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Heeeeeeere's Obamacare!

sir drinks-a-lot said:
??? Sorry, what did I miss?
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The part about clear incentives. Your example is pretty straightforward.

Definitely disagree on this one. I don't think you'll find much agreement on this board as to what constitutes Libertarianism.
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I don't know, the basics are pretty clear, but one things for certain that libertarians are pretty much all against mixed markets and all the evidence has shown those to be the most successful.
 
Pvt. Stash said:
Edited by jhunter1163: 
Moderated content removed.
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Every libertarian I've ever talked to has been against government interference in the market except to protect contracts and property. If you've created a whole new sub-branch of libertarianism we can take it to the appropriate subforum.
 
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sir drinks-a-lot said:
I guess you're right on smaller scales and in obvious high profile cases as Papa John's pizza which MM posted above. But his original phrase seemed to suggest more of a wholesale phenomenon.
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I think it's one of those that defies any blanket statement. I know lots of people who deplore Walmart, for example, but who can't afford to avoid it. Sometimes pragmatism wins out over principles. So it ends up being a mixed bag.
 
MattusMaximus said:
The phrase "herding cats" comes to mind :)
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More or less.

I view libertarianism as a very loosely related set of principles, not a codified ideology. And the problem with a set of principles is that they're subject to pragmatic negotiation, as well as interference from any number of other values - especially religion.

At one point in time, I referred to myself as libertarian, because it seemed to most closely align with the principles that I hold most dear. unfortunately, I've found that far too many libertarians are complete nutters. I still value individualism, self-sufficiency, and non-aggression as guiding principles... but I recognize them as ideals. And ideals are eminently unattainable. They're north stars. They're the guideline I use in informing my decisions, and in weighing my trade-offs. But they're not dogma, and they're not without cost. They're one of many things I value.

So now I just call myself a principled pragmatic :)
 
So I picked a plan and signed up and I thought I'd share my experience about it.

I looked through all of the plans, and as I've mentioned previously, I decided on continuing to pay the same I'm paying now and upgrade my plan. We've spent enough on healthcare in the last few years that this seemed like a good idea. So thanks to Emily Cat, I decided to go directly through Moda's website and purchase the plan. However, since the plan we thought we wanted was an exchange plan, they had to run me through an agent. I submitted my email and a few days later an agent contacted me. I had him check again to make sure there weren't other carriers with better deals, and when Moda's still seemed like the best deal, we went forward. As it turned out, the plan I wanted wasn't an exchange only plan (it's a misconception that only exchange plans can be purchased). He told me that the Oregon exchange is STILL not functional and that this was a cause for concern.

http://www.koin.com/news/oregon/cover-oregon-hiring-400-temp-workers

As they say here, they are ramping up on call center workers to input the applications manually.

My agent asked me a total of THREE questions. My age, whether I smoked, and my SSN. Same for my wife. No questions about health, pre-existing conditions, or prior coverage were necessary. It was amazing, considering that in March, we had to fill out 3 separate applications only to find out that Mrs. Unabogie could not be covered at all, and that we had to go through that SOCIALIST Oregon state coverage.

The next step is that Moda will send us our enrollment packet, we'll pay the first premium, and starting January 1st, we'll be on a gold plan.

And as I keep mentioning, we'll be paying less than we are now.
 
Unabogie said:
So I picked a plan and signed up and I thought I'd share my experience about it.

I looked through all of the plans, and as I've mentioned previously, I decided on continuing to pay the same I'm paying now and upgrade my plan. We've spent enough on healthcare in the last few years that this seemed like a good idea. So thanks to Emily Cat, I decided to go directly through Moda's website and purchase the plan. However, since the plan we thought we wanted was an exchange plan, they had to run me through an agent. I submitted my email and a few days later an agent contacted me. I had him check again to make sure there weren't other carriers with better deals, and when Moda's still seemed like the best deal, we went forward. As it turned out, the plan I wanted wasn't an exchange only plan (it's a misconception that only exchange plans can be purchased). He told me that the Oregon exchange is STILL not functional and that this was a cause for concern.

http://www.koin.com/news/oregon/cover-oregon-hiring-400-temp-workers

As they say here, they are ramping up on call center workers to input the applications manually.

My agent asked me a total of THREE questions. My age, whether I smoked, and my SSN. Same for my wife. No questions about health, pre-existing conditions, or prior coverage were necessary. It was amazing, considering that in March, we had to fill out 3 separate applications only to find out that Mrs. Unabogie could not be covered at all, and that we had to go through that SOCIALIST Oregon state coverage.

The next step is that Moda will send us our enrollment packet, we'll pay the first premium, and starting January 1st, we'll be on a gold plan.

And as I keep mentioning, we'll be paying less than we are now.
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Obviously an Obama shill


;)
 
Two people are building a wall. One works constantly, laying the bricks. The other mixes the mortar, but doesn't like the bricklayer, so while the other guy is working on the other side, he takes the opportunity to knock a few bricks out here and there as often as he can.

The wall doesn't get done in time. Who bears the most blame?
 
ravdin said:
There are no official numbers yet from the Obama administration, but it looks like enrollment is far below the original estimates.
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It would've been sort of hard to enroll with a busted website, don't you think? :)
 
Mister Earl said:
Two people are building a wall. One works constantly, laying the bricks. The other mixes the mortar, but doesn't like the bricklayer, so while the other guy is working on the other side, he takes the opportunity to knock a few bricks out here and there as often as he can.

The wall doesn't get done in time. Who bears the most blame?
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In your analogy, who is the guy who is knocking out the bricks? Did one of the contractors get caught sabotaging the website to make more work that they could bill?
 
Newtons Bit said:
In your analogy, who is the guy who is knocking out the bricks? Did one of the contractors get caught sabotaging the website to make more work that they could bill?
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I'm thinking more along the lines of the mortarmaker knocking out bricks more than forty times.
 
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