Split Thread [Ed] Personal experiences with gays

[DC]

Ok so I am somewhat torn now. I have spoken to my wife about the issue, and she pretty much echoed the same sentiments that you guys have. But there is an issue. She said that there are two guys at her work who she had absolutely NO idea that they were gay until they came out to her. She said there was just no way of telling. Problem is, a couple of weeks ago I had seen these same two individuals on her facebook and immediately identified them as gay by their profile pictures. Basically, they posted on her wall, and I asked who they were. She said they were friends from work, and I said they are gay huh? She said, how did you know?!

To me, it was just obvious. They were portraying a demeanor that was very similar to those I had seen at the club on 80s night. So basically the issue is that might wife could not identify them as gay when it was so blatantly obvious. But she does have me leaning more towards what you guys are saying, and that maybe there are more non camp acting gays out there then I think.

are you saying we have feminin sentiments?

 

[Quad4_72]

OMG, your gaydar is teh bomb! Two whole people! Because it seemed like they had a passing familiarity with dance clubs. What, were they vouging?

Dude, the gays that aren't telling you they are gay have no agenda beyond keeping their sexuality private. They aren't going to sneak up and get gay cooties all over you. They aren't scary. They're just people who are trying to get by in the way that works best for them. Denying that they exist doesn't keep you safe from them because they weren't a threat in the first place.

You are suggesting that I am either afraid of gays, dislike gays, have something against gays, etc. Please provide evidence for this suggestion.

 

[MarkCorrigan]

You are suggesting that I am either afraid of gays, dislike gays, have something against gays, etc. Please provide evidence for this suggestion.

No, we're saying you're profoundly ignorant about gay people and as such use sweeping generalisations about them.

 

[Belz...]

Ok so I am somewhat torn now. I have spoken to my wife about the issue, and she pretty much echoed the same sentiments that you guys have. But there is an issue. She said that there are two guys at her work who she had absolutely NO idea that they were gay until they came out to her. She said there was just no way of telling. Problem is, a couple of weeks ago I had seen these same two individuals on her facebook and immediately identified them as gay by their profile pictures. Basically, they posted on her wall, and I asked who they were. She said they were friends from work, and I said they are gay huh? She said, how did you know?!

To me, it was just obvious. They were portraying a demeanor that was very similar to those I had seen at the club on 80s night. So basically the issue is that might wife could not identify them as gay when it was so blatantly obvious. But she does have me leaning more towards what you guys are saying, and that maybe there are more non camp acting gays out there then I think.

I think there's a million dollars waiting for you, then.

 

[Belz...]

Fascinating and hilarious thread.

Just my sample here:
I personally know/have met about 10-15 openly gay people and one bi-guy. One of them a huge cousin who came out to his brother in his teens, yet had girlfriends well into his twenties; lots of them.
As a hapless straight guy, I would never have guessed.

Of course not. You don't have Quad's amazing ability to smell gays. Just like Kim Kardashian can smell cavities in people's mouths.

 

[Belz...]

No, we're saying you're profoundly ignorant about gay people and as such use sweeping generalisations about them.

Kinda reminds you about theists and their sweeping generalisations about atheists, eh ?

 

[H'ethetheth]

Of course not. You don't have Quad's amazing ability to smell gays. Just like Kim Kardashian can smell cavities in people's mouths.

Well, in Quad's defense, I am generally a fairly hapless guy anyway.

And in Kardashian's defense, sensitivity for the scent of rotting flesh is not something I consider all too surprising. In fact, all scavengers depend on it.

 

[bookitty]

You are suggesting that I am either afraid of gays, dislike gays, have something against gays, etc. Please provide evidence for this suggestion.

You have a specific window of behavior that you have identified as "gay." All gay people are x. For some reason, you will not admit that gay includes the same wealth of human interaction that heterosexuals enjoy, even though you have been given 14 pages of evidence.

You are obviously uncomfortable with the idea of not knowing whether a person is gay or not. It's to the point where you cling to the nelly stereotype, even though it is a hurtful one. But why do you care? Nobody's sex life or orientation is any of your business.

I was trapped at Fort Benning, GA for three months and I lived on Ohau for three years. If I were to say that, based on this experience, all military personnel are 18 year-old loud-mouths who are only concerned with getting laid and talking about shooting people, you might think I had a problem with soldiers. Especially if I went on for 14 pages, and ignored all evidence to the contrary.

It's true that there are quite a few cocky boys in the military who are away from home for the first time and not on their best behavior. They get the most negative attention. But it would be wrong to say that this phase represents the entire military.

 

[bookitty]

repost

 

[Quad4_72]

You have a specific window of behavior that you have identified as "gay." All gay people are x. For some reason, you will not admit that gay includes the same wealth of human interaction that heterosexuals enjoy, even though you have been given 14 pages of evidence.

You are obviously uncomfortable with the idea of not knowing whether a person is gay or not. It's to the point where you cling to the nelly stereotype, even though it is a hurtful one. But why do you care? Nobody's sex life or orientation is any of your business.

I was trapped at Fort Benning, GA for three months and I lived on Ohau for three years. If I were to say that, based on this experience, all military personnel are 18 year-old loud-mouths who are only concerned with getting laid and talking about shooting people, you might think I had a problem with soldiers. Especially if I went on for 14 pages, and ignored all evidence to the contrary.

It's true that there are quite a few cocky boys in the military who are away from home for the first time and not on their best behavior. They get the most negative attention. But it would be wrong to say that this phase represents the entire military.

Bolding mine. I never said all gay people are a certain way. I said from my personal experience, MOST gay people act more feminine. After speaking with my wife, perhaps maybe I should lower my number a little bit of the gay people who act feminine.

 

[Mr. Scott]

Quad4_72, you seem to completely disregard the opinions and observations of people who might know more than you, and unwilling to consider that there may be more straight acting gays that you haven't observed than there are effeminate gays you have. It's like claiming all Taliban carry AK-47s and are constantly shooting down infidels, while not considering that the majority of Taliban my look like ordinary Afghans.

BTW, you're allowing a classic logical fallacy: Affirming the Consequent.

Examples from wiki:

Argument: If people have the flu, they cough. Torres is coughing. Therefore, Torres has the flu.
Problem: Other things, such as asthma, can cause someone to cough.
Argument: If it rains, the ground gets wet. The ground is wet, therefore it rained.
Problem: There are other ways by which the ground could get wet (e.g. someone spilled water).

Yours: All effeminate men I met were all gay. Therefore, all gay men are effeminate.

 

[H'ethetheth]

... After speaking with my wife, perhaps maybe I should lower my number a little bit of the gay people who act feminine.

Actually, you might have done that right after the third reply on this subject 14 pages ago, in which the circularity of your method for establishing this number was pointed out.

 

[Quad4_72]

Quad4_72, you seem to completely disregard the opinions and observations of people who might know more than you, and unwilling to consider that there may be more straight acting gays that you haven't observed than there are effeminate gays you have. It's like claiming all Taliban carry AK-47s and are constantly shooting down infidels, while not considering that the majority of Taliban my look like ordinary Afghans.

BTW, you're allowing a classic logical fallacy: Affirming the Consequent.

Examples from wiki:

Argument: If people have the flu, they cough. Torres is coughing. Therefore, Torres has the flu.
Problem: Other things, such as asthma, can cause someone to cough.
Argument: If it rains, the ground gets wet. The ground is wet, therefore it rained.
Problem: There are other ways by which the ground could get wet (e.g. someone spilled water).

Yours: All effeminate men I met were all gay. Therefore, all gay men are effeminate.

I guess you missed my previous post...

 

[Quad4_72]

Actually, you might have done that right after the third reply on this subject 14 pages ago, in which the circularity of your method for establishing this number was pointed out.

Well that wouldn't have been much fun now would it?

 

[bookitty]

Bolding mine. I never said all gay people are a certain way. I said from my personal experience, MOST gay people act more feminine. After speaking with my wife, perhaps maybe I should lower my number a little bit of the gay people who act feminine.

Please send my regards to your wife who seems to have managed more with a casual comment than dozens of skeptics could do in 14 pages.

As I am an optimist, I read this post as a very manly attempt to sorta maybe kinda admit to tiny error in judgment. (My husband is very much the same way. That comment from him would be the equivalent of a full mea culpa complete with tears and rending of the garb.) It's always admirable when a board member can admit to a change of heart after a vigorous defense. Kudos.

 

[zooterkin]

As a daywalker ( bisexual male.) i would like to shed some light on this.

The amount of gay men that " flame" is roughly equivalent to the amount of straight men that are overly straight. And by overly straight i mean those among the straight population who proudly display their macho traits, from nudges and comments at a sexy butt, to loud exclamations about who is the bigger ****** in a ufc match.

The thing is to straight men, that behavior is not annoying.

I guess I'm gay, then...

 

[H'ethetheth]

Well that wouldn't have been much fun now would it?

That is a good point.

 

[zooterkin]

Ok so I am somewhat torn now. I have spoken to my wife about the issue, and she pretty much echoed the same sentiments that you guys have. But there is an issue. She said that there are two guys at her work who she had absolutely NO idea that they were gay until they came out to her. She said there was just no way of telling. Problem is, a couple of weeks ago I had seen these same two individuals on her facebook and immediately identified them as gay by their profile pictures. Basically, they posted on her wall, and I asked who they were. She said they were friends from work, and I said they are gay huh? She said, how did you know?!

To me, it was just obvious. They were portraying a demeanor that was very similar to those I had seen at the club on 80s night. So basically the issue is that might wife could not identify them as gay when it was so blatantly obvious. But she does have me leaning more towards what you guys are saying, and that maybe there are more non camp acting gays out there then I think.

Is it possible that they act differently in the office from how they were in the photos?

 

[Quad4_72]

Is it possible that they act differently in the office from how they were in the photos?

Yes indeed it is.

 

[Darat]

If you read up in the thread Professor Yaffle included some links that go to reports into checking to see if people can correctly distinguish a persons sexuality and they attempted to remove the problem of people's self-selection of their photo.

And Quad - I would be a tad worried if I was you... one of the reports indicates that homosexuals are better at determining someone's sexuality from just a photo (than heterosexuals) so this may not want to be a skill that you want to claim a better than average success rate!