Facebook bans far right groups

Skeptic Ginger said:
I find it hard to believe FB is banning people for right-wing views alone.
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Sure, there are other reasons: someone complained, and whoever Facebook has handling this stuff didn’t like them. That doesn’t apply to everyone with conservative opinions, but that doesn’t make it not a problem.
 
Ziggurat said:
Do you think that is an accurate representation of Trump’s rallies?
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I think is is a fair representation of the attitudes of a significant proportion of Trump supporters.

Have you heard Trump, at one of his rallies, say how he condones violence; how he would punch out people who disagree with him, how he invited attendees to beat up hecklers and offered to pay their legal fees if they would? Did you hear how all his disciples cheered when he did that?

Ziggurat said:
And are you a communist if communists join your protest against, say, the Iraq war? How easy does this association rub off?
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Nothing wrong with being politically right-wing such as an ultra-conservative, but there is everything with being a right-wing proponent of violence.

Nothing wrong with being politically left-wing such as a communist, but there is everything with being a left-wing proponent of violence.

If I was participating in a protest against the Irag war, and I was joined by communists, that would not make me a communist, but if I was joined by Antifa, then I would expect them to leave, and if they didn't then I would leave, because by remaining, I would be showing solidarity with them, and associating myself with them and that would make me Antifa in all but name.
 
Ziggurat said:
Sure, there are other reasons: someone complained, and whoever Facebook has handling this stuff didn’t like them. ....
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...and they were tied to a group pushing violence.

Of course maybe you don't think someone bashing immigrants and Muslims counts as potential violence.
 
Just as I suspected, you have a different view of some of these groups and issues, Zig.

Facebook and Instagram are banning white nationalism and separatism - They will prohibit praise, support and representation of the ideologies.
"We decided that the overlap between white nationalism, separatism, and white supremacy is so extensive we really can't make a meaningful distinction between them," Brian Fishman, Facebook's counterterrorism policy director, told Motherboard. "And that's because the language and the rhetoric that is used and the ideology that it represents overlaps to a degree that it is not a meaningful distinction."
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I can see why you think that's just about ideology. But others (including me) think you can't segregate the ideology from the violence they support, 2nd Amendment solutions and all that.
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
...and they were tied to a group pushing violence.

Of course maybe you don't think someone bashing immigrants and Muslims counts as potential violence.
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Are you going down that speech-is-violence road ?

That somebody voicing their opposition to illegal immigration has the potential for actual violence and should be banned ?
 
smartcooky said:
It is quite disturbing to see how many of these vile groups of bastards there are in the USA.... and these are the people that some posters here would like to see given every opportunity to spread their vileness.

Meanwhile, when a violent group at the other end of the political spectrum has their so-called free speech rights infringed, we get crickets!

This speaks volumes!
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That's not quite true - it's actually even worse.

So-called "free speech advocates" often are silent even when explicitly *nonviolent* views on the left are targeted by government officials (eg. Black Lives Matter, UC Berkley, Refuse Fascism), and such groups are often smeared as "terrorists" or "hate groups" by the same people.

ETA:
smartcooky said:
I think is is a fair representation of the attitudes of a significant proportion of Trump supporters.

Have you heard Trump, at one of his rallies, say how he condones violence; how he would punch out people who disagree with him, how he invited attendees to beat up hecklers and offered to pay their legal fees if they would? Did you hear how all his disciples cheered when he did that?
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We've also seen multiple people assault protestors or journalists at Dolt 45's hate rallies, after the idiot repeatedly suggested violence as an appropriate response. Cheeto Benito has also embraced a congressman that attacked a reporter in response to a rather mild question.
 
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Stout said:
Are you going down that speech-is-violence road ?

That somebody voicing their opposition to illegal immigration has the potential for actual violence and should be banned ?
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Where are you going to draw the line?

A bunch of idiots marching with Tiki torches chanting blood and soil? Free speech.

One of them driving into a crowd killing a woman? Ban that guy from FB.

:rolleyes:
 
smartcooky said:
Nothing wrong with being politically right-wing such as an ultra-conservative, but there is everything with being a right-wing proponent of violence.

Nothing wrong with being politically left-wing such as a communist, but there is everything with being a left-wing proponent of violence.
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Darat claims you can’t separate Nazism from violence. Why is communism any different?

If I was participating in a protest against the Irag war, and I was joined by communists, that would not make me a communist, but if I was joined by Antifa, then I would expect them to leave, and if they didn't then I would leave, because by remaining, I would be showing solidarity with them, and associating myself with them and that would make me Antifa in all but name.
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Then you are essentially giving fringe groups a veto over your causes. And most people aren’t going to do that.
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
Just as I suspected, you have a different view of some of these groups and issues, Zig.

Facebook and Instagram are banning white nationalism and separatism - They will prohibit praise, support and representation of the ideologies.


I can see why you think that's just about ideology. But others (including me) think you can't segregate the ideology from the violence they support, 2nd Amendment solutions and all that.
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And how is communism ultimately any different? Because it isn’t.
 
Ziggurat said:
Darat claims you can’t separate Nazism from violence. Why is communism any different?....
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Based on current events the difference is clear.

Back in the 60s when the Weather Underground was bombing various targets, then you might have a case.

Also, currently I would have no issue with FB banning PETA.
 
First, they came for the Alt-right, then they came for the far-right, next they got the Klan.......
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
Where are you going to draw the line?

A bunch of idiots marching with Tiki torches chanting blood and soil? Free speech.

One of them driving into a crowd killing a woman? Ban that guy from FB.

:rolleyes:
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That was actually a direct question.

Can speech that doesn't specifically call for violence be classed as violence ?
 
Stout said:
That was actually a direct question.

Can speech that doesn't specifically call for violence be classed as violence ?
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I thought I answered it. Yes.

Will no one free me of this meddlesome priest? Where is the violence in "free me"? That was my point, links are not necessarily direct.

Maybe you don't like FB deciding because you like the ideology and don't believe you are promoting violence. Where are you recommending the line be drawn?
 
I wonder how many of those whining about this FB decision think SNL should be censored.
 
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