Felonious jay walking

[WildCat]

That's why I do it.

Wildcat, you're in Chicago, aren't you? Noticed any changes in traffic laws since the city declared it was going to crack down on jaywalkers that ignore signals and tie up traffic?

....Neither have I.

Thinning the herd is the only solution. They'll only die of starvation and disease if we don't.

Are you in Chicago now?

The day those 350lb. traffic aides chase down a jaywalker and issue a ticket will be the same day Jesus returns...

OTOH, cop friends tell me the new law banning hand-held cell phones gives them a good excuse to pull over gangbangers and search for weapons.

 

[Hardenbergh]

I remembered this thread when I saw an article in the Kennebec Journal. The area they are talking about (downtown Augusta) is the street where I work.
Most of the time, they don’t even stop and seem totally oblivious that there are pedestrians waiting to cross. Sometimes a car in one lane will stop but the car in the other lane just keeps on tearing through (not seeming to give a hoot about why the other car came to a halt).

http://kennebecjournal.mainetoday.com/news/local/2605815.shtml

 

[BPSCG]

Most of the time, they don’t even stop

Why should they stop? Is there a stop sign or a red light or a traffic cop directing them to stop? If not, then they're not supposed to stop.

I saw a puzzlewit yesterday leaning against the Jersey wall that divided six lanes of traffic on a heavily-travelled, major road. He'd somehow apparently negotiated the three lanes going in the opposite direction from me, and was now waiting to get across the three lanes in the direction I was going.

Should I have stopped for him?

and seem totally oblivious that there are pedestrians waiting to cross. Sometimes a car in one lane will stop but the car in the other lane just keeps on tearing through (not seeming to give a hoot about why the other car came to a halt).

Why should he? If the guy in the next lane slams on his brakes because he sees a pedestrian and wants to be a good neighbor to the pedestrian (and a bad neighbor to everyone behind him), am I supposed to slam on my brakes, too? What if he's slamming on his brakes because whatever he's tripping on is making him see eighteen-foot high tarantulas?

 

[Hardenbergh]

Why should they stop? Is there a stop sign or a red light or a traffic cop directing them to stop? If not, then they're not supposed to stop.

I saw a puzzlewit yesterday leaning against the Jersey wall that divided six lanes of traffic on a heavily-travelled, major road. He'd somehow apparently negotiated the three lanes going in the opposite direction from me, and was now waiting to get across the three lanes in the direction I was going.

Should I have stopped for him?

Why should he? If the guy in the next lane slams on his brakes because he sees a pedestrian and wants to be a good neighbor to the pedestrian (and a bad neighbor to everyone behind him), am I supposed to slam on my brakes, too? What if he's slamming on his brakes because whatever he's tripping on is making him see eighteen-foot high tarantulas?

I was talking about pedestrians in the crosswalk. The article is pointing out that drivers are ignoring pedestrians whether they're in the crosswalk or not. So why should pedestrians care whether they're crossing in the crosswalk or not since the vehicles are paying no mind no matter where they happen to be.

Drivers are driving way too fast to begin with and if they slowed down, it would allow them more time to take notice and be watchful of pedestrians waiting to cross, especially on a very busy street and particularly in front of a nine-story office building. Of course, people are crossing there.

 

[BPSCG]

I was talking about pedestrians in the crosswalk.

Oh. That's not what it sounded like when you wrote

Most of the time, they don’t even stop and seem totally oblivious that there are pedestrians waiting to cross.

(emphasis mine).

In any case, why are they in the crosswalk when drivers would have to slam on their brakes to avoid hitting them? I'm with Jocko on this - thin the herd.

 

[Hardenbergh]

Oh. That's not what it sounded like when you wrote (emphasis mine).

In any case, why are they in the crosswalk when drivers would have to slam on their brakes to avoid hitting them? I'm with Jocko on this - thin the herd.

I edited my previous to post to add something. Your comment about drivers having to slam on their brakes suggests that they are going much too fast on a busy street. They shouldn't have to slam on their brakes.

 

[MWare]

Heh. In New York jaywalking is a civil right handed down from Fiorello LaGuardia himself.

Indeed!

I don't cross the street without first making eye contact with the driver to make sure that I've been seen. Once I've been acknowledged or they're waving me across, then I feel reasonably safe in crossing the street.

For those of you visiting here, NEVER under any circumstances make eye contact with an oncoming NYC taxi if you are trying to cross the street. Once you make eye contact, you are now fair game, he knows you see him, thus he can lay on the gas and reasonably assume you will not just stand there. I've heard many stories from people who have visited here who are amazed when the cabby guns it when they are trying to cross. An ex of mine had just arrived from UK and was hit (more brushed really) in this kind of situation. Please consider this before playing chicken in NYC. What is hazardous driving in most places is generally considered sport here.

 

[Brickroad]

I ride my bicycle to get anywhere, and one of my pet peeves is when I'm sitting there waiting for the light to change (yes, bicyclists use green lights just like everyone else) and someone stops to wave me in front of them. Never mind the two lanes of traffic to their left which haven't stopped and don't intend to until the light turns red.

My other pet peeve of course is motorists who stop their cars in the middle of the crosswalk, forcing me to either jump the curb in front of them, or dismount my bike and walk it across in front of them.

Jaywalking (or jayrolling, as the case may be) is too dangerous a game for me. I would never jaywalk across a road I didn't know very well, and even then there has to be literally no traffic in sight. I've had far too many close calls while obeying the traffic laws to try my luck by breaking any of them (however humorous they may be).

 

[BPSCG]

For those of you visiting here, NEVER under any circumstances make eye contact with an oncoming NYC taxi if you are trying to cross the street. Once you make eye contact, you are now fair game, he knows you see him, thus he can lay on the gas and reasonably assume you will not just stand there.

True, that. Watch him out of the corner of your eye, but don't let him think you see him. If he he believes you don't see the taxi, most drivers probably won't deliberately run you down*, but if he can see that you see him, fuhgeddaboudit, the street belongs to him.

* Notice there are two qualifying terms that phrase...

 

[Hardenbergh]

This is one of the complaints expressed by an employee who works on the street in response to the warning about enforcing a fine for jaywalking:

So what’s the fine for failure to yield to a pedestrian in the crosswalk? The signs say “it’s the law” but where’s the enforcement on that? It’s happening everyday to people in this building that they are cut off by cars while they are crossing in the crosswalks. These are not rhetorical questions; I really would like to know.

Here's another one:

I was almost struck by a police car on Commercial. I was in the crosswalk, the first car stopped and the police car came racing up the other side. If I had not stepped back, I would have been hit. On the parking lot issue, I am about to file a claim with my insurance company for a large dent in my front bumper. Because there are no lines in the Elks lot, cars are parked at all sorts of angles. Apparently someone swiped my front bumper while trying to pull out. I know there are a lot e-mails flying about these issues. It seems the concern is who is looking out for our interests. Has DOT or the City of Augusta looked at putting a temporary traffic light at the intersection. This might alleviate a lot of the afor mentioned problems and ease the congestion or at least control it. Just my thoughts..

And another one:

I know that we are not supposed to reply to all, or mass email everyone, but I don’t think it matters where you are any more. I have almost been hit about 3 times while in the crosswalk. Not to mention the fact that you have to wait for up to 5 or 6 cars to go by before someone will even stop and let you cross. Who is monitoring that? I thought pedestrians had the right of way.

On another note, I think letting the parking district issue jaywalkers tickets is a mistake. They have way too much power as it is. Who polices them? They have been harassing me all week about the exact location of my parking sticker where it has not been an issue all this time and now they are harassing me because I stuck it on my windshield with tape instead of actually sticking it on. I don’t think they should be able to dictate what I stick on my vehicle and what I don’t. I know a lot of other people here have been harassed by them as well. For the amount of money the State pays for us to park here, as long as we display the sticker and are parked correctly, I think they should just leave us alone. Where does all that money go from the parking tickets? I don’t see any improvements in the parking areas for it, and I don’t see the parking district willing to be helpful if needed. They have created a very them and us mentality which is really too bad.

 

[BPSCG]

I edited my previous to post to add something. Your comment about drivers having to slam on their brakes suggests that they are going much too fast on a busy street. They shouldn't have to slam on their brakes.

They shouldn't have to step on the brakes at all if the light isn't red.

Your post that cites all the emails seems to suggest that there is no light or stop sign at this intersection. Is that the case?

If not, then the pedestrians have nothing to complain about unless the drivers are running through the red lights/stop signs. They can't just walk into the crosswalk against the light and expect everyone to come to a screeching halt.

If it is correct, then unfair as it may seem, the pedestrian has the obligation to wait until the intersection is clear and it's safe to walk, even if it's rush hour.

And this is from someone who (until recently) rode his bike to work, crossing several very busy intersections each time - one of them pretty nasty. So I feel your pain.

 

[Random]

They shouldn't have to step on the brakes at all if the light isn't red.

If the light is yellow you are legally obligated to stop your vehicle if it is safe to do so. It is not just a warning that a red light is coming up. Just saying.

 

[Hardenbergh]

They shouldn't have to step on the brakes at all if the light isn't red.

Your post that cites all the emails seems to suggest that there is no light or stop sign at this intersection. Is that the case?

If not, then the pedestrians have nothing to complain about unless the drivers are running through the red lights/stop signs. They can't just walk into the crosswalk against the light and expect everyone to come to a screeching halt.

If it is correct, then unfair as it may seem, the pedestrian has the obligation to wait until the intersection is clear and it's safe to walk, even if it's rush hour.

And this is from someone who (until recently) rode his bike to work, crossing several very busy intersections each time - one of them pretty nasty. So I feel your pain.

There isn't a traffic light on the end of the street in question.

 

[strathmeyer]

If the light is yellow you are legally obligated to stop your vehicle if it is safe to do so. It is not just a warning that a red light is coming up. Just saying.

Are you sure? Then what's the yellow light for? I'm pretty sure it's just a warning that a red light is coming. If not, then what's its use?

Are you saying that someone can get a ticket for going through a yellow light?

 

[BPSCG]

If the light is yellow you are legally obligated to stop your vehicle if it is safe to do so. It is not just a warning that a red light is coming up. Just saying.

Okay, you're right. My point was, when the light is green for the traffic, the traffic goes and the pedestrians are supposed to stay out of the way. Drivers are not supposed to stop in order to allow pedestrians to start crossing the street against the signal.

Is this really so complicated?

 

[Random]

Are you sure? Then what's the yellow light for? I'm pretty sure it's just a warning that a red light is coming. If not, then what's its use?

Are you saying that someone can get a ticket for going through a yellow light?

Shoot, just checked on the web and the finer details of a yellow light seem to be up for debate. Regardless, they all advise to stop if it is safe to do so, but it is unclear if this is a legal obligation in all states. It would be tough for a police officer to nail someone for this as the person could just go through the yellow light and say he did not feel that it was safe to stop. Of course, if you actually sped up in an effort to beat the red light, that would get you cited for failure to obey a signal.

 

[Hardenbergh]

Shoot, just checked on the web and the finer details of a yellow light seem to be up for debate. Regardless, they all advise to stop if it is safe to do so, but it is unclear if this is a legal obligation in all states. It would be tough for a police officer to nail someone for this as the person could just go through the yellow light and say he did not feel that it was safe to stop. Of course, if you actually sped up in an effort to beat the red light, that would get you cited for failure to obey a signal.

Many years ago, I was stopped by a police officer supposedly because I had gone through a red light but it definitely was yellow. I told him that I recalled very distinctly that the light was still yellow as I passed under the traffic light, my thinking being that he had stopped me for going through a red light. The light wasn't red at any time when I proceeded through.

On second thought, the officer might have been mean-spirited because of the speed with which I bolted through the yellow (though not red) light before it had a chance to change to red.

 

[shemp]

Wasn't this whole jaywalking thing done several years ago on The Man Show?

 

[Joe Random]

Many years ago, I was stopped by a police officer supposedly because I had gone through a red light but it definitely was yellow. I told him that I recalled very distinctly that the light was still yellow as I passed under the traffic light, my thinking being that he had stopped me for going through a red light. The light wasn't red at any time when I proceeded through.

On second thought, the officer might have been mean-spirited because of the speed with which I bolted through the yellow (though not red) light before it had a chance to change to red.

As far as California goes, yellow is just a warning - http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/hdbk/pgs16thru17.htm#traffic_lights .
Something I'd learned in traffic school recently but am so far unable to find an official cite for is that driving through an intersection on a red light is permissible if at least 50% of your car was in the intersection (over the innermost line) at the time the light turned yellow. As I'm not able to find that in a quick search of the CA vehicle code it might just be one of those things which everyone "knows" is true, but which really isn't.

 

[strathmeyer]

As far as California goes, yellow is just a warning - http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/hdbk/pgs16thru17.htm#traffic_lights .
Something I'd learned in traffic school recently but am so far unable to find an official cite for is that driving through an intersection on a red light is permissible if at least 50% of your car was in the intersection (over the innermost line) at the time the light turned yellow. As I'm not able to find that in a quick search of the CA vehicle code it might just be one of those things which everyone "knows" is true, but which really isn't.

Hmm... I always assumed that I just needed to get any part of my car past the white stop line before the light turned red. (Obviously just my assumptions won't stand up in court.)

I recently moved to Northern VA and am amazed at the people who can get their car to a complete stop before the light even turns red. But I shouldn't get started on other's driving habits...

(Oh, and yes, laws probably differ greatly state by state.)