore. Schiff
asked at some point - if that's not impeachable behavior, what would be?

I might prefer more of a rock-star candidate, but I really can't fault Democrats for their impeachment proceedings. Even knowing the odds in the Senate are zilch I think they did the right thing.

 

[Stacyhs]

And not impeaching carried a risk of its own. I think it's fine that the House decided to draw the line where it did. The phone call and the circumstances around it were too blatant to just ignore. Schiff
asked at some point - if that's not impeachable behavior, what would be?

I might prefer more of a rock-star candidate, but I really can't fault Democrats for their impeachment proceedings. Even knowing the odds in the Senate are zilch I think they did the right thing.

Agreed.

 

[BobTheCoward]

Why Schiff is hiding the 179 page transcript of his interview with ICIG Atkinson:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/brons...still-confident-trump-gets-acquitted-n2560132

It isn't being mentioned because you don't talk about evidence not part of your case when you are prosecuting.

Also, the article called what the whistleblower did potentially exculpatory. Tu exculpate means, "to clear from alleged fault or guilt."

Even if the whistleblower was George Soros himself, how could any of his behavior clear Trump for fault or guilt of anything he said to the Ukraine leader or anyone in his service?

 

[acbytesla]

It isn't being mentioned because you don't talk about evidence not part of your case when you are prosecuting.

Also, the article called what the whistleblower did potentially exculpatory. Tu exculpate means, "to clear from alleged fault or guilt."

Even if the whistleblower was George Soros himself, how could any of his behavior clear Trump for fault or guilt of anything he said to the Ukraine leader or anyone in his service?

 

[Minoosh]

Why Schiff is hiding the 179 page transcript of his interview with ICIG Atkinson:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/brons...still-confident-trump-gets-acquitted-n2560132

The Democrats keep insisting on new witnesses. How about we hear from the old one first?

It would be a simple matter for the Senate to subpoena this witness. Think they'll take Townhall up on the request?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Why Schiff is hiding the 179 page transcript of his interview with ICIG Atkinson:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/brons...still-confident-trump-gets-acquitted-n2560132

Let me guess, maybe because that testimony outs the whistleblower.

CNN:

Washington (CNN)The intelligence community inspector general provided documents to the House Intelligence Committee showing how he attempted to corroborate a whistleblower complaint alleging President Donald Trump solicited foreign interference to dig up dirt on Joe Biden, according to two sources familiar with the matter.

Intelligence community inspector general Michael Atkinson briefed the House Intelligence panel behind closed doors today about the whistleblower complaint, two weeks after he appeared before the same committee prior to the complaint being released.
The sources added that Atkinson's testimony mostly covered the process of corroborating the complaint.

Otherwise, you tell us what Atkinson said the Democrats don't want to come out. The Fox News version is the same ********. Despite not needing the whistleblower complaint to prove what has already been proven, the Trumper lie is nothing more than a distraction.

As if finding the whistleblower would somehow negate the overwhelming evidence.

Yep, and finding a couple warrants for Carter Page were invalid negates the whole Mueller report.

Here's another one, get rid of the Affordable Care Act (Obama Care) and the GOP will tell us what their replacement plan is.

Elect Nixon and he has a secret plan to end the Vietnam War.


Hmmmm, guess they learned it from the best.

 

[TellyKNeasuss]

Another NY Times article on Bolton's book:


https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/26/...Mmqs6wCl-SAsm9jtDJYfG6hBoSDhfQpAfUU0ui8vs2RLg

 

[acbytesla]

It would be a simple matter for the Senate to subpoena this witness. Think they'll take Townhall up on the request?

Why not just go to those in the loop? I'm sure if Trump is innocent, he wouldn't mind if Mulvaney, Giuliani and Bolton testified. Trump can clear this all up if Schiff and the House made a mistake by providing the Senate with everything.

If us Democrats got it all wrong, be forthright with everything.

Its all a hoax. Except the fact that EVERYTHING has been corroborated.