Does procreation offer proof;

[Bishadi]

No, that's just too easy a target.

i agree, as to be ignorant is just too easy; look at the posts of just rants as few give themselves credit for being alive.

 

[Emet]

I know the painted wagon is usually reserved for a different poster's threads, but is there any chance of it being pressed into service over here?

I don't read those threads. Can someone point me to the painted wagon?

Thanks.

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Ok, Mr/Miss/AI Bishad, you claim to be smart, so answer this question:

If you put something hot in a Thermos^TM bottle (aka vacuum flask), it keeps it hot. If you put in something cold, it keeps it cold. How does it know which to do?

I await your answer.

 

[Mashuna]

We don't need a painted wagon for this, Mashuna: what we are going to do is be in several places at once: we can do this because we don't exist in any meaningful sense: we are some kind of process and we are all that process simultaneously: so we can be in several threads at the same time without any problem. That is the nature of "life itself": its position is indeterminate

At least I think that is how it works .

Can you organise a cue so we can be sure that we are all in many places at once? I think some creepy music is what is needed

Ok, creepy music it is, plus ghostly painted wagons moving soundlessly through each thread. Always promising the possibility of going somewhere meaningful, but ultimately going round in mysterious and incomprehensible ways, never reaching an end point.

 

[nescafe]

Quite. Conversely, if you're cold, wearing a thick coat and sitting by a fire, open the coat up to warm yourself faster.

Fire, how the heck does it work? Must violate the second law, warming me up like that.

 

[Foster Zygote]

that is funny.

All that cold per se empty space but for some reason there are collectives of mass, in little balls making the sky look black will lil'white dots.


billlions of years and still not much equilibration going on.

Stars die too. They burn through the nuclear reactions that generate their energy and eventually die. Ever heard of a white dwarf?

If life evolves in itself provides evidence but few apply the laws to life.

Why is that?

That is because we understand that life takes energy from other sources within its thermodynamic system. The increase of order in life relies on processes that decrease the order in the surrounding system. Does a zebra increase or decrease the order of grass? Does a lion increase or decrease the order of zebras?

sure..... the first requires that no energy just vanishes, it must be conserved.

And when someone freezes to death because he was dim enough to think that a coat would negate the laws of thermodynamics as he tried to hike five miles through an Antarctic night the energy that was in his body is conserved. It is simply spread out across a much greater area.

If the universe dies in heat death then all the energy that exists in all life in the universe will still be there; it will still be conserved. It will just be so evenly spread out and diffuse that the entire universe will be the same temperature everywhere. If the universe is open and continues to expand indefinitely then this is the fate of all things. Life doesn't violate the laws of thermodynamics. It simply borrows energy from somewhere else and concentrates it, but only temporarily.

 

[Bishadi]

So? Stars are driven by fusion. It takes a very long time for a star to burn out - billions of years, in many cases.

as it is already of evidence, the majority of 'out there' is empty space while the lil'white dots are far and in between. Nothing equlibrating out there!

ie... if a tap on the pond is at the middle point and you believe it equlibrates, then if a big bang was at the same middle point, then how can any mass/energy combine? See what i mean? It aint my observational point of view that is whacked, it is the common sense approach tears the crap out of the entropic reductionary scheme. (the old paradigm)

Because you're clueless. The 2nd law of thermodynamics does apply to life. That's why life gives of heat. We've been over this before. You have learned nothing.

That is 'why'? Again, an ignorant claim!

we maintain entropy, because we give off heat..............?

doooood, you just are one hilarious individual.

we break the law just by consumption and then 'we' can by choice.

How about let's talk about and embryo, consuming to grow from a single cell?

Nano technology shares the crystals are 'growing'. Think in the sense a gas of elements all hot (energy with lots of em (you call it heat)), now within that chamber (man created (per se vacuum) for nano growth and when the correct wavelength binds to more than one structure a maximum wavelength can be retained on that combining of mass (see the p680).

Now that is an opposite to 'S' as that energy is affixed upon a structure.

O hell yes it applies to quantum mechanics.

to a certain extent.


ie.... why did they have to create a dark energy/matter to correct the physics to match the evidence of hubble obserations? Because energy is associated to the mass within its environment.

KISS

It is the same phenomenon as to why nano crystals grow and the proof has been long standing by the combining of a single wavelength upon the mass of the p680. The growth is maintaining the maximum wavelength upon the structure.

In fact, quantum mechanics is what allowed thermodynamics to become statistical mechanics.

most everyone knows about heisenberg field and uncertainties within the field and then if you comprehended that 'the' field (space/time) is maintaining that energy (state) and that is the unit (remember the rhr?) then the detector is identifying with its combination of (state) within the field sharing the uncertainty can be focused to a point at the point of interection between nodes within its resonance. (ie.... look for the golden ratio at the intersections between the combining energy)



That what will also correct the uncertainties of the double slit experiment; the recieving mass (background that shares the patter) will affect the pattern of each wavelength (particle release (per se)). Go try it. (it is how color itself works but few observe the mass, its energy, its properties and then what is being refracted (the photo electric effect is just the evidence mathematically rendered (einstein)).

Under steam engine era thermodynamics, the 2nd law was merely an observed fact. It took quantum mechanics to really understand, and in fact prove, the 2nd law using statistical mechanics.

you like statistics while i like causality.

(remember i know it is statistics that requires a half a billion different collisions per second and years of guestimations as to why the LHC is a waste of time)

and i also know it is plancks constant as to why (energy bound to speed based on the incorporation of an entropic direction). He converted the 'l' of energy into an angular momentum to a unit of energy.



Now, if life did in fact begin as a single celled critter a gazillion years back, and has procreated (the life (the fire)) for all them extinctions and as of now, is still rockin this taco stand, does life abuse entropy?

 

[iknownothing]

Bishadi: Please, please, stay away from the semicolon. You're not using it correctly, and you don't appear to be willing to learn to do so, so just stay away from it.

 

[nescafe]

All that cold per se empty space but for some reason there are collectives of mass, in little balls making the sky look black will lil'white dots.

Gravity will do that.

billlions of years and still not much equilibration going on.

Stars do a fine job of increasing entropy and bringing the Universe into thermodynamic equilibrium. There are only a few things that are more efficient, and they are Deeply Scary and should be kept at least several hundred light-years away.

 

[Mojo]

as it is already of evidence, the majority of 'out there' is empty space while the lil'white dots are far and in between. Nothing equlibrating out there!

We, on the other hand, are comparatively close to one of those "lil'white dots". Close enough for it to deliver large amounts of energy to the Earth.

 

[Bishadi]

Fire, how the heck does it work? Must violate the second law, warming me up like that.

to observe the fire itself, is it breaking the law as it is in process consuming.

ie... if the environment remains the same, in motion (consistant) it will live forever


that is the 'life' of the process, the specimen (change the observational point of view)

life; abuses entropy

it's stupid easy as soon as you forget the laws as absolute and use your head and all that science we ever could and will know changes in which the causal description can be ascertained for any phenomenon there is.

Try it as the focal change is to observe the energy of mass as em (light).

Life abuses entropy and as of yet still not an answer to say otherwise except 'the law'.

 

[Mojo]

Now, if life did in fact begin as a single celled critter a gazillion years back, and has procreated (the life (the fire)) for all them extinctions and as of now, is still rockin this taco stand, does life abuse entropy?

No, as has already been explained to you. "Life" is not an isolated system: it has to have an external energy source.

If you don't feed it, life will die.

 

[Mojo]

That is 'why'? Again, an ignorant claim!

we maintain entropy, because we give off heat..............?

doooood, you just are one hilarious individual.

The heat increases the entropy of our surroundings.

The second law states that the energy of an isolated system cannot decrease. A system that takes in and gives off energy, in one form or another, is not isolated. A living thing is not an isolated system. If you try to make it into one it will starve to death.

 

[Bishadi]

No, as has already been explained to you. "Life" is not an isolated system: it has to have an external energy source.

If you don't feed it, life will die.

but life does feed, by intent

ie.... life: purposed to continue (once the fire is stated, it intend (call it an instinct) to continue;;;;; Such is life


as you try to create a closed environment, then note the 'cat' analogy claims that 'we' are involved just for creating the environment (experiment).

there is no void to start with, we are within an ever moving environment. We are alive, created knowledge (all words) and that knowledge it is self is evolving.

To you it may be the law of reduction but i know better!

 

[nescafe]

as it is already of evidence, the majority of 'out there' is empty space while the lil'white dots are far and in between. Nothing equlibrating out there!

Dead wrong. Gravity pulled mass (mostly hydrogen and helium) together to create all those "little white dots", and the thing that makes them white is that an atom of helium weighs a little less than the 4 protons were squished together to make it. That missing mass gets turned into lots of kinetic energy and photons, increasing entropy all the while.

Whole lots of equilibrating going on there.

That is 'why'? Again, an ignorant claim!

we maintain entropy, because we give off heat..............?

We give off heat because our lives are sustained by exothermic chemical reactions. We sorta maintain order in our bodies by spreading more entropy around. None of this violates the Second Law.

we break the law just by consumption and then 'we' can by choice.

Ridiculous. How much entropy was created by raising/transporting/consuming/digesting/excreting food? More then enough to compensate for the apparent increase in order to ourselves.

How about let's talk about and embryo, consuming to grow from a single cell?

Powered by Mom's metabolism, which does not violate the second law. Fail again.

Now, if life did in fact begin as a single celled critter a gazillion years back, and has procreated (the life (the fire)) for all them extinctions and as of now, is still rockin this taco stand, does life abuse entropy?

No, life just moves entropy around, and creates more entropy in the process of doing so.

 

[Bishadi]

The heat increases the entropy of our surroundings.

that be a kind of oxymoron.

the heat (causes motion) and increases the disorder but the law says it will equilibrate (return to rest).

SO look at the system; 'x' is cold, you add em, the 'x' will go back to cold by law. So where is the em? it is still there or you are not maintaining a closed system.

The second law states that the energy of an isolated system cannot decrease.

that is a twisted version i would agree on as it is the 1st law that makes that claim. The universe itself will not go cold (because there is no where for the energy to go as it is associated to everything else. now for any who like the 4pir2, then guesimate the size of the universe.

A system that takes in and gives off energy, in one form or another, is not isolated.

i agree

as upon this earth, there is no where, anywhere, between points of mass that is a complete void (perfect vacuum)

I am not trying to create a bench point except that in the procreation of life, that within the environment, the life is kicking the pants out of the law.

breaking the law, breaking the law..........dd..aaaa

A living thing is not an isolated system. If you try to make it into one it will starve to death.

i know

you know

we all know

but some are holding a law as if it is the gospel

Now you tell me who is ignorant? People that break the law and dont know it or them that know the law and break it anyway?

 

[BenBurch]

Does procreation offer proof that; "life abuses entropy"?
...

Seems to me that you are unlikely to ever have first-hand evidence.

 

[Ririon]

but some are holding a law as if it is the gospel

Now you tell me who is ignorant? People that break the law and dont know it or them that know the law and break it anyway?

I vote for "people them that dont understand the law; and think they break it".

 

[John Jones]

I used the word 'abuses' which is ongoing.

life; abuses entropy (ie... life, intends to live (see instinct))

no ambiguity about it

It's unambiguous gibberish. If you have no interest in making yourself understood, why post?

 

[dafydd]

My eyes bled when I read this, but I laughed hysterically nonetheless.

He is one of the funnier delusionauts.