One news item of a girl using what she learned in her karate lessons, even at a "McDojo", to fend of an attacker in real life and protect her life, is worth 100 times as much as all the medals and trophies won in sports/entertainment matches by Gracies.
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Kevin_Lowe
Unregistered
- Joined
- Feb 10, 2003
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- 12,221
One news item of a girl using what she had bought from a homeopath, to fend off an illness in real life and protect her life, is worth 100 times as much as all the blinded trials and peer-reviewed papers published by doctors.
Wudang
BOFH
Ah yes, I recall a couple of times a defender of "Taoist Tai Chi(TM)" defending it by telling how a little girl after a few lessons threw a big attacker against a wall.
They neglected to mention that she weighed over 200 and had a black belt in judo.
I like facts.
Phrost
The Fighting Skeptic
- Joined
- Sep 11, 2003
- Messages
- 1,653
This thread is still going?
If you're not actively punching people in the face full force in nearly every class or grappling with the intent to submit a fully resisting opponent intent on doing the same to you, you're not training in Martial Arts. Period.
It's like claiming you're a basketball player because you do passing drills and practice your free throws.
If you're not actively punching people in the face full force in nearly every class or grappling with the intent to submit a fully resisting opponent intent on doing the same to you, you're not training in Martial Arts. Period.
It's like claiming you're a basketball player because you do passing drills and practice your free throws.
Stimpson J. Cat
Graduate Poster
- Joined
- Sep 20, 2001
- Messages
- 1,949
Phrost,
Full contact sparring is a critical part of any martial art which actually intends to teach you how to fight, and any training that does not claim to be teaching you how to fight has no business calling itself a martial art. But to assert that full contact should be used in nearly every class, seems to me to be quite unjustified. And do claim that if you do not do so, then you aren't training in martial arts, is just silly.
If you are already a skilled fighter, and the purpose of your training is to improve your abilities in your competitions, then I could imagine that focussing almost entirely on full-contact training would be a good strategy. But that is not the typical case, and certainly does not apply to the typical situation. Many of the people I train with simply aren't ready for full-contact training. If they were forced to do it now, many of them would simply quit, and those that did not would most likely be injured. What's more, they would gain very little from the excercise because they are not yet competent enough with the style to use it in a fight. So they wouldn't even be training their style at all. They would just be brawling.
Dr. Stupid
This seems rather extreme to me. There is a lot more to martial arts training than just sparring. Not only is it not necessary for full contact sparring to be done in every class, but it is counter-productive. For one thing, you'll end up spending a large portion of time you could be spending training, on recovering from your training injuries. Furhermore, most people who train martial arts simply aren't ready to do that type of training until after they have been training for a great deal of time. Not if they want their training to be anything more than practicing brawling, anyway.
Full contact sparring is a critical part of any martial art which actually intends to teach you how to fight, and any training that does not claim to be teaching you how to fight has no business calling itself a martial art. But to assert that full contact should be used in nearly every class, seems to me to be quite unjustified. And do claim that if you do not do so, then you aren't training in martial arts, is just silly.
No, that analogy would only work if your martial arts training consisted only of drills. In that case, I would agree that you are not actually training to fight, but your analogy makes a clear leap from "not doing full-contact nearly every time you train" to "not doing full-contact at all".
If you are already a skilled fighter, and the purpose of your training is to improve your abilities in your competitions, then I could imagine that focussing almost entirely on full-contact training would be a good strategy. But that is not the typical case, and certainly does not apply to the typical situation. Many of the people I train with simply aren't ready for full-contact training. If they were forced to do it now, many of them would simply quit, and those that did not would most likely be injured. What's more, they would gain very little from the excercise because they are not yet competent enough with the style to use it in a fight. So they wouldn't even be training their style at all. They would just be brawling.
Dr. Stupid
I said
Then it was said
This comparison is clearly false. Where this false comparison breaks down is:
1) there is nothing controversial whatsoever is the claim of using legs, feet, arms, hands, knees, elbows, etc., to defend a person
2) it is also somewhat of a dubious stretch to try and compare martial arts to peer reviewed science
3) MMA fans are referring to sports/entertainment as evidence of what works in real life. It is better to refer to actual real life events
4) Will the historical revision/claim of 'no Japanese jujitsu person can fight' ever be substantiated?
Then it was said
This comparison is clearly false. Where this false comparison breaks down is:
1) there is nothing controversial whatsoever is the claim of using legs, feet, arms, hands, knees, elbows, etc., to defend a person
2) it is also somewhat of a dubious stretch to try and compare martial arts to peer reviewed science
3) MMA fans are referring to sports/entertainment as evidence of what works in real life. It is better to refer to actual real life events
4) Will the historical revision/claim of 'no Japanese jujitsu person can fight' ever be substantiated?
This from someone who claims his martial arts board is the largest?
Actually, you're attempted definition is just that, an attempted definition. There are plenty martial arts, and plenty aspects within a given martial art, where full force is not a good idea, or even desirable.
In fact, your silly pseudo-definition applies to street fights, drunked bar fights, and kids shoving each other around.
thaiboxerken
Penultimate Amazing
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- Sep 17, 2001
- Messages
- 35,104
Then it was said that the little girl was #200 and a judoka.
Kevin_Lowe
Unregistered
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- Feb 10, 2003
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- 12,221
You can tell them, but if they don't want to believe it...
Wudang
BOFH
I have a problem with the "or" for historical reasons. Judo did very well in the UK until karate arrived and karate guys started kicking the crap out of judo instructors.
Until I see convincing evidence that an attacker is more likely to grapple me than try to hit me then I'll keep insisting that you need to learn to take a hit and carry on.