Debunk Alert: Experiment to Test for Eutectic Reaction

[BigAl]

If you believed, as I do, that 9/11 was an inside job, and that the 3,000+ people in the WTC Twin Towers were murdered by people still at large, would you feel right dismissing it as not a problem?

MM

Yup, bin Laden's followers killed lots of Americans on 9/11/2001 and prior to and after 9/11 and he's escaped capture so far.

 

[DGM]

If you believed, as I do, that 9/11 was an inside job, and that the 3,000+ people in the WTC Twin Towers were murdered by people still at large, would you feel right dismissing it as not a problem?

MM

Of course not. You have not really answered my original question.

"What have you accomplished in all the years you've been doing this"?

From where I'm sitting all your trying to do is convince a small collection of skeptics on an Internet forum. Have you talked to your congressmen personally? How often do you spend time doing "street actions"? Have you talked to Jones (for instance) trying to convince him to subject his "dust" samples (and "chips") to well established (and not overly expensive) professional analysis? Help set-up your own "independent investigation"? (BTW What's stopping the "truthers" from doing this?)

These are just a few things I would do if I actually believed what you say you do.

What are you guys waiting for?

 

[tsig]

It is at the heart of it though? They can speculate all they want on what combination of thermite, thermate and explosives were used and how fast the building fell and which bit started first but they are putting the cart before the horse.

Actually some deny there was a cart and are beating on the poor dead horse.

 

[triforcharity]

I have accomplished a great deal debating here.

1) Using the links provided by y'all, I proved that diesel fuel fires did not play a part in the collapse.
NIST abandoned that idea.

2) I pointed out the statements in conflict with the "10 story gouge" that Shaym Sunder lied about in the PM "Debunking" article.
NIST abandoned that idea.

Debating here is a way to hear the denial arguments and develop counter arguments.
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LOL!! Diesel fire hasn't been talked about since about 2008 or so. That was FEMA's hypothesis, and even said that it needed additional consideration. What NIST found out, is that Diesel Fuel had little, to no effect on the fires.

You did not prove diesel fuel did anything. NIST did.

What about the 10 story gash? What did you get right that the EXPERT got wrong?

 

[triforcharity]

Why?

Because fires alone have a long history of not causing concrete and steel buildings to collapse.

Would you like to change this statemet a little?

Especially considering:

http://www.fpemag.com/archives/article.asp?issue_id=27&i=153
http://www.interfire.org/res_file/pdf/Tr-097.pdf
http://forthardknox.com/2008/01/25/steel-buildings-that-collapsed-due-to-fire-before-9-11/
http://www.era.lib.ed.ac.uk/bitstream/1842/886/1/326_Jowsey.pdf
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2003/may2003/kade-m16.shtml
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19301684/

Yeah, Wanna try again?

ETA: Here is a CONCRETE structure that COLLAPSES due to FIRE. Sorry, BRICK.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZ1e3ddf3RM&feature=related

Here is one that is concrete.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1h9TOFP7ViY&NR=1

Shall I continue?

 

[leftysergeant]

Can any of you twoofers show an example of steel cut with thermite or HE and show how it would differ from steel eroded by battery acid?

No?

You got nothing, then.

 

[beachnut]

believed - 911 truth's faith based failure

...
If you believed, like I do, that 9/11 was an inside job, and that the 3,000+ people were murdered by people still at large, would you feel right dismissing it as not a problem DGM?

Based on the evidence, the people who did it are dead (911 truth has to ignores the evidence to keep delusions alive). 911 truth spreads lies based on hearsay, lies and fantasy; 8 years of failure.

Topics like the eutectic come up, the thread exposes the fraud of 911 truth, as people make up lies about it. Can you tie your delusion to the eutectic? You have exposed you have a belief, a faith based conclusion 911 was an inside job without using evidence.

If I felt the way you do, I would not sit around, I would get an education in all the subject areas to make a logical conclusion and prove it. If it took a PhD in structures to get there, I would have a PhD in structures.

I was on active duty on 911; I would never allow anyone to kill Americans or get a way with it if I had the knowledge of the event. No one in the military helped the terrorists; the terrorists did it and UBL became a suspect for many the second Flight 175 impacted. Anyone who did not understand UBL as a terrorist threat did not travel much or pay attention in the 90s.

UBL and his buddies, you apologize poorly for, figured out you could storm the cockpits of US airlines, kill the pilots, and fly planes into building. Two steps; 1. Kill pilots, 2. Fly planes into buildings; the biggest buildings. Here you are hung up on WTC 7, which burned all day, not even a target of the attack. When will you figure out 911, like the Passengers on Flight 93 did in minutes, and take action to help prevent the next attack? What will UBL do next? He does not care if you think your government did 911, he did it and he will hit again and again; 10 years, 20 years later; he promised to kill us, he does not lie like 911 truth.

You are funny, you ignore the threat, make up delusional bad guys you can't define. A Quixotic quest for delusions.

The 911 plot is simple murder, a two step surprise. It worked because of the way things were before 911. The next surprise will cause more problems, as people like you who could help prevent the next terrorist act are wasting time spewing nonsense on an attack that took minutes to understand; as proved by Passengers on Flight 93 who stood up and took action; unlike 911 truth which talks bs and lies, failing to gain the knowledge to move on.

You are doing what the military does sometimes in error, preparing to fight the last war we had, not the next war. We did not do anything wrong; we were attacked by UBL, he figured out a way, he took action.

The eutectic is a cool trap to find those few 911 truthers who lack knowledge and spew lies and have no evidence. It caught you. If I had evidence of 911 being an inside job, real evidence and was first, I would have a Pulitzer Prize. It would have happened in months, not after 8 years of failing to use evidence and playing conspiracy theories_R_us.

... given the clues and evidence available, figuring out 911 takes minutes; it was not an inside job. Flight 93 Passengers did it; can you?

 

[triforcharity]

Is that what it's all about here?

Fun?

If you believed, like I do, that 9/11 was an inside job, and that the 3,000+ people were murdered by people still at large, would you feel right dismissing it as not a problem DGM?

Would that be fun?

If you folks ever presented a good argument that could allow me to believe that 19 arab hijackers were behind it all, I would gladly stop my 9/11 Truth activism.

This may be fun and games for you here in JREF but it certainly isn't a source of amusement for me and the many thousands in the 9/11 Truth Movement who feel likewise.

I envy you your smug confidence that you know the truth and can sleep soundly at night.

Hopefully you are right and I am wrong.

MM

So, what are you, or any other truther, doing in the real world, to effect any change whatsoever?

Nothing? Well then, carry on....

 

[Grizzly Bear]

For the record... if -- as the man in the video referenced in the OP -- anybody wants to compare concrete construction to steel framing... get a construction manual or text book and look up any chapters relating to their performance in fire. It's not that hard... One of the many reasons the man referenced in the OP fails epically is because he makes no distinction between the two. Don't waste time on people who can't tell the difference between them. It's not worth it.

 

[Dog Town]

Hopefully you are right and I am wrong.

MM

We (not the Victorian, or Royal) are! Now get some sleep, this reads like you could use it!

 

[Christopher7]

Can any of you twoofers show an example of steel cut with thermite or HE and show how it would differ from steel eroded by battery acid?

No?

You got nothing, then.

You're the one claiming that battery acid could melt a beam the way Sample #1 is melted. If it were that simple the experts at FEMA and NIST could have figured it out. Your hypothesis is just wishful thinking.

 

[tuc0]

Is that what it's all about here?

Fun?

This may be fun and games for you here in JREF but it certainly isn't a source of amusement for me and the many thousands in the 9/11 Truth Movement who feel likewise.

Ooooh. Righteous indignation. But...

Too funny.

MM

Way too funny.

MM

The hypocrisy is staggering.

 

[Miragememories]

"If you believed, as I do, that 9/11 was an inside job, and that the 3,000+ people in the WTC Twin Towers were murdered by people still at large, would you feel right dismissing it as not a problem?"

"Of course not."

Thank you.

It's good to know there is at least one person here who still has some principles.

Regarding 8 years.

One does not quit such an important mission because of someone else's arbitrary timetable for success.

MM

 

[beachnut]

If you believed, like I do, that 9/11 was an inside job, and that the 3,000+ people were murdered by people still at large, would you feel right dismissing it as not a problem DGM?

Of course not.

Thank you.

It's good to know there is at least one person here who still has some principles.

Regarding 8 years.

One does not quit such an important mission because of someone else's arbitrary timetable for success.

MM

I see you twist truth to fit your feeling and delsuions on 911. What have you accomplished? What evidence besides lies from Jones and DRG do you have? DRG used hearsay to spin his implied lies. Gage spreads old lies from Jones and other liars. You are chasing a delusion and spewing bs; you promise technical proof, you just talk.

You quote mine, you ignore the rest of what people say to save your delusion.

Of course not. You have not really answered my original question.

"What have you accomplished in all the years you've been doing this"?

From where I'm sitting all your trying to do is convince a small collection of skeptics on an Internet forum. Have you talked to your congressmen personally? How often do you spend time doing "street actions"? Have you talked to Jones (for instance) trying to convince him to subject his "dust" samples (and "chips") to well established (and not overly expensive) professional analysis? Help set-up your own "independent investigation"? (BTW What's stopping the "truthers" from doing this?)

These are just a few things I would do if I actually believed what you say you do.

What are you guys waiting for?

Thank you.

What are you waiting for? 911 truth has claimed ample evidence for 8 years; they lied. 8 years is enough time to figure out WTC 7 fell due to fire if you took any effort at all to examine the evidence. What are you waiting for? How does the eutectic tie into your 911 big picture?

 

[twinstead]

Thank you.

It's good to know there is at least one person here who still has some principles.

Regarding 8 years.

One does not quit such an important mission because of someone else's arbitrary timetable for success.

MM

Important mission indeed. I'm sure every crackpot who believes every cockamamie theory, be it flat Earth, moon hoax, Christ is coming soon, the holocaust never happened, God hates fags, women should wear burkas, the world is coming to an end, vishnu is returning and boy is he pissed, whatever, thinks he is on an 'important mission'.

 

[DGM]

Thank you.

It's good to know there is at least one person here who still has some principles.

Regarding 8 years.

One does not quit such an important mission because of someone else's arbitrary timetable for success.

MM

OK, Let me ask you this.

Are you happy with the plan (and strategies, as it is) the "truth" movement is using to achieve justice for those responsible as you see it?

 

[Miragememories]

"One does not quit such an important mission because of someone else's arbitrary timetable for success."

"OK, Let me ask you this.

Are you happy with the plan (and strategies, as it is) the "truth" movement is using to achieve justice for those responsible as you see it?"

Is that really a question?

I am happy that through the efforts of many, that over the years since 9/11, an enormous amount of incriminating evidence has been collected.

Anyone with an open mind, cannot examine the available research without reaching the conclusion that a massive coverup has occurred.

Justice may never get served.

And in the future, we will all suffer more as a consequence.

MM

 

[beachnut]

... I am happy that through the efforts of many, that over the years since 9/11, an enormous amount of incriminating evidence has been collected.

...

Nonsense, you can't list any incriminating evidence; you have zero. Your list is the empty set. Empty talk. (a poorly veiled lie)

How does the eutectic play in your big picture of the WTC event?

 

[Miragememories]

Nonsense, you can't list any incriminating evidence; you have zero. Your list is the empty set. Empty talk. (a poorly veiled lie)

How does the eutectic play in your big picture of the WTC event?

Zero is your game, not mine.

Life is never as simple as you try to portray it.

MM

 

[Miragememories]

"DRG used hearsay to spin his implied lies"

Do tell.

What in heck is an "implied lie"?

"You quote mine, you ignore the rest of what people say to save your delusion."

If excluding that which is irrelevant is quote mining, than I guess I do.

"8 years is enough time to figure out WTC 7 fell due to fire if you took any effort at all to examine the evidence."

Apparently it wasn't for the NIST and they had all the resources anyone could hope for.

Maybe you'd like to explain the missing heat, that Dr. Greening claims was required to make the NIST final solution work beachnut?

MM