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Cont: Electric Vehicles II

Full circle back to what I first said lol- most do charge a nominal fee here if you are charging an EV here (usually $10) but it really is a 'emergency topup' situation as you are only using a 3.6kw charge rate charger after all (and it would really only be in some 'wide spot in the road' that you would need to, as chargers here are so common....

After all, even my little town in rural Queensland (all 1500 of us) in the middle of nowhere has a EV charger here now and drive to any of the three 'nearby' towns (an hours drive away mind you) and between them there's another seven or so chargers available...

If we Aussies can do it in a country the size of the US, but with a population only a third of the UK's, I can't se why other countries are finding it so difficult...
It's difficult because they don't want to do it - or at least they are busy finding reasons not to do it.

Here in South East Wales slow chargers are being added all the time but there are issues with the National Grid which means that fast chargers are more difficult and much more costly to install.

That said, if there were lots of 22kw chargers out there then most people would only require two or three hours charging a week even if they didn't have a home charger.
 
I think that's an important observation. If everyone had the opportunity to charge their car wherever it was parked overnight (or for extended periods during the day), then demand for DC charging would be limited to people on long-distance road trips. I think that's how it should be.
 
I think that's an important observation. If everyone had the opportunity to charge their car wherever it was parked overnight (or for extended periods during the day), then demand for DC charging would be limited to people on long-distance road trips. I think that's how it should be.
It's also better for the batteries to slow charge as opposed to fast charge. At least that was the common wisdom until recently. There has been recent studies that suggest this isn't true. But I admit having a bit of bias against press that supports the narrative that big companies are pushing. Planned obsolescence isn't just a conspiracy theory. There is little interest for products lasting a long time.
 
There's always a market for a durable product as opposed to a throwaway one. Vimes' boots isn't an advert for the cheap ones.
 
In the US. At least how they typically charged at State and National Park campsites, it was a fee depending on the type of campsite. One with an AC hookup and one without. I never saw a anything that charged for how much electricity you used. There are also a lot of private campsites like KOA. But I have never used any of those.
That's how our caravan parks mostly work too- you can rent a 'tent site ie unpowered site, or a 'caravan site' ie powered site (different daily rates)- both otherwise give you full access to the parks amenities (toilet/shower block, usually a 'camp kitchen' ie BBQ, sink etc, and often a swimming pool as well, electricity and water usage at the powered sites are almost always unmetered (some parks do meter and charge, but thats rare) and usually cabins as well for those driving but with no caravan- most also offer daily, weekly and 'permanent' rates for those staying in an area longterm (I lived in the 'White Whale' at various caravan parks throughout Queensland and NSW for a couple of decades as a longterm 'permanent' (pay weekly) for months at a time depending on where I was working at the time in the mines... stayed at this one for over a year lol)
1739838191792.png

National parks here on the other hand are almost all 'camping grounds'- no power, limited water and basic amenities block (usually just a basic toilet block, with composting toilet block shipped in) often no showers either, usually really for tents or very small caravans indeed (most the ones I've stayed in when on holidays, there's no way I could have gotten the White Whale into them- at 10m/30ft long it just wouldn't fit in most lol)
Again one I have stayed at (in NSW)

1739839057590.png
Thats about as big a caravan as you could get in there (the little poptop in the center)- and if you want a shower- bring your own (thats what the funny blue tent is on the left- a 'shower tent'- that one is actually quite nice, modern composter toilets (same company as made mine here lol) instead of the old 'longdrops' found in some parks, wood (free) BBQs scattered around or 'pay for use' LPG BBQ plates in a small 'camp kitchen, limited water at the kitchen sink (from rainwater tanks) and picnic tables
If you want power- bring your own solar and batteries (NO generators allowed at most campsites) and if you fired one up- you will be asked to 'turn that POS off before I inset it somewhere it will appear on your next xray'... and thats the polite version...
 
I may have said this before, but here's another way of doing it.

1739840905955.jpeg

You can just see the cable going from the left rear of the car into the tent. That is the VtL cable, and I think he had a 4-socket adapter on the end. He had a fridge, lights, chargers for phones etc and the pump for the air mattresses connected. I think there was also something about a small heater, and certainly you could have electric blankets plugged in. He didn't say anything about cooking, but kettle, induction hob, microwave are all possible.

So if there is a public DC charger reasonably close, you're completely sorted. In fact for a night or two you don't even need that. 7% of battery used in 16 hours, apparently. I suppose more if you were cooking, or needed a lot of heating. Go to any camp site you like, and you have your own power with you.
 
There's always a market for a durable product as opposed to a throwaway one. Vimes' boots isn't an advert for the cheap ones.
There is. But it also leads to customers not replacing products. I mean, why buy a new car when the old one runs fine?
 
That's how our caravan parks mostly work too- you can rent a 'tent site ie unpowered site, or a 'caravan site' ie powered site (different daily rates)- both otherwise give you full access to the parks amenities (toilet/shower block, usually a 'camp kitchen' ie BBQ, sink etc, and often a swimming pool as well, electricity and water usage at the powered sites are almost always unmetered (some parks do meter and charge, but thats rare) and usually cabins as well for those driving but with no caravan- most also offer daily, weekly and 'permanent' rates for those staying in an area longterm (I lived in the 'White Whale' at various caravan parks throughout Queensland and NSW for a couple of decades as a longterm 'permanent' (pay weekly) for months at a time depending on where I was working at the time in the mines... stayed at this one for over a year lol)
View attachment 59106

National parks here on the other hand are almost all 'camping grounds'- no power, limited water and basic amenities block (usually just a basic toilet block, with composting toilet block shipped in) often no showers either, usually really for tents or very small caravans indeed (most the ones I've stayed in when on holidays, there's no way I could have gotten the White Whale into them- at 10m/30ft long it just wouldn't fit in most lol)
Again one I have stayed at (in NSW)

View attachment 59108
Thats about as big a caravan as you could get in there (the little poptop in the center)- and if you want a shower- bring your own (thats what the funny blue tent is on the left- a 'shower tent'- that one is actually quite nice, modern composter toilets (same company as made mine here lol) instead of the old 'longdrops' found in some parks, wood (free) BBQs scattered around or 'pay for use' LPG BBQ plates in a small 'camp kitchen, limited water at the kitchen sink (from rainwater tanks) and picnic tables
If you want power- bring your own solar and batteries (NO generators allowed at most campsites) and if you fired one up- you will be asked to 'turn that POS off before I inset it somewhere it will appear on your next xray'... and thats the polite version...
That is exactly what it is like here. But it's a real mixture when it comes to amenities. Lots of sites are just a parking place and a grill and maybe a picnic table and maybe showers and restrooms. Others have full RV hookups with water, power, waste hookup at your site whereas others have a central location to dump your black and grey water and garbage. I biked across the country in my 20s and would stop at parks sometimes to pitch a tent and other times just to shower.
 
I may have said this before, but here's another way of doing it.

View attachment 59109

You can just see the cable going from the left rear of the car into the tent. That is the VtL cable, and I think he had a 4-socket adapter on the end. He had a fridge, lights, chargers for phones etc and the pump for the air mattresses connected. I think there was also something about a small heater, and certainly you could have electric blankets plugged in. He didn't say anything about cooking, but kettle, induction hob, microwave are all possible.

So if there is a public DC charger reasonably close, you're completely sorted. In fact for a night or two you don't even need that. 7% of battery used in 16 hours, apparently. I suppose more if you were cooking, or needed a lot of heating. Go to any camp site you like, and you have your own power with you.
Strangely, I do a lot of 'free camping' here (I like my beach fishing- and as its about four hours drive to get to the beach, it a 'weekend trip' lol)

Sleep in the back of the Hilux, (diesel- a round trip is over a couple of hundred bucks!!!) and as it has an inverter and 'house batteries' in it, I can use the small fridge, microwave, laptop, toaster and kettle with ease...

Camp in the dunes and spend two or three days fishing...

I 'do' solar charge the battery bank if needed- but as I charge while driving, I really don't need to unless I'm there for more than a couple of days... a fully charged battery bank will last that long...
(my previous 4wd had solar panels permanently mounted to the roof, the lux I just carry them in the back and put up leaning against the side- dont trust the canopy enough for a permanent mount to it...)

So its not exactly a new concept, but adding an EV to the mix would definitely make a weekends fishing a hell of a lot cheaper...

(one big difference was replacing the original pair of L/A batts for lithiums- 40kg of L/A was replaced by less than 10kg of LYP...)
From
1739862655560.jpeg
to
1739862615798.jpeg
with the same storage capacity...
:-O
 
Strangely, I do a lot of 'free camping' here (I like my beach fishing- and as its about four hours drive to get to the beach, it a 'weekend trip' lol)

Sleep in the back of the Hilux, (diesel- a round trip is over a couple of hundred bucks!!!) and as it has an inverter and 'house batteries' in it, I can use the small fridge, microwave, laptop, toaster and kettle with ease...

Camp in the dunes and spend two or three days fishing...

I 'do' solar charge the battery bank if needed- but as I charge while driving, I really don't need to unless I'm there for more than a couple of days... a fully charged battery bank will last that long...
(my previous 4wd had solar panels permanently mounted to the roof, the lux I just carry them in the back and put up leaning against the side- dont trust the canopy enough for a permanent mount to it...)

So its not exactly a new concept, but adding an EV to the mix would definitely make a weekends fishing a hell of a lot cheaper...

(one big difference was replacing the original pair of L/A batts for lithiums- 40kg of L/A was replaced by less than 10kg of LYP...)
From
View attachment 59112
to
View attachment 59111
with the same storage capacity...
:-O

I've done it your way but in an EV. Sleep in the car with the heating on all night (or aircon I suppose in hot weather) then just plug the kettle and so on into the car in the morning. I don't have a fridge as such, I use a cool box with a small refrigeration unit in its lid that plugs into the car's cigarette lighter socket.

It's the ability to heat the cabin all night and not have the windows running with condensation that's the game changer.
 
My State of Washington has legislators discussing how to tax by the mile.
This bill? https://lawfilesext.leg.wa.gov/biennium/2025-26/Pdf/Bills/House Bills/1921.pdf?q=20250218041002 I think it sucks.
It has the greatest impact on EV and fuel efficient vehicles. It does not tax the gas guzzlers that get <20 mpg.

I was in the market for an E-bike a few years ago. But WA has a punitive registration fee of $150. I was paying about $50 a year in gas tax riding my Harley to and from work. My legislators were entirely uninterested in making any changes to encourage EV use.

Summary. https://lawfilesext.leg.wa.gov/bien...rts/House/1921 HBA TR 25.pdf?q=20250218041002

 
There is. But it also leads to customers not replacing products. I mean, why buy a new car when the old one runs fine?

The industry is just going to have to adapt to this. EVs are going to be more durable than ICE cars ever were, so the total size of the market is going to shrink accordingly.
 
The industry is just going to have to adapt to this. EVs are going to be more durable than ICE cars ever were, so the total size of the market is going to shrink accordingly.
Maybe revenue from subscription services, servicing, and battery management services may go some way to offset this.
 
That's another issue though. EVs need a lot less servicing than ICE cars do. Tesla says don't even bother, just fix things that break and keep an eye on your tyres etc. After three years an MOT will do. Also they need fewer repairs, because fewer moving parts. Batteries are proving very robust and long-lasting, so the number of cars needing battery work is likely to be small. Charging for updates that actually improve the car (rather than just being bug-fixes) is one possibility.
 
The industry is just going to have to adapt to this. EVs are going to be more durable than ICE cars ever were, so the total size of the market is going to shrink accordingly.
I agree that they should be. They are far less complex. Far less moving parts to wear out. But we all know that profit is the ultimate driver.
 
I have a suspicion that the long warranty periods on EVs aren't so much because they're very unlikely to develop a serious fault in the first 8 years or so, but so that the manufacturers can insist on yearly "services" (inspections) to maintain the warranty. They've got you by the short and curlies for the warranty period.
 
I have a suspicion that the long warranty periods on EVs aren't so much because they're very unlikely to develop a serious fault in the first 8 years or so, but so that the manufacturers can insist on yearly "services" (inspections) to maintain the warranty. They've got you by the short and curlies for the warranty period.
Well, not completely, though I think you have a point which I was about to mention myself. In most cases, you don't need to go to the main dealer for the servicing, but the place which does it needs to be certified at some level. I'm still using the main Kia dealer for mine, but that's partly because the car came with a service package and I didn't need to pay for the first 3 services (I think that was an error, but I wasn't going to argue; the car was owned by the garage and used by one of their staff for six months). It's also fairly convenient for me, even though an alternative might be a bit cheaper.
 
I have a suspicion that the long warranty periods on EVs aren't so much because they're very unlikely to develop a serious fault in the first 8 years or so, but so that the manufacturers can insist on yearly "services" (inspections) to maintain the warranty. They've got you by the short and curlies for the warranty period.

In the U.S., a manufacturer may not mandate factory services or inspections to maintain a warranty, unless such services or inspections are provided free of charge. That’s so there’s no “lock in” - anyone can do those services or inspections.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnuson–Moss_Warranty_Act
 
That's all very well, but the main carrot to get you to the service is the application of software updates, and if you choose not to go to a main dealer you're not going to get them. Over a barrel, really.

I always had my previous car, a Golf, serviced by a local independent dealer. The only downside was that when its engine blew up inside the warranty period they gave my garage the third degree trying to find some way to weasel out of liability (they failed), and then they refused to provide me with a courtesy car while they had my car in fitting a new engine. But it's different now with all the software updates.
 
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