Global warming discussion IV

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Trakar said:
This year's might well be greater than the '98 episode, and it may extend beyond this (and last) year(s).
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Shouldn't be read "next" there?

Greater, I don't know, because we still are technically in no Niño yet. But certainly Niño 3.4 has been 1.4 two weeks in a row and no forecast show it reaching less than 1.8 before it start to drop.

And I must confess I prefer it that way because that's the "beauty" of it. This year strongly points to become warm record breaking, the second year in a row, and we are not even in a Niño yet. Why should we expect such a tremendous ENSO when almost no ENSO is doing enough harm? Let the planet adjust to its new reality a bit and show that the inescapable warming trend has periods of hesitation, but it won't stop.
 
aleCcowaN said:
Shouldn't be read "next" there?
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You are correct, in a re-calibrated manner that I haven't fully integrated yet.

aleCcowaN said:
...Let the planet adjust to its new reality a bit and show that the inescapable warming trend has periods of hesitation, but it won't stop.
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As the (kinda sorta) Pope says "...Nature never forgives, you slap it and she always slaps you back!..." (love this video!)
 
Trakar said:
As the (kinda sorta) Pope says "...Nature never forgives, you slap it and she always slaps you back!..." (love this video!)
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Forgive me, but that is plain and simple animism! (liked the video :D)

Don't trust these Argentine dudes and dudettes, they're everywhere. One day you'll get distracted a second and one of them will become queen of someplace, like Grace Kelly.
 
Trakar said:
This year's might well be greater than the '98 episode, and it may extend beyond this (and last) year(s).
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aleCcowaN said:
Shouldn't be read "next" there?

Greater, I don't know, because we still are technically in no Niño yet. But certainly Niño 3.4 has been 1.4 two weeks in a row and no forecast show it reaching less than 1.8 before it start to drop.

And I must confess I prefer it that way because that's the "beauty" of it. This year strongly points to become warm record breaking, the second year in a row, and we are not even in a Niño yet. Why should we expect such a tremendous ENSO when almost no ENSO is doing enough harm? Let the planet adjust to its new reality a bit and show that the inescapable warming trend has periods of hesitation, but it won't stop.
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Thanks for the answers! So we are in for a ride the coming winter!?

aleCcowaN said:
Forgive me, but that is plain and simple animism! (liked the video :D)
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The video is awesome! Almost as fun, as seeing the American republicans turn them self inside out, trying to explain why the pope is wrong without saying it out straight.
 
hgus said:
Thanks for the answers! So we are in for a ride the coming winter!?
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Certainly not the average Winter in subtropical regions. Above 30°N or S, I'm not that sure.

hgus said:
The video is awesome! Almost as fun, as seeing the American republicans turn them self inside out, trying to explain why the pope is wrong without saying it out straight.
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Maybe in September we can get the Pope and Al Gore in an affectionate hug, so many republican denialist arteries will pop off along with their owners.
 
Interesting times....

Retreating sea ice in the Iceland and Greenland Seas may be changing the circulation of warm and cold water in the Atlantic Ocean, and could ultimately impact the climate in Europe, says a new study by an atmospheric physicist from the University of Toronto Mississauga (UTM) and his colleagues in Great Britain, Norway and the United States.
"A warm western Europe requires a cold North Atlantic Ocean, and the warming that the North Atlantic is now experiencing has the potential to result in a cooling over western Europe," says professor G.W.K. Moore of UTM's Department of Chemical & Physical Sciences.
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more
http://phys.org/news/2015-06-retreating-sea-ice-linked-ocean.html
 
China-EU co-op on climate change

China-EU co-op on climate change sets example for global green endeavors
http://www.ecns.cn/voices/2015/06-30/171196.shtml

China and the European Union (EU) issued a joint statement on climate change during their leaders' meeting on Monday.[Special coverage]

The increasingly close cooperation between China and Europe on fighting climate change in the past decade has set a good example for global energy saving and emission reduction.

Firstly, the joint statement between China, the world's largest carbon emitter, and the EU, the world's largest bloc of developed countries, has gathered the political will and determination of both sides to deal with climate change.

Since China and the EU established partnership on climate change at the China-EU summit in Beijing in 2005, the two sides have made unremitting efforts to strengthen cooperation in this aspect.

In 2010, China and the EU set up a ministerial-level dialogue mechanism on climate change, under which they created a ministerial-level hotline to exchange views and share the latest developments on climate change.

The two parties have conducted institutional dialogues in such areas as environmental policy, forestry, energy, transportation and sustainable urbanization.

China and the EU have also cooperated in clean energy research and development. They co-developed the China-EU Near Zero Emission Coal project and founded the China-EU Clean Energy Center.

Secondly, the China-EU cooperation on climate change is a good example of cooperation between developing and developed countries to address the global issue...
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The U.S. is losing it global leadership role precisely because it is refusing to provide leadership on the great global issues of today and tomorrow. More importantly than the "prestige" and control, we are falling behind in the technological realm due to the repression and neglect many elements of our society are foisting onto science and education in general. Once we lose that edge we are little more than the banana republic that some seem to desire us to be.
 
Acidification isn't limited to the oceans

Pink salmon affected by freshwater acidification
http://www.techienews.co.uk/9735521/pink-salmon-affected-by-freshwater-acidification/

Researchers have suggested that though there have been multiple studies about the effects of ocean acidification on marine species, there have been far fewer studies to understand the consequences of freshwater acidification on marine species.

In a new study that targets this relatively unchartered topic, researchers have found that pink salmon that begin life in freshwater with high concentrations of carbon dioxide, which causes acidification, are smaller and may be less likely to survive.

University of British Columbia professor Colin Brauner says that 40 per cent of all fish are freshwater and there is a need to think beyond ocean acidification and look at how carbon dioxide is affecting freshwater species.

The professor said that in their study that examines the link between increased carbon dioxide concentrations and its effect on marine species, they found that freshwater acidification affects pink salmon and may impact their ability to survive and ultimately return to their freshwater spawning grounds.

The study, which is published in Nature Climate Change and is one of the first that examines the link, examined how baby salmon respond to fresh and ocean water with the levels of carbon dioxide expected 100 years in the future. Researchers monitored the salmon for ten weeks, from before they hatched to after the time they would migrate to ocean water...
(rest at link)
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I don't know why I didn't think more about fresh water acidification, but I'm glad others have been!
 
aleCcowaN said:
Acid rain, I'd say.
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Indeed, I guess I was somehow under the impression that with all the strong bases inherent to the fertilizer runoff, that it somehow neutralized much of the acidic mix coming out of the smokestacks. But mostly I just wasn't really thinking about the freshwater in rivers and tributaries picking up CO2 acidity. No reason it shouldn't, just a personal blind-spot issue I guess, makes me wonder about all the other such issues that are slipping my considerations.
 
CapelDodger said:
Forget that, we've already had http://www.theguardian.com/environm...n-david-attenborough-climate-change-interview. Obama trumps Al Gore and Sir David trumps the Pope (sorry Frankie but come on, either lose the hat or lose the contest).
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Actually, a very good interview, have you seen the entire piece? I started to mention that earlier but went with the EU-China deal instead, glad someone else added that to the discussion, however. Have any of you caught Neil deGrasse Tyson's Star Talk yet? I don't normally much care for Tyson most of the time because he normally seems to come across talking about science as though it is "magical." I actually like his new series however, hard core geeky but pretty good and very entertaining (for us geeks). I'd love to see him bring a few climate scientists on and interview Obama (or any major politician).
 
Trakar said:
Indeed, I guess I was somehow under the impression that with all the strong bases inherent to the fertilizer runoff, that it somehow neutralized much of the acidic mix coming out of the smokestacks. But mostly I just wasn't really thinking about the freshwater in rivers and tributaries picking up CO2 acidity. No reason it shouldn't, just a personal blind-spot issue I guess, makes me wonder about all the other such issues that are slipping my considerations.
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I'd rather point the finger to sulphates, as a part of Chinese, Korean and Japanese emissions end up in Alaska, British Columbia, Washington and Oregon, besides local sources.

During the 60s fluvial wildlife in Scandinavia had disappeared of entire areas because of British, German, French and Benelux's sulphate emissions.
 
aleCcowaN said:
I'd rather point the finger to sulphates, as a part of Chinese, Korean and Japanese emissions end up in Alaska, British Columbia, Washington and Oregon, besides local sources.

During the 60s fluvial wildlife in Scandinavia had disappeared of entire areas because of British, German, French and Benelux's sulphate emissions.
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I don't doubt those sources at all, but the study mentioned in the article I posted, discussed dissolved CO2 acidification in freshwater systems. I'm assuming that sulphate ion and carbonate ion ratios should indicate the relative sources of the H+ ions that are generating the acidification. Unless of course, the author of the piece doesn't really understand the study he was interpreting, which is a too common occurrence.
 
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