Egypt Protesters storm US Embassy

richardm said:
So far the only group I've seen linked is Ansar al-Sharia, and they say it wasn't them. Perhaps that's because they've already got an eye open for drones. Or perhaps it wasn't them. Should we just kill them all and let God sort them out like in the good old days?
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uke2se said:
You'll have to forgive me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that a terrorist group had claimed responsibility.
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This CBS News article reports that Ansar al-Sharia did claim responsibility.
 
ANTPogo said:
This post at Foreign Policy says that the particular timing of the attacks was because an Egyptian TV program played translated clips of the movie in question.
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That's another imam from the same affiliation drumming up controversy on that television program.

From what scant evidence we have, it seems like a group (likely the ones behind the attack on the American Ambassador to Libya) wanted some riots at embassies on 9/11. So they spoke to some sympathetic imams, and looked around for something they could use as a stalking horse and lied the mob into a frenzy. The youtube video was what they chose, but it alone was insufficient, so they made up the story about it being released in American theaters.

Either way, I don't see how Terry Jones is to blame for this. He promoted a youtube video that was shot a year ago and was uploaded back in July. For two months it sat on youtube causing no anger, no riots. It was chosen by the imams as the basis for their 9/11 riots because they needed something to lie about. There's plenty of anti-Islam stuff out on the internet to choose from.
 
What did the US and GB think was going to happen in Libya when they got rid of the old Regime. They were going to get Anarchy and extremists.

Why are people surprised?
 
ANTPogo said:
This CBS News article reports that Ansar al-Sharia did claim responsibility.
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Nothing to do with us, honest

BBC said:
Reports say a militia known as the Ansar al-Sharia brigade was involved in the attack, but the group has denied the claim
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The BBC article has been more recently updated than the CBS one.

Edit: Sorry, I didn't mean to sound so snarky, uke2se, I've had a very annoying day :)
 
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These rioters and murderers are so stupid, they are making this anti-Islam video a lot better known than it would have been otherwise(I never even heard of it before these riots, and the same may be true for most people). On top of that, their behavior is proving the point of the people who made the film.

The makers of this film couldn't ask for better publicity. And this idea that we should throw the film-maker or people promoting it to the angry mob - you want to revert to the days before we had free speech and democracy, and we surrendered to angry religious mobs and their leaders? I don't think we would have had any social progress at all if we always surrendered to angry mobs of racists, sexists, creationists, etc.

And how many times did we(in the U.S anyway) have to deal with such people who stood in the way of progress? And yet, in the long-term, they were all defeated. The makers of anti-Islam films may not be fighting for progress per se, but this is still an important free speech issue. If people can't say these unkind things about Islam, because of angry mobs protesting them, what other restrictions should we make?
 
marksman said:
The youtube video was what they chose, but it alone was insufficient, so they made up the story about it being released in American theaters.
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Well, this article says it was shown in a theater in America (albeit a "mostly empty" one) at least once.

But I think you're pretty much right about the hows and the whys of this.
 
ANTPogo said:
Well, this article says it was shown in a theater in America (albeit a "mostly empty" one) at least once.
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The filmmaker said it was shown in one theater earlier this year (likely in July). But the instigation by the imams was that it was being released nationwide on 9/11, which is blatantly false.

I could show my home movies in a theater if I wanted to rent the space. That wasn't part of the imams' jeremiad.
 
marksman said:
The filmmaker said it was shown in one theater earlier this year (likely in July). But the instigation by the imams was that it was being released nationwide on 9/11, which is blatantly false.
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Yeah, it's pretty clear that they purposefully and heavily distorted the truth to achieve a specific result.

An, unfortunately, they seem to have succeeded...
 
NoZed Avenger said:
Now the sentiment that 'Jones is an idiot spewing hate and it wouldn't hurt our feelings if he just had a little lie down for the next 40-50 years and shut the hell up' IS one I can fully get behind.

But the above is a gracious post that I am glad to see. However, I will, in my memoirs, put it down to my fabulous writing and advocacy skills rather than your inherent decency so as to avoid owing you any royalties.
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;)

Just mention Pearl and Dani in your memoir, too...
 
The earlier statement by the embassy about offending religious feeling has been disowned by the white house, and it clearly came long before anyone was hurt. Yeah someone should be fired, or something done about the chain of approval surely.

But Romney held a press conference this mornin about it and the RNC chairman has tweeted that Obama sympathizes with the attackers.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/wp/2012/09/12/the-politics-of-the-libya-attack/

Romney’s approach hands the Obama team an opening to cast the challenger as not ready for the job, someone who jumps to conclusions before all the facts are known. *And, at least at the moment, that appears to be the stronger (political) argument.
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Word
 
Few people are going to sort through the mess. People who like Romney will believe that Obama apologized to the rioters. People who like Obama will think the embassy did some unremarkable and ultimately unsuccessful diplomacy to reduce tension. (Heck, they may even inappropriately attribute the release for why the Egyptian embassy wasn't stormed when Libya's was!)

Few people will care to look at the actual facts. Few people will be swayed either way by this entire exchange.
 
Romney is getting hammemered by pretty much everybody in every party right now, this is clearly going to be a defining moment.

“Bungle… utter disaster…not ready for prime time… not presidential… Lehman moment.” And that's just the Republicans.

...

"I guess we see now that it is because they’re incompetent at talking effectively about foreign policy," said the Republican. "This is just unbelievable — when they decide to play on it they completely bungle it." - Bill Kristol!
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http://www.buzzfeed.com/bensmith/foreign-policy-hands-voice-disbelief-at-romney-cai?s=mobile

Romney has ********** this up worse than you even know! He didn't back down and dug himself deeper!

It’s not clear how well Romney would have understood the falsity of his claim. Perhaps he was confused about the timeline or the authorship, making his statement merely a single lie rather than a double or triple lie. In any case, Romney’s abhorrence of apologies required him to avoid steering his attack even slightly away from its original course. He insisted, “It’s never too early for the United States government to condemn attacks on Americans and to defend our values.”
Never too early? Not even before the attacks had occurred, which is when the statement in question was issued?
http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2012/09/mitts-apology-tour-line-crashes-against-reality.html
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What a *********** moron!
 
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ANTPogo said:
I get the feeling that the movie was not the cause of these attacks nearly as much as it was an opportunity for these attacks. The Washington Post reported that the US ambassador to Libya was killed when his car was hit by an RPG.

That's not Muslims angry and protesting about a movie, that's a planned terrorist attack.
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Looking more & more like that.

Now, will the Obama admins reponses give Romney an opening? I can hope anyway. Coupled with Obama's apparent Jewish problem, maybe a new electoral game again.
 
NoZed Avenger said:
And people drew cartoons "knowing full well" the reaction from violent islamists. So throw them to the mob, too.

Let's make a list right now of things we cannot criticize, now that we know full well that violent crazies will sieze upon the flimsiest excuse to shut us up.

But recognize: that lsit is going to get ever longer. Because your actions in appeasing their demands will just serve to increase those demands and increase the violence until nothing, no matter how trivial, can be said against them.
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Seems like a perfect opportunity to make Libya, Egypt (and for that matter Iran) radioactive glass. Then, "Hi Pakistan, Yemen, Afghanistan and Syria.".

Where is a Reagan when needed rather than the Carter we have?
 
AlBell said:
Seems like a perfect opportunity to make Libya, Egypt (and for that matter Iran) radioactive glass. Then, "Hi Pakistan, Yemen, Afghanistan and Syria.".

Where is a Reagan when needed rather than the Carter we have?
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How did Regan achieve what he did? Droppin' bombs, or diplomacy?

AND

Did he do that versus an actual government, or a bunch of rabble rousing idiots?
 
AlBell said:
Seems like a perfect opportunity to make Libya, Egypt (and for that matter Iran) radioactive glass. Then, "Hi Pakistan, Yemen, Afghanistan and Syria.".
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"Those people are violent, aggressive crazies! We should kill tens of millions of men, women and children by using nuclear weapons to completely wipe out half a dozen countries!"
 
I think the State Department should immediately issue a statement condemning Al Bell's post before someone reacts inappropriately.
 
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