God's purpose

Jodie said:
I was actually looking at it from a medical perspective.
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Well I addressed that and you're idea that an itch is a precursor to pain doesn't stack up.

Now what I originally posted on the subject was:

Just nudging back to the OP one has to wonder about God's purpose in creating the vast array of afflictions we, and the rest of the animal kingdom, suffer.

There is a episode in Mr Deity on the subject where Mr Deity claims he needs all these things so that it's not too easy for people to believe in him. I suppose if all things were rosy all the time, folk would have to conclude some entity is making it so.

One thing that bugs me at the moment is the itch. Why do we have them? Can't seem to find a good explanation for it so far.

When on my bike ride in the mornings these days, March flies attack me sometimes and they always manage to get me on that part of the back I can't reach to scratch.
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So why would this deity you seem to believe in give us itches - along with all the other discomforts?
 
Well first of all, I don't think a deity is responsible for how the human body works, you can blame that on evolution. However, if every spirit is co-creator, then we live in an imperfect world on many levels.

And yes, itching is a precursor to pain. When a fire ant bites you, at first you feel a little tickle, then an itch, which turns into a type of burning pain. There is a protein called BRAF that is responsible for some types of chronic itching and is tied in with the same receptors for pain.

http://www.niams.nih.gov/News_and_Events/Spotlight_on_Research/2014/chronic_itch.asp
 
Jodie said:
Well first of all, I don't think a deity is responsible for how the human body works, you can blame that on evolution. However, if every spirit is co-creator, then we live in an imperfect world on many levels.

And yes, itching is a precursor to pain. When a fire ant bites you, at first you feel a little tickle, then an itch, which turns into a type of burning pain. There is a protein called BRAF that is responsible for some types of chronic itching and is tied in with the same receptors for pain.

http://www.niams.nih.gov/News_and_Events/Spotlight_on_Research/2014/chronic_itch.asp
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Sorry but you're link doesn't say anything about an itch being a precursor to pain.

Don't know about the fire ant biting sequence of events but if true it is most unusual.
 
That article made me wonder if enticing creatures to scratch is a way for some microbes to spread to others or to spread within the host, by getting on fingers and under fingernails. It may not be any evolutionary advantage to humans at all, and just be a vulnerability.
 
it's a simple matter of the neurons not being able to detect a real threat from a pseudo threat since they are responding to an inflammatory response. Itching is part of a protective mechanism that lets you know that something is afoot. It is entangled with the same pathways that are involved with pain. Here is another example: an episiotomy repair is painful immediately after delivery but as it heals the pain moves into incredible itching as the stitches dissolve and the tissues knit back together.
 
Jodie said:
it's a simple matter of the neurons not being able to detect a real threat from a pseudo threat since they are responding to an inflammatory response. Itching is part of a protective mechanism that lets you know that something is afoot. It is entangled with the same pathways that are involved with pain. Here is another example: an episiotomy repair is painful immediately after delivery but as it heals the pain moves into incredible itching as the stitches dissolve and the tissues knit back together.
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Sorry I just don't get it. How is this in anyway of benefit to us?:confused:

I like Pup's idea better. Itching is of no advantage to us at all, and may be the opposite.
 
All I can say is read more research on the topic besides the one guy you mentioned before you come to a final conclusion.
 
Haz yer never have had the deeply satisfying, sensual nature of a good scratch? For no better reason than sometimes a good scratch is deeply and sensually satisfying? And no outside agents except, hopefully, a willing and cooperative scratcher? No "ulterior" evolutionary advantage beyond pure physical sensuality & satisfaction.
 
Jodie said:
All I can say is read more research on the topic besides the one guy you mentioned before you come to a final conclusion.
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Some difficulty in comprehension here. Did I say I came to a final conclusion? No I just said I liked Pup's idea better than yours which I found to be seriously wanting.

I have done some research and it would seem nobody has come up with a reason for itches being in any way of benefit to us.
 
Peregrinus said:
Haz yer never have had the deeply satisfying, sensual nature of a good scratch? For no better reason than sometimes a good scratch is deeply and sensually satisfying? And no outside agents except, hopefully, a willing and cooperative scratcher? No "ulterior" evolutionary advantage beyond pure physical sensuality & satisfaction.
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Yes your right, there is nothing like a good scratch. Not so good if you scratch until you draw blood however. Then you might experience some of the pain Jodie is banging on about.
 
Thor 2 said:
I have done some research and it would seem nobody has come up with a reason for itches being in any way of benefit to us.
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Fevers, rashes, cuts & bruises aren't of benefit to us either. Neither are sunburns. Or hayfever. Not every reaction of our bodies are beneficial. Some are simply chemical reactions to disruptive substances.

You know why not everything is beneficial to us? Because we weren't designed. And because evolution doesn't plan. And because those reactions don't reduce our likelihood to reproduce.
 
Emily's Cat said:
Fevers, rashes, cuts & bruises aren't of benefit to us either. Neither are sunburns. Or hayfever. Not every reaction of our bodies are beneficial. Some are simply chemical reactions to disruptive substances.

You know why not everything is beneficial to us? Because we weren't designed. And because evolution doesn't plan. And because those reactions don't reduce our likelihood to reproduce.
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Right on brother/sister, no argument with that one.

The point I am getting at is if we were designed then why did the designer throw in all these things there is no use for?

Huuum ......... wonder if God has itches?
 
Thor 2 said:
Right on brother/sister, no argument with that one.

The point I am getting at is if we were designed then why did the designer throw in all these things there is no use for?

Huuum ......... wonder if God has itches?
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Same reason he created mosquitos, forest fires, volcanoes, and forbidden fruit that humans would be forever damned for eating. Because if he exists, he is not omnibeneficent... merely another jerk with too much power ala Zeus.

My opinion, of course, and not intended to cause offense.
 
Why must a creator be some separate entity acting as a father figure. You do realize that there are other options right?
 
Jodie said:
Why must a creator be some separate entity acting as a father figure. You do realize that there are other options right?
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Sorry Jodie you seem to be all alone in this train of thought.

Train of thought? ........ spasmodic utterance perhaps.

Other options? Like we are all part of the creator, and somehow took part in creation, from before the time we existed? Help me here, I just can't get my head around this.
 
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Most of what I see on the forum are issues with this anthropomorphic type of cosmology which isn't what everyone believes even if they do believe in some type of eternal life. I don't think it's strictly an either/or debate IMO.
 
Thor 2 said:
Sorry Jodie you seem to be all alone in this train of thought.

Train of thought? ........ spasmodic utterance perhaps.

Other options? Like we are all part of the creator, and somehow took part in creation, from before the time we existed? Help me here, I just can't get my head around this.
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Alone? Hardly. There are many theists who regard the deity or some of or all of the deities that they believe in as not especially caring about humanity, and plenty of god concepts are floating around to much the same effect. "Father figure" and "cares about humans" are not even remotely necessary traits for a god concept to have, after all.
 
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