Hamas warns "informers"

[lionking]

Yeah interesting and all, but if you, DC and others want to start a thread on immigration, go ahead. Because this thread has nothing to do with immigration.

 

[Mycroft]

Its a common theme among bigots. and it is the "they will overwhelm our culture" variation that bigots prefer. They rarely consider the cultural effects of the immigrants of thier own culture as a negative...Its generally a color they are not or a religion they are not....thats what gets to them.

You replied without answering the question or even giving more information.

Is it exclusive to bigots? Or can it be a legitimate concern?

 

[The Fool]

You replied without answering the question or even giving more information.

Is it exclusive to bigots? Or can it be a legitimate concern?

I know of no concern that I would regard as legitimate...suggest a couple to me?


caution: may require the expression of an opinion.

 

[The Fool]

Yeah interesting and all, but if you, DC and others want to start a thread on immigration, go ahead. Because this thread has nothing to do with immigration.

sigh...why do you constantly involve yourself in the thread drift then become the first one to start whining about it?

you posted this a couple of days ago..in this thread you complain has nothing to do with immigration

"Can you please explain how it is racist to have a position on immigration policy? I don't like boat people arriving in Australia. Am I racist?"

followed up by this when you got no response..

"Answer my question. Am I a racist?


maybe you should pm yourself and ask yourself to stay on topic?

 

[Mycroft]

I know of no concern that I would regard as legitimate...suggest a couple to me?

Certainly.

In the past you've expressed a lot of sympathy for those opposed to Jewish immigration into Palestine circa 1880 to 1947.

Have you changed your mind? Or do you have some clever way of explaining why xenophobia is okay in that case but not in Switzerland today?

 

[Matthew Ellard]

Let's put the question to you. Do you think it's a legitimate concern that a country might have too much immigration so that the immigrants might overwhelm the culture of the people already there?

I think a current population has a justified concern about mass immigration by another culture. East Timor's president has made a similar comment concerning australia opening a "refugee processing centre" in Timor. He said that the culture of East Timor has just been freed from Indonesia by Australia and needs to find its self identity before having Aussies and refugees impose their cultures there. This seemed like a reasonable point of view.

Then again, I'm having a hard time thinking of any country that still has its original population. Maybe Switzerland, The Suis and Uri tribes are still in Switzerland from the time of Caesar. I guess I could count England on a genetic level although the imported Viking and Norman culture had the same effect as actual people moving. However Australia, America and most other european countries are examples of entire cultures replaced by immigration.

 

[Mycroft]

I think a current population has a justified concern about mass immigration by another culture. East Timor's president has made a similar comment concerning australia opening a "refugee processing centre" in Timor. He said that the culture of East Timor has just been freed from Indonesia by Australia and needs to find its self identity before having Aussies and refugees impose their cultures there. This seemed like a reasonable point of view.

I agree.

Then again, I'm having a hard time thinking of any country that still has its original population. Maybe Switzerland, The Suis and Uri tribes are still in Switzerland from the time of Caesar. I guess I could count England on a genetic level although the imported Viking and Norman culture had the same effect as actual people moving. However Australia, America and most other european countries are examples of entire cultures replaced by immigration.

I don't know that original population is as important as identifiable culture. In the examples of the US and Australia, those are identifiable cultures despite having only a relatively recent history, no?

 

[Skeptic]

Certainly.

In the past you've expressed a lot of sympathy for those opposed to Jewish immigration into Palestine circa 1880 to 1947.

Have you changed your mind? Or do you have some clever way of explaining why xenophobia is okay in that case but not in Switzerland today?

The rules are different for Jews, you know.

 

[Matthew Ellard]

I don't know that original population is as important as identifiable culture. In the examples of the US and Australia, those are identifiable cultures despite having only a relatively recent history, no?

Agreed. However if we take the point of view of the previous original cultures, Australian aboriginal and American native, they certainly would have been correct if they worried that their cultures would be replaced by european migration.

Anyhow, this is getting off topic and I'm talking about cultures being replaced over 100s of years which is not relevant to the discussion anyway. Additionally, as an Australian I have no problem with the "boat people" coming to Australia as they improve Australia's evolving culture, however there has to be some processing as the Tamil Wars are finished and we don't know if the applicants are refugees, war criminals or economic "line-jumpers". All quite normal stuff.

 

[Mycroft]

The rules are different for Jews, you know.

Apparently they are, and I'm sure the fool is working up an excellent explanation of why it should be that way at this very moment.

 

[lionking]

The whole point of this thread was to demonstrate that the government of Gaza, Hamas, believes that they are at war with Israel. Israel is, therefore, justified to respond in a war-like manner. This position has not been contradicted.

 

[Mycroft]

Agreed. However if we take the point of view of the previous original cultures, Australian aboriginal and American native, they certainly would have been correct if they worried that their cultures would be replaced by european migration.

I agree.

I also think in these modern times when culture can change radically in the space of just a decade or so, that people all over the world will be struggling with difficult questions on what culture means, what needs to be preserved, and what needs to be allowed to change, to fade away, or what new parts should be grafted on. There have been lots of changes in the past decades and the rate of change seems to be accelerating. The issue just isn't as simple as DC or the Fool present it.

 

[The Fool]

Apparently they are, and I'm sure the fool is working up an excellent explanation of why it should be that way at this very moment.

nope...you are the fan of different rules for Jews. Never have been interested in supporting different rules for Jews. I prefer consistant positions....thats why I don't have to tie myself in hilarious knots both supporting and condemning racist discrimination depending on its target.


despite your claims...

"In the past you've expressed a lot of sympathy for those opposed to Jewish immigration into Palestine circa 1880 to 1947."

well, if I've expressed a lot of sympathy you should have no trouble finding an example...

 

[Mycroft]

nope...you are the fan of different rules for Jews. Never have been interested in supporting different rules for Jews. I prefer consistant positions....thats why I don't have to tie myself in hilarious knots both supporting and condemning racist discrimination depending on its target.


despite your claims...

"In the past you've expressed a lot of sympathy for those opposed to Jewish immigration into Palestine circa 1880 to 1947."

well, if I've expressed a lot of sympathy you should have no trouble finding an example...

Since you're obviously saying I'm wrong, rather than spending hours digging through old forum threads, I'll just take this as an affirmation that your true opinion, no matter what impression I had from the past, is that Arabs opposing Jewish immigration to Palestine circa 1880 to 1947 were wrong and xenophobic.

It feels good to have found a point of agreement.

 

[Pardalis]

The whole point of this thread was to demonstrate that the government of Gaza, Hamas, believes that they are at war with Israel. Israel is, therefore, justified to respond in a war-like manner. This position has not been contradicted.

Yeah, any thread that has to do with the Israel-Palestinian conflict invariably ends up being about how "bad" Israel is, even when the OP clearly is talking about Hamas being at fault...