General Israel/Palestine discussion thread

[PhantomWolf]

Dude, they were just trees, get over it.

Unless of course they are actually sentient, then we can all start proclaiming "Murderers" though I'd suggest a lot of lumber yards would be on that top of that list.

But really, do you think that Secular Government doesn't knock down trees?

 

[boyntonstu]

http://www.jpost.com/MiddleEast/Article.aspx?id=208414

Hamas has cracked down on merchants in the Gaza Strip, issuing new regulations that ban importing goods from Israel without prior permission from the Islamic group.

Hamas decided on the new policy this week after recording a drop in the demand for merchandise and supplies from the tunnels it controls along the Philadelphi Corridor between Gaza and Egypt.


that's right, now its Hamas that is keeping goods out of Gaza, not the Israelis.

...I thought you all would get a big kick out of this.

Don't knock the Arabs, if it wasn't for the Zionist Jews, they would act better.

 

[FireGarden]

Shows how much they get through the tunnels.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8608376.stm

Filmed deep underground on the border between Gaza and Egypt, the mobile phone footage obtained by the BBC is conclusive proof of what has been rumoured in Gaza since last year - the tunnelling operation is now so advanced that entire brand new cars are now being smuggled into Gaza.

[...] In the past, cars were cut up to smuggle them though narrower tunnels. But the tunnels have now been widened.

I also heard they've had trouble recently, since the uprising in Egypt, with things like fuel.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/feb/08/egypt-unrest-cuts-gaza-fuel

Gaza is facing acute fuel shortages as a result of the unrest in neighbouring Egypt, which has caused supplies of petrol and diesel smuggled through tunnels to almost dry up.

Although some fuel is imported into the Gaza Strip from Israel, it costs three times as much as diesel and petrol smuggled in from Egypt. Gazans depend on diesel for generators during power cuts of about eight hours a day.

[...] Bridges and roads leading to the border had been closed, he said, although early this week the supply route reopened. A dealer on the phone from Egypt told him clashes in the Sinai between security forces and Bedouin Arabs, the Gazans' main smuggling partners, were contributing to the difficulties.

I don't see how smuggled fuel would end up cheaper.

 

[boyntonstu]

The Voice of Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,745526,00.html


'Every Last One of Them'

….Qaradawi is the father figure of Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood, the country's best-organized opposition group. The Brotherhood is sure to play a part in deciding what path Egypt will now take……


Qaradawi advocates establishing a "United Muslim Nations" as a contemporary form of the caliphate and the only alternative to the hegemony of the West. He hates Israel and would love to take up arms himself. In one of his sermons, he asked God "to kill the Jewish Zionists, every last one of them."….

Well, I guess that sums it up nicely.

 

[Thunder]

I thought we agreed on only one anti-Muslim and only one anti-Israel thread per week.

 

[WildCat]

Qaradawi advocates establishing a "United Muslim Nations" as a contemporary form of the caliphate and the only alternative to the hegemony of the West. He hates Israel and would love to take up arms himself. In one of his sermons, he asked God "to kill the Jewish Zionists, every last one of them."

In January 2009, he said: "Throughout history, Allah has imposed upon the [Jews] people who would punish them for their corruption. The last punishment was carried out by [Adolf] Hitler."

...The imam has also developed a reputation for himself as a moderate. Many see him as a symbol of an enlightened Islam. When speaking to the Western media, in particular, Qaradawi likes to point to Muslims' tolerance of non-Muslims and condemns the attacks of al-Qaida.

And this is how the MB play to the useful idiots in the west, and you can see the fruit it bears whenever you see someone claiming the MB are peaceful secular moderates.

 

[WildCat]

Uh, what does a thread about the MB have to do with Israel or Palestine? Has this become the catch-all thread for anything in the entire region now?

 

[Mycroft]

Dude, they were just trees, get over it.

Unless of course they are actually sentient, then we can all start proclaiming "Murderers" though I'd suggest a lot of lumber yards would be on that top of that list.

But really, do you think that Secular Government doesn't knock down trees?

Apparently he's insincere about believing Israel should be a government for all its citizens. If those citizens happen to be Jewish with religious sensitivities, they should be derided, labeled with pejoratives, and dismissed.

 

[Thunder]

[/quote]

Apparently he's insincere about believing Israel should be a government for all its citizens. If those citizens happen to be Jewish with religious sensitivities, they should be derided, labeled with pejoratives, and dismissed.

no, I simply believe in the seperation between Church and State.

and if you are NOT going to enforce such a seperation, than at least regard all religions of your people equally.

not only does Israel not value the seperation between Church & State, but they treat how they will value & respect the wishes and beliefs of their many religions, very differently.


....but of course, Israel is a Jewish state.....not a Muslim or Christian one. So I guess this all makes sense.

 

[Mycroft]

no, I simply believe in the seperation between Church and State.

and if you are NOT going to enforce such a seperation, than at least regard all religions of your people equally.

not only does Israel not value the seperation between Church & State, but they treat how they will value & respect the wishes and beliefs of their many religions, very differently.


....but of course, Israel is a Jewish state.....not a Muslim or Christian one. So I guess this all makes sense.

If you have evidence that Israel would not give similar consideration to Muslims and Christians, then you have a real issue. But since all you have is derision for the Jewish religion, then you just make yourself out as someone who has derision for the Jewish religion.

This is another manufactured outrage.

 

[Thunder]

If you have evidence that Israel would not give similar consideration to Muslims and Christians, then you have a real issue.

do you REALLY want me to look up how many Mosques have been demolished or turned into warehouses in Israel?

do you REALLY want me to look up how many Muslim cemetaries have been desecrated and abused by Israel?

I will...if you insist.

 

[Mycroft]

I REALLY want you to lose that shrill tone one expects from a 10 year old on too much sugar, but I don't expect it to happen. If the five years you've been on this forum hasn't aged you past that, then one can surmise the issue is something more permanent.

We've discussed graveyards before. Turns out the claims are exaggerated or outright fabricated. I'm not aware of any Mosques to warehouses conspiracy, but as always you are free to put up whatever anti-Israel propaganda you find. That's your thing, no reason to expect it to slow down anytime soon.

 

[bikerdruid]

If you have evidence that Israel would not give similar consideration to Muslims and Christians, then you have a real issue. But since all you have is derision for the Jewish religion, then you just make yourself out as someone who has derision for the Jewish religion.

This is another manufactured outrage.

mycroft...thunder is a jew.
he is a jew who opposes israel's abominable domestic and foreign policies.

 

[Thunder]

I REALLY want you to lose that shrill tone one expects from a 10 year old on too much sugar, but I don't expect it to happen. If the five years you've been on this forum hasn't aged you past that, then one can surmise the issue is something more permanent.

not to self: adjust posting style, as it hurts Mycroft's feelings.

We've discussed graveyards before. Turns out the claims are exaggerated or outright fabricated. I'm not aware of any Mosques to warehouses conspiracy, but as always you are free to put up whatever anti-Israel propaganda you find. That's your thing, no reason to expect it to slow down anytime soon.

http://www.haaretz.com/news/a-mosque-once-stood-here-1.169947

The club was closed in the mid-1980s. For a few years, the former mosque became a stable. The steel doors at the entrance to the prayer hall and the dry horse droppings on the floor testify to this not-so-distant past. Today the building is deserted.


http://www.haaretz.com/weekend/magazine/history-erased-1.224899

This was not the only Muslim holy place destroyed after Israel's War of Independence. According to a book by Dr. Meron Benvenisti, of the 160 mosques in the Palestinian villages incorporated into Israel under the armistice agreements, fewer than 40 are still standing.

http://www.atlanticfreepress.com/ne...ess-to-dozens-of-palestinian-holy-places.html

A report published in 2004 by the Arab Human Rights Association, based in Nazareth, identified 250 places of worship, both Islamic and Christian, that had either been destroyed or made unusable since Israel’s establishment in 1948. Nearly 200 were razed in the wake of the 1948 war, but the threat of destruction hangs over many surviving places of worship too. The century-old mosque of Sarafand, on the coast near the northern city of Haifa, was bulldozed in July 2000 after local Muslims started restoring it.

Other buildings, including mosques in Tiberias and Beit Shean, have been the target of repeated arson attacks. The famous Hasan Bek mosque in Tel Aviv is regularly vandalised and was desecrated in 2005 when a pig’s head bearing the name of the Prophet was thrown into its yard.

Two historic Galilee mosques that are still standing, at Ghabsiyya and Hittin, have been left to fall into ruin surrounded by fences and razor wire. The latter was built by Saladin in the 12th century to celebrate the defeat of the Crusaders.

In Palestinian villages now re-invented as Jewish communities, such as at Ein Hod and Caesariya, mosques have been refurbished as bars or restaurants. In at least four cases, mosques have been converted into synagogues. And Jewish farming communities sometimes use remote holy places as animal pens or warehouses.

conspiracy theory, huh?

 

[Beerina]

http://www.jpost.com/MiddleEast/Article.aspx?id=208414

Hamas has cracked down on merchants in the Gaza Strip, issuing new regulations that ban importing goods from Israel without prior permission from the Islamic group.

Hamas decided on the new policy this week after recording a drop in the demand for merchandise and supplies from the tunnels it controls along the Philadelphi Corridor between Gaza and Egypt.


that's right, now its Hamas that is keeping goods out of Gaza, not the Israelis.

...I thought you all would get a big kick out of this.

So, I'm unsure what this means, he said sarcastically, about support for the two theories of Hamas-as-freedom-fighters and Hamas-as-just-more-dictator-wannabees-lording-over-a-new-group-of-people.

It's also an excellent example of why there's more to freedom than just freedom of speech.

 

[Thunder]

We've discussed graveyards before. Turns out the claims are exaggerated or outright fabricated. I'm not aware of any Mosques to warehouses conspiracy, but as always you are free to put up whatever anti-Israel propaganda you find. That's your thing, no reason to expect it to slow down anytime soon.

any comment regarding the evidence I have provided?

??

 

[Mycroft]

any comment regarding the evidence I have provided?

??

Evidence of what?

That lot's of Mosques from 60 years ago are no longer functioning Mosques? Well, that's true of many houses of worship all over the world. The Church my sister was baptized in became a factory for the manufacturing of archery equipment. It wasn't a bad thing, the congregation got too big for the building so they purchased another property and moved.

What's this got to do with your assertion that well being of three eucalyptus trees should take precedence over the religious sensitivities of an entire demographic?

 

[Thunder]

Evidence of what?

evidence that proves this "conspiracy theory"...is actually a fact:

Originally Posted by Mycroft
I'm not aware of any Mosques to warehouses conspiracy, but as always you are free to put up whatever anti-Israel propaganda you find.

so, what say you?



...or does the desecration of houses of worship in the Middle East only matter if its done to a Synagogue?

 

[Mycroft]

evidence that proves this "conspiracy theory"...is actually a fact:

Originally Posted by Mycroft [qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/helloworld2/buttons/viewpost.gif[/qimg]
I'm not aware of any Mosques to warehouses conspiracy, but as always you are free to put up whatever anti-Israel propaganda you find.

so, what say you?



...or does the desecration of houses of worship in the Middle East only matter if its done to a Synagogue?

Your argument is just too stupid to respond to. I can feel brain cell committing suicide just by thinking of plumbing the depths of stupidity I'd need to respond to it. So I will spare them by placing you on ignore for a while.

 

[Thunder]

Your argument is just too stupid to respond to. I can feel brain cell committing suicide just by thinking of plumbing the depths of stupidity I'd need to respond to it. So I will spare them by placing you on ignore for a while.

you asked for evidence and I presented evidence.

I'm sorry if evidence offends you.