Ed Forum birdwatching 2008

[Kotatsu]

That is all I am doing posting my observations just becouse I mentioned I may use my boat for birding is not derailing .
I said I may have some photos of the ivory bill if this is a thread for reporting sightings then that should not be derailing ether .

This can easily be sorted out. Creekfreak: did these spottings of the Ivory-billed occur prior to 1st of January, 2008? If not, I am sorry, but it's quite outside the scope of this thread. If you wish to talk further about digiscoping and so on, please start a new thread on that subject.

If you believe you have valid sightings of an Ivory-bill, dates, locations, and a document stating that your local rare birds committee has approved your sighting will be required for it to enter the forum list. I do not know anything about which birds are rare where and when in the US or most of the other countries represented on this current list, and generally trust the reporter to have made a valid and accurate identification. However, I do know that a genuine sighting of an Ivory-billed in America would require acceptance from the local, and perhaps national, rare birds committee or similar institution to be acceptable to the forum list. If such documentation cannot be produced, then your sighting will never enter the forum list. Those are the rules.

Further, if you already have several threads discussing the veracity of your Ivory-billed sightings, and EHocking has PMed me a list of exactly such threads, I would recommend that you return there and contain your discussions to those threads. This list is, so far, more narrow in scope than birdwatching in general (though I would love for people to discuss identification tips and so on).

 

[Hokulele]

Speaking of bird-watching in general, I may be going to Korea for a week, and would appreciate any suggestions for bird guides, as I am completely unfamiliar with the species over there, but would be happy to add a few to the forum list.

I also hope to get up to the national park here this weekend and see if we can spot any of the native species for the list.

 

[Kotatsu]

It's always nice to spot a showy bird like the Northern Flicker. They are considered common, but I suspect a most of the residents of this area have never noticed them. You have to slow down and look around to see wildlife.

Indeed. The local club is filled with twitchers of various kinds... I have never seen the point in that. I am one of those who would rather spend a day looking at a colony of Sand martins flying in and out of their holes, or just sit listening to a skylark, than travelling back and forth just to look at rare birds. I do go and look at rare birds if they are in the area, though, as it never hurts to be able to tell the rare birds from the common ones, but I wouldn't go very far to see one. Unless it's a very spectacular one, like the time I went to watch the Spoonbill...^^

Quite welcome.

Thought I'd respond just to push Dominica (which is not the Dominican Republic) as a place to see two species of very rare parrots in the wild. Though my wife and I went there primarily for scuba diving we left with a love for a place very special in many regards.

I don't usually announce favorite places, especially to a bunch of people I don't know. But maybe just a couple of you will listen. Two more added to almost nobody else can not make a difference.

Article

I have visitors this week, but I've added that link to my favourites and will read it as soon as I can...

For this list, I'd remove them.

Back on more familiar territory, here's some additional birds for E11 in London:

I've removed it now. Sadly, none of the other birds you reported were previously unreported, so we too a step backwards there...

Interesting that they should be declining there. Here, they're an alien species, and said to be pushing aside the chipping sparrows and invading bluebird nests. They share with starlings the distinction of being unprotected in the U.S. Maybe we could send you a crate or two of the little blighters.

Could it be because they are still new to America that does it? They still haven't settled into a specific niche the same way they did in Europe yet, so they are not as sensitive to changes in their environment. I believe one reason they have declined so much here is because of the lesser use of horses, for instance, and the higher efficiency of seed dispersal and storage at farms, though I am not entirely sure... Could this be at least a partial explanation?

 

[Kotatsu]

Speaking of bird-watching in general, I may be going to Korea for a week, and would appreciate any suggestions for bird guides, as I am completely unfamiliar with the species over there, but would be happy to add a few to the forum list.

I also hope to get up to the national park here this weekend and see if we can spot any of the native species for the list.

I have heard that this one is good:
Brazil: Birds of East Asia. Japan, Korea, Russia, China, Taiwan

I had a book when I went to China by a guy with a German name, though I can't remember his name now, and that was crap. I'll ask my supervisor tomorrow. He's been in China and East Asia a lot, and went to Korea at least once in his youth. He's also a compulsive collector of bird books, so he ought to know^^.

 

[bruto]

Could it be because they are still new to America that does it? They still haven't settled into a specific niche the same way they did in Europe yet, so they are not as sensitive to changes in their environment. I believe one reason they have declined so much here is because of the lesser use of horses, for instance, and the higher efficiency of seed dispersal and storage at farms, though I am not entirely sure... Could this be at least a partial explanation?

Could easily be. One would have thought that unlike some other birds, they wouldn't have a free ride without natural enemies, since they're so little different from other sparrows. But they are a little smaller, I think, and they have displaced other cavity dwellers. Apparently they are pretty nasty, and toss out other birds' eggs. Anyway, many people here would welcome their decline here.

My one contribution today to the list is an Eastern Screech Owl (otus asio). A common little owl around here, distinguished by being "eared." This one was perched in a chimney. Since that's probably its home, we might try going back there with big lenses and see if we can "bag" it.

 

[Elizabeth I]

.. and, remarkable because it *should* be so common,

House Sparrow Passer domesticus

I say remarkable, because this is the first one I've seen in the area for 4 years. The "disappeared" a few seasons ago and the gap was filled by Blue Tits. It will be interesting to see if they are moving back.

Is a house sparrow the same thing as an English sparrow? Because if it is you can have barrels full from Texas. They take over the purple martin houses and run the purple martins out.

I have no idea what's going on with birds around here. Usually I see jillions (that's a scientific term) but since this thread started, they seem to have all run off.

 

[bruto]

Is a house sparrow the same thing as an English sparrow? Because if it is you can have barrels full from Texas. They take over the purple martin houses and run the purple martins out.

I have no idea what's going on with birds around here. Usually I see jillions (that's a scientific term) but since this thread started, they seem to have all run off.

I've noticed the same thing here in Vermont, which is odd because I've been looking harder for them. Lots of raptors, but songbirds seem hard to come by (except for starlings).

 

[Kotatsu]

Could easily be. One would have thought that unlike some other birds, they wouldn't have a free ride without natural enemies, since they're so little different from other sparrows. But they are a little smaller, I think, and they have displaced other cavity dwellers. Apparently they are pretty nasty, and toss out other birds' eggs. Anyway, many people here would welcome their decline here.

I've never heard them be aggressive before, but I think it's not too hard to imagine. They do chase the Tree sparrows away from bird feeders and so on.

I've always wondered about how people say that an introduced species will have no natural enemies, and thus be able to out-compete the local animal. Many predators --- especially predatory birds --- are not very picky about what kind of small animal they eat, as long as they can catch it. Of course, kestrels, buzzards, sparrowhawks and so on all have their own specialities, but I believe it is rare for one species to concentrate on, say, tufted tits exclusively. Similarly, birds of prey and snakes, at least, look pretty much the same everywhere, so the introduced species doesn't get it much harder either... I don't know. I should, though, after four years of biology education at a university level, I guess^^.

My one contribution today to the list is an Eastern Screech Owl (otus asio). A common little owl around here, distinguished by being "eared." This one was perched in a chimney. Since that's probably its home, we might try going back there with big lenses and see if we can "bag" it.

If you do manage to bag it, and you find some lice on it, please consider sending them to me^^. I'm doing my PhD on feather lice, and so far I've not had any luck getting any from any Screech owls (called Long-eared owls on this side of the Atlantic^^).

Is a house sparrow the same thing as an English sparrow? Because if it is you can have barrels full from Texas. They take over the purple martin houses and run the purple martins out.

Really? Oh my! I've never heard them do anything like that over here. I guess that would be a way for them to actually out-compete the locals if there are no local birds who do the same. I know that flycatchers and wrynecks can do that sort of thing, but never House sparrows.

Usually, they say, Blue tits are the first to build a nest, then when May comes around, they get kicked out by the Pied flycatchers. Shortly afterwards, the wrynecks ---- queer animals! look them up if you don't know them --- arrive and throw the flycatchers out.

I have no idea what's going on with birds around here. Usually I see jillions (that's a scientific term) but since this thread started, they seem to have all run off.

We have the same problem over here. Very few birds everywhere, especially song birds. My guess is that, at least in Sweden, it's because of the mild winters. The birds don't have to go near human habitation in large numbers like they usually do, so we only get the ones that regularly live near humans.

 

[bobdroege7]

I saw a couple of Red-headed woodpeckers on Jan 27 in St Louis MO USA.

Piciformes Picidae
Melanerpes erythrocephalus

 

[Akhenaten]

28 January 2008

Kookaburra Dacelo novaeguineae

I hear these a lot more often than I see them. Many people over here believe that Kookaburras making their famous laughing call are the harbingers of rain, and I tend to agree, although confirmation bias may be at work. Oh noes! The other curious thing I've noticed about the call of the Kooka is that it seems to turn up in just about every jungle movie ever made, endemicness to Australia and New Guinea be damned. (I know it's not a word. Sorry)

Talking about species out of place, this might be a good time to mention some of the exotic species that I see daily. I've left them out of my reports so far in the same way that I'd leave the weeds out of a description of my garden, but I suppose they aves as much right to be included as the natives.

House Sparrow Passer domesticus

For an introduced species, these little fellows seem harmless enough. They're common all over Australia, but only in urbanised areas, where they scavenge as I imagine is the case worldwide. In other words, they appear to have occupied a niche that didn't exist before European settlement.

Indian Myna Acridotheres tristis

Known to Pharaoh as Vermin Birds, and to most Australians as mice with wings. (Pigeons are rats with wings). The main problem with these pests is that they displace native birds from increasingly scarce nesting spaces. Fortunately they seem to be restricted to urbanised areas similarly to the Sparrows. From observation it seems that Mynas are fair game to a number of our native species, such as the Kookaburras mentioned above as well as Kites and Hawks. In the Palace precincts we've noticed a drop in their numbers since we started encouraging the Currawongs to spend time here.

Indian Peafowl, Pavo cristatus

So far, these seem to be a rare benign import. Apart from people in urban areas keeping them as pets, and a number of public parks and gardens having them as living garden ornaments, many people in rural areas keep them for their ability to kill snakes. And they can fly! Well, I suppose you dedicated folks knew that all along, but I was amazed the first time I saw one flap up into a tree to sleep for the night. Condors they aren't.


Cheers to all.

 

[Kotatsu]

I saw a couple of Red-headed woodpeckers on Jan 27 in St Louis MO USA.

Piciformes Picidae
Melanerpes erythrocephalus

You seriously have too many woodpeckers in America...

The other curious thing I've noticed about the call of the Kooka is that it seems to turn up in just about every jungle movie ever made, endemicness to Australia and New Guinea be damned. (I know it's not a word. Sorry)

Endemicity^^.
I am often irritated by the same kind of things. Accuracy never seems to be considered very important, even if it can totally ruin the mood for people in the know. I have seen plenty of movies and TV series where they have some sort of raptor, and paste on that typical raptor sound (Large Bird #3 on their Sound Effects CD, no doubt), even if it would never sound like that. And when you point this kind of thing out to your friends ("Nowhere in the world do the distribution of Bird X and Bird Y overlap, so that scene by the bridge must have been shot in several different places, or something") they generally don't think it's worth getting upset over. But if my disbelief is to be suspended, I want it to be totally so. If I was watching a serious WWII movie and all of the German soldiers had Hello Kitty underwear, people would complain. But for some reason, scientific accuracy never gets to enjoy the same degree of righteous disappointment in a movie.

Case in point: I pointed out that no bird with feet like that would have been able to spot a rat in the middle of the night, as happens in the opening of the new Beowulf movie, and my friend just said, "Why do you notice things like that?" and thought it was no big deal.

Talking about species out of place, this might be a good time to mention some of the exotic species that I see daily. I've left them out of my reports so far in the same way that I'd leave the weeds out of a description of my garden, but I suppose they aves as much right to be included as the natives.

I guess both the sparrow and the mynah would count as category C birds, then: spontaneous sightings of introduced species. Thus, they would be eligible for the list, had not both of them been there already. To me, it sounds like the peacock would be a category E bird, most definitely escapees, and would thus not be eligible.

However, the Kookaburra has been added.

 

[a_unique_person]

We have a bird hide near where I live in some wetlands.

Black Swan (Cygnus altratus)
Australian Raven (Corvus coronoides)
Magpie-lark (Grallina cyanoleuca)
Eurasian Coot (Fulica atra)

 

[EHocking]

(and bruto)Is a house sparrow the same thing as an English sparrow? Because if it is you can have barrels full from Texas. They take over the purple martin houses and run the purple martins out.

According to my Nat.Geog.Soc field guide you have both the Eurasian Spadgers (Passer Domesticus (house) and P.montanus (tree)). Likewise my home country, Australia (also NZ). That was the cause of my "remarkable", 'cos they appear to be in decline in their "state of origin", england: http://www.bto.org/appeals/house_sparrow.htm .

I have no idea what's going on with birds around here. Usually I see jillions (that's a scientific term) but since this thread started, they seem to have all run off.

Sod's Law 'cos you're looking for them. Same thing in a trip to Iceland. Determined to spot White-tailed Eagles. Last gasp on last day was a trip in the harbour to a known nesting sight and saw 3. Needless to say, next day on a jaunt in the car, just around the corner from Reykyavik they were literally crawling (OK, not literally CRAWLING) all over the place. Found 2 Gyr Falcon though and that took the edge of paying a tourist boat the previous day and being subjected to eating Puffin as entree.

 

[EHocking]

...The other curious thing I've noticed about the call of the Kooka is that it seems to turn up in just about every jungle movie ever made, endemicness to Australia and New Guinea be damned. (I know it's not a word. Sorry)...

A small aside. I used to be irritated with our 'Burra being played in the background of, say, Tarzan - but the thing is, it's probably not a Kooka. There is an African Hornbill that sounds just like a truncated Kooka call. Not to say that a Kooka is NOT used, but there IS also a genuine African bird call used as well. (OK, so who hasn't heard a didgeridoo played in the background of many a jungle movie not based in Oz - generalisms work that way!)

 

[Elizabeth I]

Just bumping to keep this on page 1.

All I saw today were a bunch of birds that have already been reported.

 

[bruto]

While we're waiting for more birds to come around (it's night time here anyway), a little remark about bird watching and bird watchers. I like birds a lot but have never been a real birder, tending to settle for "oh, look, duckies!" and being able to identify obvious things. And I do keep a sharp eye out for raptors. I really like raptors. But forget the pages in the bird book headed "confusing fall warblers."

So I'm enjoying this thread because it has kind of spurred me to double check things and pay attention a little more.

After years of saying "we ought to have a bird book in the car" a couple of years ago I threw in an old copy of the 1947 edition of the old Peterson guide to birds found east of the Rockies. Still useful, if not the best. It has index tabs, which is really handy. We use it for tentative ID, and double check when we get home. Anyway, I got this book long long ago at a library sale, and it has the name "Ellen Hamilton" on the flyleaf. Near the beginning is a check-off Life list containing all the birds in the book - 363, if I count correctly. And during her tenure, Ellen checked off 191 of those, plus two write-ins (a barnacle goose and a house finch). I think that's a pretty impressive bit of birding.

 

[Hokulele]

At the beach this afternoon (30 Jan.), we saw a Sanderling (Hunakai in Hawai'ian) Calidris alba.

Thanks for the recommendations for bird books for Korea. Hopefully I will get a chance to spot something other than pigeons.

 

[Kotatsu]

We have a bird hide near where I live in some wetlands.

Black Swan (Cygnus altratus)
Australian Raven (Corvus coronoides)
Magpie-lark (Grallina cyanoleuca)
Eurasian Coot (Fulica atra)

Coot already seen, but the other three have been added. Thank you. It must be nice to live in a place where you can actually count a Black swan as valid^^. We only get escapees up here. You former-colonies people should export some of your birds to Europe. I think the birdwatchers would prefer the "confusing fall warblers", though.

Last gasp on last day was a trip in the harbour to a known nesting sight and saw 3. Needless to say, next day on a jaunt in the car, just around the corner from Reykyavik they were literally crawling (OK, not literally CRAWLING) all over the place. Found 2 Gyr Falcon though and that took the edge of paying a tourist boat the previous day and being subjected to eating Puffin as entree.

It's always like that. My friend was searching for tufted tits for over a year before he saw his first one, and now he sees them all the time. It's like the birds also keep lists on which birder has seen which birds...

So I'm enjoying this thread because it has kind of spurred me to double check things and pay attention a little more.

Great! That is exactly what the thread is for.

I have a couchsurfer with me at the moment, and we went out trying to catch moorhens last night. She used to be a birdwatcher when she was younger, and we came to discuss birds on the tram. We both agreed how strange it is that many people can see birds every day and never be interested in what kind it is. It seems incomprehensible to me, but then again I tend to look all kinds of organisms up... I'm a professional biologist after all^^.

Anyway, I got this book long long ago at a library sale, and it has the name "Ellen Hamilton" on the flyleaf. Near the beginning is a check-off Life list containing all the birds in the book - 363, if I count correctly. And during her tenure, Ellen checked off 191 of those, plus two write-ins (a barnacle goose and a house finch). I think that's a pretty impressive bit of birding.

Yeah, that's quite good. Well, I have no idea how easy it is to find a lot of birds in the US. It's sort of easy here in Gothenburg, and with some travelling, I usually end up with 200-220 every year. I think I had about 250 last year, but that's because I was staying at a bird observatory for most of the summer and autumn, and managed to get to see a full 24 new species for me! Black stork, Kentish plover, Upland sandpiper, Calandra lark, Lesser spotted eagle, and so on. It was totally amazing. I also managed to sleep through an invasion of bee-eaters, though...

At the beach this afternoon (30 Jan.), we saw a Sanderling (Hunakai in Hawai'ian) Calidris alba.

Thanks for the recommendations for bird books for Korea. Hopefully I will get a chance to spot something other than pigeons.

I love those birds! I have some pictures of them in the hand, but the lighting in my lab sn't very good, so the pictures are sort of crappy... Usually you need to know what species it is to be able to see what species it is^^.

My supervisor said that there is a book on Birds of Korea, but that it's not very good. He also doesn't recommend De Schauensee's Birds of China (and having used this book, I agree), but recommends another one by McKinnon (the top one at amazon.co.uk when searching for "Birds of China"). Schauensee's book has amazingly few pictures, and no distribution maps, and is quite useless. I managed to ID about 30 birds in just under two weeks in China, though, so it could be useful, but it doesn't generally tell you which characters to look out for...

Good luck!

 

[Hokulele]

On the way into town this morning, I saw several Hawaiian Stilts (Ae'o) Himantopus mexicanus knudseni . I don't know how you handle sub-species, but I read that the Hawaiian Stilt is different from the mainland stilt (although I am sure you know more about that than I! ).

Too bad about the Asian bird books, I may ask at the local library and see if they know of anything. If not, I guess I can just wing it (so to speak).

 

[Kotatsu]

On the way into town this morning, I saw several Hawaiian Stilts (Ae'o) Himantopus mexicanus knudseni . I don't know how you handle sub-species, but I read that the Hawaiian Stilt is different from the mainland stilt (although I am sure you know more about that than I! ).

I am not really sure how to do it either... Potentially, a line could (and should) be drawn between easily recognised subspecies. For instance, the Carrion crow and the Hooded crow could easily be distinguished even by an amateur, and thus both may warrant inclusion, even though they will never, as I understand it, be pronounced a different species (except by the Dutch). Conversely, apart from the Spanish and Moroccan subspecies of Magpie, which are recognisable in the field, there are at least a handful more subspecies in Europe alone, which can be told apart only be extreme specialists, and then only on hand-held or stuffed individuals. Inclusion of those subspecies would in most cases require either killing the bird, or just assuming that the subspecies are stationary enough for geographic location to be the final judge. I would advise against that.

I guess this would be the best approach, but that some kind of backing-up would be needed, i.e., that the observed subspecies is really different from the nominate subspecies, or so. But this is not my thread alone, and I'd prefer to have more input from other regulars (and irregulars) before anything is decided.

If we decide to implement this, I would like to know if any of our British contributors have seen a Carrion crow this year, as we only have the Hooded crow on the list. I'd also need to look into possible plumage differences between American and Eurasian Rough-legged buzzards, between Hawai'ian and European Night Herons, and some other pairs... But that's comparatively easy, really.

Too bad about the Asian bird books, I may ask at the local library and see if they know of anything. If not, I guess I can just wing it (so to speak).

Most of the 40-odd bird species I saw in China 2006 were the same species as I usually see back home, which was a bit disappointing. Different subspecies, often, but still... We lived in Wuhan opposite the University, and passed this large lake every day on our way to the conference. I was quite disappointed when all I ever saw were Little grebes, White wagtails, Tree sparrows, and Great crested grebes. But over the course of the 1.5 weeks we were there I was rewarded by five different species of starling, one bulbul, Chinese goshawk, Amur falcon, one Parrotbill, three or four different larks, and three different redstarts, as well as many other wonderful birds, so I ended up quite happy anyway.

The point is, maybe you could just get a European birdbook and use that?^^