Debate (not debase) a Truther

[Bell]

Your advanced knowledge of probability theory is staggering. What else in this world is 100% "not possible"?

Are you really asking?

 

[ImANiceGuy]

Are you really asking?

yes I am laughing dog....is it really that improbable to believe that the Arab highjackers were manipulated by external forces to commit the attacks for the benefit of the global elite?

Just keep believing everything they tell you......the government never lies......the air is safe to breath, no problem.....

 

[carlitos]

the global elite?

Who? Be specific please.

 

[ImANiceGuy]

Who? Be specific please.

Here's a few.....but do not make the false inference that all were explicitly involved in the 9/11 attacks. Just as it would be false to infer that every person involved with the 9/11 recovery/clean up efforts was also involved in the attacks.....

DEU Ackermann, Josef Chairman of the Management Board and the Group Executive
Committee, Deutsche Bank AG

USA Alexander, Keith B. Director, National Security Agency

GRC Alogoskoufis, George Member of Parliament

USA Altman, Roger C. Chairman and CEO, Evercore Partners, Inc.

GRC Arapoglou, Takis Chairman and CEO, National Bank of Greece

TUR Babacan, Ali Minister of State and Deputy Prime Minister

GRC Bakoyannis, Dora Minister of Foreign Affairs

NOR Baksaas, Jon Fredrik President and CEO, Telenor Group

PRT Balsemão, Francisco Pinto Chairman and CEO, IMPRESA, S.G.P.S.; Former Prime
Minister

FRA Baverez, Nicolas Partner, Gibson, Dunn & Crutcher LLP

ITA Bernabè, Franco CEO Telecom Italia SpA

SWE Bildt, Carl Minister of Foreign Affairs

SWE Björklund, Jan Minister for Education; Leader of the Lìberal Party

CHE Blocher, Christoph Former Swiss Counselor; Former Chairman and CEO, EMS Group

FRA Bompard, Alexandre CEO, Europe 1

USA Boot, Max Jeane J. Kirkpatrick Senior Fellow for National Security Studies, Council
on Foreign Relations

AUT Bronner, Oscar Publisher and Editor, Der Standard

FRA Castries, Henri de Chairman of the Management Board and CEO, AXA

ESP Cebrián, Juan Luis CEO, Grupo PRISA

BEL Coene, Luc Vice Governor, National Bank of Belgium

USA Collins, Timothy C. Senior Managing Director and CEO, Ripplewood Holdings, LLC

GRC David, George A. Chairman, Coca-Cola Hellenic Bottling Co. (H.B.C.) S.A.

GRC Diamantopoulou, Anna Member of Parliament

ITA Draghi, Mario Governor, Banca d'Italia

USA Eberstadt, Nicholas N. Henry Wendt Scholar in Political Economy, American
Enterprise Institute for Public Policy Research

DNK Eldrup, Anders President, DONG Energy A/S

ITA Elkann, John Chairman, EXOR S.p.A.; Vice Chairman, Fiat S.p.A.

DEU Enders, Thomas CEO, Airbus SAS

ESP Entrecanales, José Manuel Chairman, Acciona

AUT Faymann, Werner Federal Chancellor

USA Ferguson, Niall Laurence A. Tisch Professor of History, Harvard University

IRL Gleeson, Dermot Chairman, AIB Group

USA Graham, Donald E. Chairman and CEO, The Washington Post Company

NLD Halberstadt, Victor Professor of Economics, Leiden University; Former
Honorary Secretary General of Bilderberg Meetings

NLD Hirsch Ballin, Ernst M.H. Minister of Justice

USA Holbrooke, Richard C. US Special Representative for Afghanistan and Pakistan

NLD Hommen, Jan H.M. Chairman, ING N.V.

INT Hoop Scheffer, Jaap G. de Secretary General, NATO

USA Johnson, James A. Vice Chairman, Perseus, LLC

USA Jordan, Jr., Vernon E. Senior Managing Director, Lazard Frères & Co. LLC

FIN Katainen, Jyrki Minister of Finance

USA Keane, John M. Senior Partner, SCP Partners; General, US Army, Retired

USA Kent, Muhtar President and CEO, The Coca-Cola Company

GBR Kerr, John Member, House of Lords; Deputy Chairman, Royal Dutch Shell plc

DEU Klaeden, Eckart von Foreign Policy Spokesman, CDU/CSU

USA Kleinfeld, Klaus President and CEO, Alcoa Inc.

TUR Koç, Mustafa V. Chairman, Koç Holding A.S.

DEU Koch, Roland Prime Minister of Hessen

TUR Kohen, Sami Senior Foreign Affairs Columnist, Milliyet

USA Kravis, Henry R. Senior Fellow, Hudson Institute, Inc.

INT Kroes, Neelie Commissioner, European Commission

GRC Kyriacopoulos, Ulysses Chairman and Board member of subsidiary companies
of the S&B Group

FRA Lagarde, Christine Minister for the Economy, Industry and Employment

INT Lamy, Pascal Director General, World Trade Organization

PRT Leite, Manuela Ferreira Leader, PSD

ESP León Gross, Bernardino General Director of the Presidency of the Spanish
Government

DEU Löscher, Peter CEO, Siemens AG

GBR Mandelson, Peter Secretary of State for Business, Enterprise & Regulatory
Reform

INT Maystadt, Philippe President, European Investment Bank

CAN McKenna, Frank Former Ambassador to the US

GBR Micklethwait, John Editor-in-Chief, The Economist

FRA Montbrial, Thierry de President, French Institute for International Relations

ITA Monti, Mario President, Universita Commerciale Luigi Bocconi

ESP Moratinos Cuyaubé, Miguel A. Minister of Foreign Affairs

USA Mundie, Craig J. Chief Research and Strategy Officer, Microsoft Corporation

CAN Munroe-Blum, Heather Principal and Vice Chancellor, McGill University

NOR Myklebust, Egil Former Chairman of the Board of Directors SAS, Norsk Hydro ASA

DEU Nass, Matthias Deputy Editor, Die Zeit

NLD Beatrix, H.M. the Queen of the Netherlands

ESP Nin Génova, Juan Maria President and CEO, La Caixa

FRA Olivennes, Denis CEO and Editor in Chief, Le Nouvel Observateur

FIN Ollila, Jorma Chairman, Royal Dutch Shell plc

GBR Osborne, George Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer

FRA Oudéa, Frédéric CEO, Société Générale

ITA Padoa-Schioppa, Tommaso Former Minister of Finance; President of Notre Europe

GRC Papahelas, Alexis Journalist, Kathimerini

GRC Papalexopoulos, Dimitris Managing Director, Titan Cement Co. S.A.

GRC Papathanasiou, Yannis Minister of Economy and Finance

USA Perle, Richard N. Resident Fellow, American Enterprise Institute for Public
Policy Research

BEL Philippe, H.R.H. Prince

PRT Pinho, Manuel Minister of Economy and Innovation

INT Pisani-Ferry, Jean Director, Bruegel

CAN Prichard, J. Robert S. President and CEO, Metrolinx

ITA Prodi, Romano Chairman, Foundation for Worldwide Cooperation

FIN Rajalahti, Hanna Managing Editor, Talouselämä

CAN Reisman, Heather M. Chair and CEO, Indigo Books & Music Inc.

NOR Reiten, Eivind President and CEO, Norsk Hydro ASA

CHE Ringier, Michael Chairman, Ringier AG

USA Rockefeller, David Former Chairman, Chase Manhattan Bank

USA Rubin, Barnett R. Director of Studies and Senior Fellow, Center for
International Cooperation, New York University

TUR Sabanci Dinçer, Suzan Chairman, Akbank

CAN Samarasekera, Indira V. President and Vice-Chancellor, University of Alberta

AUT Scholten, Rudolf Member of the Board of Executive Directors, Oesterreichische
Kontrollbank AG

USA Sheeran, Josette Executive Director, UN World Food Programme

ITA Siniscalco, Domenico Vice Chairman, Morgan Stanley International

ESP Solbes, Pedro Vice-President of Spanish Government; Minister of Economy and
Finance

ESP Sophia, H.M. the Queen of Spain

USA Steinberg, James B. Deputy Secretary of State

INT Stigson, Bjorn President, World Business Council for Sustainable Development

GRC Stournaras, Yannis Research Director, Foundation for Economic and Industrial
Research (IOBE)

IRL Sutherland, Peter D. Chairman, BP plc and Chairman, Goldman Sachs International

INT Tanaka, Nobuo Executive Director, IEA

GBR Taylor, J. Martin Chairman, Syngenta International AG

USA Thiel, Peter A. President, Clarium Capital Management, LLC

DNK Thorning-Schmidt, Helle Leader ofThe Social Democratic Party

DNK Thune Andersen, Thomas Partner and CEO, Maersk Oil

AUT Treichl, Andreas Chairman and CEO, Erste Group Bank AG

INT Trichet, Jean-Claude President, European Central Bank

GRC Tsoukalis, Loukas President of the Hellenic Foundation for European and
Foreign Policy (ELlAMEP)

TUR Ugur, Agah CEO, Borusan Holding

FIN Vanhanen, Matti Prime Minister

CHE Vasella, Daniel L. Chairman and CEO, Novartis AG

NLD Veer, Jeroen van der Chief Executive, Royal Dutch Shell plc

USA Volcker, Paul A. Chairman, Economic Recovery Advisory Board

SWE Wallenberg, Jacob Chairman, Investor AB

SWE Wallenberg, Marcus Chairman, SEB

NLD Wellink, Nout President, De Nederlandsche Bank

NLD Wijers, Hans Chairman, AkzoNobel NV

GBR Wolf, Martin H. Associate Editor & Chief Economics Commentator, The Financial
Times

USA Wolfensohn, James D. Chairman, Wolfensohn & Company, LLC

USA Wolfowitz, Paul Visiting Scholar, American Enterprise Institute for Public
Policy Research

INT Zoellick, Robert B. President, The World Bank Group

GBR Bredow, Vendeline von Business Correspondent, The Economist (Rapporteur)

GBR McBride, Edward Business Editor, The Economist (Rapporteur)


• AUT Austria
• BEL Belgium
• CHE Switzerland
• CAN Canada
• DEU Germany
• DNK Denmark
• ESP Spain
• FRA France
• FIN Finland
• GBR Great Britain
• GRC Greece
• IRL Ireland
• INT International
• ITA Italy
• NOR Norway
• NLD Netherlands
• PRT Portugal
• SWE Sweden
• TUR Turkey
• USA United States of America

 

[Dave Rogers]

is it really that improbable to believe that the Arab highjackers were manipulated by external forces to commit the attacks for the benefit of the global elite?

That's probably the most plausible proto-hypothesis anyone in the truth movement can come up with. Highly improbable, actually, but it has the rare virtue for a truther hypothesis of not actually violating any physical laws. Since you don't claim to know which members of the global elite were involved, would it be fair to say that you have no evidence whatsoever for such a proto-hypothesis?

Dave

 

[Bell]

yes I am laughing dog....is it really that improbable to believe that the Arab highjackers were manipulated by external forces to commit the attacks for the benefit of the global elite?

Just keep believing everything they tell you......the government never lies......the air is safe to breath, no problem.....

That's ANiceStrawMan.

I was responding to your question "What else in this world is 100% "not possible"?" And what are you responding to?

 

[carlitos]

Here's a few.....but do not make the false inference that all were explicitly involved in the 9/11 attacks. Just as it would be false to infer that every person involved with the 9/11 recovery/clean up efforts was also involved in the attacks.....

Nice list. Here is a suggestion.

1 - State your hypothesis about the events of 9/11/01.
2 - Provide evidence that even one of the people you listed was 'in on it.'

 

[BigAl]

Here's a few.....but do not make the false inference that all were explicitly involved in the 9/11 attacks. Just as it would be false to infer that every person involved with the 9/11 recovery/clean up efforts was also involved in the attacks.....

DEU Ackermann, Josef Chairman of the Management Board and the Group Executive
Committee, Deutsche Bank AG

So you've posted what appears to members of the Bilderberg Group.

So what?

To quote Carlitos;

1 - State your hypothesis about the events of 9/11/01.
2 - Provide evidence that even one of the people you listed was 'in on it.'

 

[Oystein]

Here's a few.....but do not make the false inference that all were explicitly involved in the 9/11 attacks. Just as it would be false to infer that every person involved with the 9/11 recovery/clean up efforts was also involved in the attacks.....

[List of 124 named individuals from 20 different countries]

You have the guts to implicate, by name, 124 individuals with the murder of close to 3000 people. Thats's more that 20 murder victims per person on your list.

Surely, you have at least some information whatsoever that could possibly be construed as at least faintly shedding some light of suspicion on at least one person on the list. Right? If so, I would like to know that information, and its source.

If you cannot provide any such information, then clearly you are engaging in libel. So please do not dodge this urgent request for sourced information implicating at least one person on your list with the criminal acts of 9/11, or else I will have to call you a libeling fraud henceforth.
Alternatively, you may retract your false and unwarranted accusations.

 

[triforcharity]

Your advanced knowledge of probability theory is staggering. What else in this world is 100% "not possible"?

Getting a truther to admit they are wrong?!?!?

Getting a truther to understand physics/fire/structural engineering/english/kitten pictures?

 

[beachnut]

... ....is it really that improbable to believe that the Arab highjackers were manipulated by external forces to commit the attacks for the benefit of the global elite? ...

Who makes up delusions this dumb?

911 truth has no rational understanding of terrorists or UBL; why?

 

[Cuddles]

Some of us are normal people who hear crazy stories

What's baffling in its stupidity is anyone assuming that the plot was constructed in this way. I already circumvented your point with a little known tactic callled compartmentalization.

You've been duh-bunked. Come again.

I'll take all your insults as concessions...

improbable to believe that the Arab highjackers were manipulated by external forces to commit the attacks for the benefit of the global elite?

Just keep believing everything they tell you......the government never lies......the air is safe to breath, no problem.....

Here's a few...

Yes I believe there was a grand conspiracy on 9/11

So, how's that "normal person who just happens to have heard a few crazy stories" thing working out for you?

 

[240-185]

cat bbg.txt | grep "FRA" :

1°) FRA Baverez, Nicolas Partner, Gibson, Dunn & Crutcher LLP
2°) FRA Bompard, Alexandre CEO, Europe 1
3°) FRA Castries, Henri de Chairman of the Management Board and CEO, AXA
4°) FRA Lagarde, Christine Minister for the Economy, Industry and Employment
5°) FRA Montbrial, Thierry de President, French Institute for International Relations
6°) FRA Olivennes, Denis CEO and Editor in Chief, Le Nouvel Observateur
7°) FRA Oudéa, Frédéric CEO, Société Générale

1°) Was a lawyer in 2001.
2°) Was leading... a soccer team in 2001. Plus, "Europe 1" is a national radio station. Clearly out of scope.
3°) "AXA" is an insurance company. So, he helped to organize a huge crime in order to stress his OWN BUSINESS????
4°) So you're accusing one of our ministers of being part of one of the biggest murders in history? By the way, she was a famous lawyer in 2001.
5°) Unknown to public. Was the president of the French Academy of Moral and Political Sciences in 2001.
6°) "Le Nouvel Observateur" is a french magazine, you should know that. BTW, Denis Olivennes was leading a french TV channel in 2001, before leading a chain of high-tech stores. So what? 9/11 allowed him to sell some iPods and flat screens?
7°) The "Société Générale" is a bank. Frédéric Oudéa was just an employee of this bank in 2001. That means he didn't have any power of decision.

Good job for accusing innocent people!

 

[BadBoy]

What's baffling in its stupidity is anyone assuming that the plot was constructed in this way. I already circumvented your point with a little known tactic callled compartmentalization.

You've been duh-bunked. Come again.

JREF, what a dissapointment...

Hi, just been lurking on this thread.

Hay, ImANiceGuy,

Do you really believe it was an inside job? Hand on your nuts and on your hampsters deathbed do you honestly believe it was an inside job... come on now, you can type so you cant be all that... disadvantaged.

Listen to some advise my mate. Its like this you see. The truth is always more interesting than the woo. As Richard Dawkins pointed out, the theory of evolution is so much more interesting and wonderfull than the creationist mantra.

I would say that taking your time investigating US and Western European history and politics and the problems in the middle east would be far more interesting than hanging out on some truther forum pretending to be in some Tom Clancey novel.

 

[BadBoy]

Getting a truther to admit they are wrong?!?!?

Getting a truther to understand physics/fire/structural engineering/english/kitten pictures?

nice.

 

[Regnad Kcin]

Your advanced knowledge of probability theory is staggering. What else in this world is 100% "not possible"?

So no evidence then. Just as I thought. One can't provide evidence there's a Starbucks on the dark side of moon when there isn't a Starbucks on the dark side of the moon.

 

[BadBoy]

So no evidence then. Just as I thought. One can't provide evidence there's a Starbucks on the dark side of moon when there isn't a Starbucks on the dark side of the moon.

I have seriously thought about going over to a truthers forum and spreading some lies around to get them all stirred up. You know, pretend some news source has uncovered a link or that they uncovered a coverup of explosive residue.

Let them take is all seriously for a while, see if they can independently come up with other sources/evidence and then tell then it was all nonsense.

But then I wonder if I were to do that, Id still hearing about the lies I started 8 years later. I can imagine it getting perpetuated and never going away. It would be like conducting an experiment on the delusional state of mind. It would also be in very bad taste, considering the subject. I laugh at truthers so much sometimes I forget and have to remind myself how outrageously disrespectful they are to the people who died with their idiotic ideas.

 

[Pantaz]

... But then I wonder if I were to do that, Id still hearing about the lies I started 8 years later. I can imagine it getting perpetuated and never going away. ...

You might enjoy this... http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=113706

Follow-up: http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=115744

 

[triforcharity]

You might enjoy this... http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=113706

Follow-up: http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=115744

I love that thread.....

 

[EventHorizon]

Who makes up delusions this dumb?

911 truth has no rational understanding of terrorists or UBL; why?

No need to stop at terrorists or UBL. 911 truth has no rational understanding of the world. I mean, the "global elite". The air is unsafe to breathe? WTF is that?