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Merged General Holocaust denial discussion thread

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truethat said:
NO

I am not saying that as long as people agree that the intention was there that I would be willing to discuss the method.

I'm saying a very simple thing.

I'm asking you a question.

How many people was Auschwitz designed to house without causing death?

How many people died in Auschwitz each MONTH. Forget the end result. Lets look at the numbers for each month.

Give me those two figures from a site you trust. I have my own but let's use your numbers.

When you post them you should be able to see a very logical conclusion.

Let's see.
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That proves what exactly?

The people that died in gas chambers weren't registered.
 
I'd like you to put down the numbers. I don't like to speculate.

How many prisoners was Auschwitz designed to house and have supplies for?


What was the monthly death toll in these camps? On average.


You don't need exact numbers. Let's low ball it.
 
Laton said:
As you seem to be having difficulty with my original post I suggest you view it through this lens.

Your replies have been valuable in demonstrating your habit of picking out one minor thing to argue about and ignoring the rest. So, well done indeed.
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Well I do because it didn't make any sense and I haven't ignored anything.

So let me ask you. As long as I agree that people were gassed, would you still have a problem if I questioned the 1.1 million death toll at Auschwitz?
 
http://www.whale.to/b/holocaust_death_stats.html

Let's use this site. You seem to be in agreement with many of the things being stated here.


I'm not good with numbers so can you use this, if it seems acceptable to post two figures.

A. How many people was Auschwitz designed to hold?

B. How many people died on average at the camp each month?
 
kageki said:
So let me ask you. As long as I agree that people were gassed, would you still have a problem if I questioned the 1.1 million death toll at Auschwitz?
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You can question whatever you like. Think of it as providing you with enough rope.
 
truethat said:
http://www.whale.to/b/holocaust_death_stats.html

Let's use this site. You seem to be in agreement with many of the things being stated here.


I'm not good with numbers so can you use this, if it seems acceptable to post two figures.

A. How many people was Auschwitz designed to hold?

B. How many people died on average at the camp each month?
Click to expand...

I don't know the capacity.

Auschwitz Death Books Monthly Totals
http://www.air-photo.com/english/deathbooks.html
However the German Auschwitz Death Books, released by the Soviet government in 1991, records names, and causes of death, for people from the 3 main camps, Auschwitz I, Birkenau, and Monowitz, who died from September 1941, to December, 1943. Causes were primarily typhus, but also other diseases, heart attacks, cancer, and old age. Extrapolating from these figures:

* about 67,227 people died from September, 1941 to December, '43 (only 43 days are missing for 1942 and '43)
* an estimated 63,069 people died during 1941, '44, and the 43 missing '42 and '43 months, and
* this totals 130,300 deaths, or an average of 90 per day.
Click to expand...
 
truethat said:
Ok you have 90 people dying every day.

Now find out the average capacity of the camps

Do you wonder why none of your sites have it? Curious no?
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Did your sites include the Auschwitz death books?

Please by all means just present the facts and state your case.
 
kageki said:
I actually did know the name of the gas was Zyklon B before, but I still didn't know it was a pesticide and it was used for that purpose. This was also before the modern internet was invented so forget even Wiki. Netscape wasn't even around. Yet people still wouldn't know if they don't look for it.
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It can also be used to delouse too. Strangely, though, you seem to omit the convient fact things can be used for other purposes than stated.

According to Rudolf Höss, commandant of Auschwitz, bunker 1 held 800 people, and bunker 2 held 1,200.[25] Once the chamber was full, the doors were screwed shut and solid pellets of Zyklon B were dropped into the chambers through vents in the side walls, releasing the cyanide gas. Those inside died within 20 minutes; the speed of death depended on how close the inmate was standing to a gas vent, according to Höss, who estimated that about one third of the victims died immediately.[26][27]
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(Hint, Zkylon B releases cyanide gas which is fatal to humans as well
 
kageki said:
I don't know the capacity.

Auschwitz Death Books Monthly Totals
http://www.air-photo.com/english/deathbooks.html
Click to expand...

Let's think of why there aren't any figures in the books discussing the capacity of the camp and what was needed to run it.

We've got prisoners dying at a rate of 90 day. 30 days in a month. Do the math? How many are dying each month? That's less than 3 thousand a month. Times 12 months is? 36 thousand times how many years? That's barely past 100 thousand total.

Your own figures showed that 600 thousand died from heart disease.


So let's try this again.

How many died a month.

What was the capacity of the camp? How much food did they use? We've got the chemicals for delousing as a top priority. How much medicine did they use in a month? How much food?

It's a work camp. Surely you must have these numbers on file. It's a huge camp. You need documentation to run a work camp. So how much food were they ordering?
 
KoihimeNakamura said:
It can also be used to delouse too. Strangely, though, you seem to omit the convient fact things can be used for other purposes than stated.



(Hint, Zkylon B releases cyanide gas which is fatal to humans as well
Click to expand...

Did you just somehow miss where I quote from USHMM?
 
truethat said:
Let's think of why there aren't any figures in the books discussing the capacity of the camp and what was needed to run it.

We've got prisoners dying at a rate of 90 day. 30 days in a month. Do the math? How many are dying each month? That's less than 3 thousand a month. Times 12 months is? 36 thousand times how many years? That's barely past 100 thousand total.

Your own figures showed that 600 thousand died from heart disease.


So let's try this again.

How many died a month.

What was the capacity of the camp? How much food did they use? We've got the chemicals for delousing as a top priority. How much medicine did they use in a month? How much food?

It's a work camp. Surely you must have these numbers on file. It's a huge camp. You need documentation to run a work camp. So how much food were they ordering?
Click to expand...

Where are you getting 600,000 deaths from heart disease?

Why are you asking me how many died a month when you just provided it yourself? I already told you that I don't know the capacity.
 
kageki said:
Where are you getting 600,000 deaths from heart disease?

Why are you asking me how many died a month when you just provided it yourself? I already told you that I don't know the capacity.
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Sorry I misinterpreted your figures earlier. But no matter. The numbers simply don't add up to the 1.1 million. These are the numbers that the Nazis documented.


Now if it was a labor camp and there were only 90 odd deaths a day, that's a lot of death but certainly not staggering.

But where is the documentation from running a labor camp? That's what I'm asking you. If it was simply a labor camp then why is it that they have lots of figures for loads and loads of Zyklon B and other things. But nothing for food, work orders etc.

?

Why not?


Here's some information I found, but I doubt you would trust the source but here goes

Beginning in 1942, Jews whom the SS physicians classified as fit for labor were also registered in the camp. From among all the people deported to Auschwitz, approximately 400,000 people were registered and placed in the camp and its sub-camps [200,000 Jews, more than 140,000 Poles, about 20,000 Romanies ("Gypsies") from various countries, more than 10,000 Soviet prisoners of war, and more than 10,000 prisoners of other nationalities].

Auschwitz Over 50% of the registered prisoners died as a result of starvation, labor that exceeded their physical capacity, the terror that raged in the camp, executions, the inhuman living conditions, disease and epidemics, punishment, torture, and criminal medical experiments.
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Why would you continue to send prisoners to a camp where the numbers showed that 50 % of the people were dying daily?
http://isurvived.org/AUSCHWITZ_TheCamp.html


See the point is, that when you actually look at ALL the information it becomes obvious that large numbers of people died one way or another in this camp. Typhus was rampant. Death was daily. They didn't have enough resources...........and yet, the Nazis kept sending prisoners there.

WHY?
 
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kageki said:
Please by all means just present the facts and state your case.
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.
Annnnnnnd irony meters worldwide just exploded.

The facts have been presented and the case stated by generations of actual historians in literally thousands of those, you know, book thingys.

OTOH, you pretty much never answer a direct question, present a fact or even have the backbone to state a case.

Put up or shut up, sunshine. It's*your* turn to present your facts and state your case.

Or keep running, like the brave aryan warrior you are.
.
 
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truethat said:
Sorry I misinterpreted your figures earlier. But no matter. The numbers simply don't add up to the 1.1 million. These are the numbers that the Nazis documented.


Now if it was a labor camp and there were only 90 odd deaths a day, that's a lot of death but certainly not staggering.

But where is the documentation from running a labor camp? That's what I'm asking you. If it was simply a labor camp then why is it that they have lots of figures for loads and loads of Zyklon B and other things. But nothing for food, work orders etc.

?

Why not?


Here's some information I found, but I doubt you would trust the source but here goes



Why would you continue to send prisoners to a camp where the numbers showed that 50 % of the people were dying daily?
http://isurvived.org/AUSCHWITZ_TheCamp.html


See the point is, that when you actually look at ALL the information it becomes obvious that large numbers of people died one way or another in this camp. Typhus was rampant. Death was daily. They didn't have enough resources...........and yet, the Nazis kept sending prisoners there.

WHY?
Click to expand...

The numbers don't add up because the people that died in gas chambers weren't registered and not included in the death books. The causes were primarily typhus so if there wasn't a typhus epidemic then the death toll would be a lot lower.

So you are still left with the question of the exact death toll. They initially established 4 million at IMT so you wonder how they could have been so wrong.
 
If typhus was such an epidemic, WHY DID THEY CONTINUE TO SEND PEOPLE TO THE CAMPS?
 
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