Does Crime Pay? "Somali Jack" Sparrow says "Yes!"

[dudalb]

... or even every navy's trained boarding parties.

Problems:
- there is not an infinite supply of trained boarding parties, even in the U.S. navy
- attacking ports may carry political ramifications
- it's not a problem that can be solved with missiles

So let's keep ignoring the problem till it becomes a major crisis?
Brilliant.
As for political ramifications,I don't give a damn what the Somali Government thinks since it is pretty pathetic excuse for a Government if it cannot enforce laws in it;s own territory.
There is no "diplomatic" or "peaceful" solutiion to this problem anymore then there is a diplomatic or peaceful solution to a bunch of outlaws running wild.

 

[dudalb]

Wasn't the US Navy developing the Littoral Combat Ship to deal with things like this?

it's not a case of the US and other nations not having the military strength to take on the pirates...it does not require that much...but the will. I predict this will keep going on until the pirates pull something off in which a lot of people get killed.

 

[geni]

As for political ramifications,I don't give a damn what the Somali Government thinks since it is pretty pathetic excuse for a Government if it cannot enforce laws in it;s own territory.

Wrong goverment. I doubt the US goverment would really want to explain why it had just killed rather a lot of "civilians".

The problem is that unless they are actively engaged in priaracy (say in the act of boarding a ship) we don't know who these pirates are.

 

[Darth Rotor]

Wasn't the US Navy developing the Littoral Combat Ship to deal with things like this?

No. Littoral combat ship is a purpose built combatant for power projection.

Any multi purpose warship -- frigate, destroyer, cruiser -- now in the fleet is sufficient to handle this misison.

DR

 

[dudalb]

They have just now seized an Iranian Freighter.
Looks as if they are not some kind of Islamic group, but are in it for the money.
12 Ships in Seven Days...the pace is picking up.
Another problem on Obama's plate.

 

[dudalb]

Wrong goverment. I doubt the US goverment would really want to explain why it had just killed rather a lot of "civilians".

The problem is that unless they are actively engaged in priaracy (say in the act of boarding a ship) we don't know who these pirates are.

Then what the hell should we do? Just let this get out of hand until the Red Sea becomes a no man's land for commerce?

 

[rwguinn]

Then what the hell should we do? Just let this get out of hand until the Red Sea becomes a no man's land for commerce?

Works for me.
They created the damn problem, let 'em solve it. Anytime the West tries to help, we get more terrorism, and the Europeans sell 'em the weapons...

 

[dudalb]

Change that to Seven Ships in 12 days. My point that the pace if really picking up remains the same.

 

[dudalb]

Works for me.
They created the damn problem, let 'em solve it. Anytime the West tries to help, we get more terrorism, and the Europeans sell 'em the weapons...

A lot of American ships use the Red Sea also. Read a Map.
I think they are avoiding American ships on purpose, but if they continue to get away with it, that will stop.
Sorry, but piracy on this level is not something that can be tolerated.

 

[Donal]

- it's not a problem that can be solved with missiles

I don't understand that sentence.

 

[Jimbo07]

I don't understand that sentence.

I know... it was hard for me to write. I have trouble believing that there's any kind of problem that can't be solved with a few missiles!

 

[DanishDynamite]

My understanding is that a corridor has been made in which no ships have been succesfully attacked. The problem is that the pirates now attack up to 450 miles from Somalia shores, basically they hit before ships reach the corridor.

 

[dudalb]

My understanding is that a corridor has been made in which no ships have been succesfully attacked. The problem is that the pirates now attack up to 450 miles from Somalia shores, basically they hit before ships reach the corridor.

Next step it probably some form of convoying, but that has the problem of reducing the speed of traffic to a trickle.
The bases they operate from,whether on land or mother ships, have got to be shut down. Only real solution, as much as some well intentioned but nieve people would like to deny it.

 

[Jimbo07]

.
The bases they operate from,whether on land or mother ships, have got to be shut down. Only real solution, as much as some well intentioned but nieve people would like to deny it.

Who are these well intentioned but naive people? Commodore Christensen?

The use of military power, Christensen acknowledged, is limited in what it can do to stop a problem driven by lawlessness and poverty in Somalia, a nation at war with itself for most of the past 17 years.

"We can be there and suppress the piracy," Christensen said, "but the problem is on shore."

The decision to invade another country, even Somalia, is difficult (unless, of course, your last name is Bush ).

 

[geni]

A lot of American ships use the Red Sea also. Read a Map.
I think they are avoiding American ships on purpose, but if they continue to get away with it, that will stop.

I doubt it. With modern flags of convience I suspect you will find very few american flagged ships in that area. And no we can't ask liberia to sort it out.

Sorry, but piracy on this level is not something that can be tolerated.

True but not something it is easy to solve.

 

[DanishDynamite]

Next step it probably some form of convoying, but that has the problem of reducing the speed of traffic to a trickle.
The bases they operate from,whether on land or mother ships, have got to be shut down. Only real solution, as much as some well intentioned but nieve people would like to deny it.

No hope in hell of hitting their on shore bases, but perhaps some hope of hitting their "mother" ships. What does international maritime laws have to say on this, I wonder.

 

[geni]

Then what the hell should we do? Just let this get out of hand until the Red Sea becomes a no man's land for commerce?

Well that is one aproach yes. There are other options but they require the CIA to be competant.

Your options are:

1)stabise somalia. Unless you are prepared to back islamic extreamists that isn't going to happen
2)accept that the area will become comercialy unviable and the added costs that will result.
3)Large scale convoy/defensive corridor which is expensive
4)inteligence lead shore strikes which is hard.
5)Kill everyone south of Somaliland which is probably politicaly unacceptable.

 

[geni]

No hope in hell of hitting their on shore bases, but perhaps some hope of hitting their "mother" ships. What does international maritime laws have to say on this, I wonder.

It says if you have UN a mandate you can do whatever you like and getting an UN mandate will not in this case be a problem.

 

[DanishDynamite]

Well that is one aproach yes. There are other options but they require the CIA to be competant.

Your options are:

1)stabise somalia. Unless you are prepared to back islamic extreamists that isn't going to happen
2)accept that the area will become comercialy unviable and the added costs that will result.
3)Large scale convoy/defensive corridor which is expensive
4)inteligence lead shore strikes which is hard.
5)Kill everyone south of Somaliland which is probably politicaly unacceptable.

1) very expensive.
4) unhelpful
5) expensive and political suicide.

The only inexpensive (relatively) solution is massive millitary presence.

 

[WildCat]

They can. Just need to improve their own boats and they have. Your other problem is that this is somalia. Weaponry isn't evidence of piracy.

Weaponry + 30 ft. ladders sure as hell is.