Continuation Part 18: Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito

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And it turns out Meredith lived elsewhere - From Kercher's Meredith - I met with friends from schooldays, many of whom I already knew and with whom Meredith stayed friends after she left home to study at Leeds.

And Tesla I don't have faith in either DM but when part of it is corroborated then it adds something. I don't believe their spin. I remembered dorm stories from the Daily but didn't find them quickly. While the story about the ticket was totally exaggerated it was true she had received the ticket and the DM story was the first.

Btw - Google Philip Setran, and Amanda and you will see how these falsehoods gain status over time. This one is anti Knox but it goes both ways.

ETA - From her book - I stayed in touch with Brett and met a small group of intelligent and off-beat students at the unversity's climbing wall and in my dorm.

I do believe the part about the dorm. I just didn't remember that she ever lived in a dorm and I knew the noise ticket was not at the dorm.

I do know that the UW highly recommends that incoming freshman live in a dorm their first year but it's not mandatory. I did Google what you requested and mostly came up with forums with the usual commentary.
 
I do believe the part about the dorm. I just didn't remember that she ever lived in a dorm and I knew the noise ticket was not at the dorm.

I do know that the UW highly recommends that incoming freshman live in a dorm their first year but it's not mandatory. I did Google what you requested and mostly came up with forums with the usual commentary.

Thanks for doin' the Google.

This is the kind of thing unchecked BS leads to:

Amanda’s numerous sexual liaisons have been an oft-repeated subject by her supporters who claim that her sexually liberated ways were used against her in court. However, multiple indiscriminate sexual relations can also be a sign of mental illness.

While attending University of WA before her trip to Italy, Knox was said to have slept with numerous men as described by a former classmate. “She [Amanda Knox] also developed a deep, abiding desire for casual sex. ‘She was - how can I put it - very friendly, outgoing and bubbly to all men she came into contact with,’ said Philip Setran, a medical student, who shared a dormitory with Amanda. ‘She had what in polite terms you'd call a lot of close male friends.’ Others were more blunt, calling her a ‘man-eater’. ‘

While in Italy, Knox slept with multiple men hours after meeting them. This was reported to have bothered her flatmate Meredith who would be the recipient of affection from these strange men Knox brought into their home. Knox also slept with a man she just met on a train on her way to Perugia. She also had sex with Raffaele the same night that they met and slept with another man while seeing Raffaele. Promiscuous behavior is a characteristic of psychopaths because they often equate sex with love.​

i've always equated sex with sex :p
 
Suggesting what? Meredith leaving and returning? We already know that. And Raffaele's car passing at 11.30 p.m. My limited Italian tells me the expert could form no concluded view on that.

This one is never before seen and shows someone leaving the cottage around 5.30pm.
 

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Ken you don't know what you are talking about. First of all West Seattle isn't around the corner from mom's house no matter how you define it. Secondly she wasn't living in a dorm on 12th N.E. when she threw a good-bye party in the rental house she had lived during that school year.

Don't forget your contention was the both girls had never lived away from home.


As Schopenhauer famously said, the English are the only nation that has a thorough understanding of the immorality of lying. Many here are strangers to truth, but they cannot help it as they lack the moral compass to begin with.

So I guess we have to cut slack, given the devotion to known compulsive liars Amanda and Raff.

Who needs truth, eh, when you can spin it?
 
As Schopenhauer famously said, the English are the only nation that has a thorough understanding of the immorality of lying. Many here are strangers to truth, but they cannot help it as they lack the moral compass to begin with.

So I guess we have to cut slack, given the devotion to known compulsive liars Amanda and Raff.

Who needs truth, eh, when you can spin it?

I believe Schopenhauer also famously said:

All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.

You have a wee bit of catching up to do Vixen.
 
While Vixen is re-thinking the washing machine thing I was ruminating about her take on the bleach receipts which is, AIUI, that Richard Owen's story was true but the prosecution decided not to use the material because that's just the way things work. Prosecutors don't always use everything, she reasoned.

It occurred to me: might the public judges hearing the case alongside Massei also have entertained this ludicrous idea? Might they, too, have reasoned to themselves that there must be a good reason why they were not presented with evidence of a blood-soaked bathroom, bleach receipts and all the other lies spread around by the police and gobbled up by a credulous media? I think they might.

Vixen, it doesn't take a lawyer to understand that the bleach receipts would have been devastating had they ever existed and placed before the court. Here is the resulting testimony to make the point clear:

Mignini: Mr Quintavalle, I am handing you two receipts issued by your store showing that Amanda bought bleach on ..
Dalla Vedova : Excuse me, he is leading the ...
Bongiorno; This is impermissible!
Masseu: Please, please! Silence. Let's not have everyone talking at once. Will the Public Minister re-phrase his question?
Mignini: Mr Quintavalle, what can your say about these receipts?
Quintavalle: they show Amanda bought bleach on ..
Dalla Vedova: objection! The witness cannot say that
Bongiorno: Mama mia, santissima!!
Massei: Silence! The witness will confine his answers to matters within his own knowledge!
Mignini: do you recognise these receipts?
Quintavalle: yes
Mignini: where do they come from?
Quintavalle: my store
Mignini: do they bear dates and times?
Quintavalle: yes
Mignini: what are they?
Quintavalle: 8.30 and 9.15 a.m. on 2nd November 2007
Mignini: do those times suggest anything to you?
Quintavalle: yes, it was at those times that I sold bleach to her (pointing)
Dalla Vedova: objection! He cannot possibly know what time he sold bleach. Where is that in his written deposition?
Mignini: Sacre bleu! Can I proceed without all these interruptions? That was to be my next question, darn it!
Massei: Proceed. Sit down counsellor.
Mignini: how can you be sure of the times? Did you wear a watch?
Quintavalle: as you know, nobody wears a watch in Perugia
Mignini: then?
Quintavalle: when I issued the first receipt the bells of St Michael chimed the half hour and I associated this with her blue eyes. I will never forget that moment.
Mignini: and the second?
Quintavalle: the same - except it was the church of St Anthony ringing the quarter hour
Bongiorno: where is the evidence that church bells sound the quarter hour?
Commodi: We got that base covered, babe. We will prove with incontrovertible evidence that this church was running quarter of an hour late, or possibly early, with its bell-ringing.
Mignini: you keep referring to 'her'. Who do you mean?
Quintavalle: (pointing) she over there - the one with the T-shirt that says 'olla you needa eesa luva'
Mignini: thank you. That will be all except for one last question.
Quintavalle ?
Mignini: why are we conducting this exchange in English?
Quintavalle: ya got me there, bub.

See?

PS, as a person with literary connections, could you let me know whether my reconstruction has any merit, perhaps as a pilot for a dramatisation of the trial? Shoot me a PM if you think I could benefit by talking to your agent.
 
While Vixen is re-thinking the washing machine thing I was ruminating about her take on the bleach receipts which is, AIUI, that Richard Owen's story was true but the prosecution decided not to use the material because that's just the way things work. Prosecutors don't always use everything, she reasoned.

It occurred to me: might the public judges hearing the case alongside Massei also have entertained this ludicrous idea? Might they, too, have reasoned to themselves that there must be a good reason why they were not presented with evidence of a blood-soaked bathroom, bleach receipts and all the other lies spread around by the police and gobbled up by a credulous media? I think they might.

Vixen, it doesn't take a lawyer to understand that the bleach receipts would have been devastating had they ever existed and placed before the court. Here is the resulting testimony to make the point clear:

Mignini: Mr Quintavalle, I am handing you two receipts issued by your store showing that Amanda bought bleach on ..
Dalla Vedova : Excuse me, he is leading the ...
Bongiorno; This is impermissible!
Masseu: Please, please! Silence. Let's not have everyone talking at once. Will the Public Minister re-phrase his question?
Mignini: Mr Quintavalle, what can your say about these receipts?
Quintavalle: they show Amanda bought bleach on ..
Dalla Vedova: objection! The witness cannot say that
Bongiorno: Mama mia, santissima!!
Massei: Silence! The witness will confine his answers to matters within his own knowledge!
Mignini: do you recognise these receipts?
Quintavalle: yes
Mignini: where do they come from?
Quintavalle: my store
Mignini: do they bear dates and times?
Quintavalle: yes
Mignini: what are they?
Quintavalle: 8.30 and 9.15 a.m. on 2nd November 2007
Mignini: do those times suggest anything to you?
Quintavalle: yes, it was at those times that I sold bleach to her (pointing)
Dalla Vedova: objection! He cannot possibly know what time he sold bleach. Where is that in his written deposition?
Mignini: Sacre bleu! Can I proceed without all these interruptions? That was to be my next question, darn it!
Massei: Proceed. Sit down counsellor.
Mignini: how can you be sure of the times? Did you wear a watch?
Quintavalle: as you know, nobody wears a watch in Perugia
Mignini: then?
Quintavalle: when I issued the first receipt the bells of St Michael chimed the half hour and I associated this with her blue eyes. I will never forget that moment.
Mignini: and the second?
Quintavalle: the same - except it was the church of St Anthony ringing the quarter hour
Bongiorno: where is the evidence that church bells sound the quarter hour?
Commodi: We got that base covered, babe. We will prove with incontrovertible evidence that this church was running quarter of an hour late, or possibly early, with its bell-ringing.
Mignini: you keep referring to 'her'. Who do you mean?
Quintavalle: (pointing) she over there - the one with the T-shirt that says 'olla you needa eesa luva'
Mignini: thank you. That will be all except for one last question.
Quintavalle ?
Mignini: why are we conducting this exchange in English?
Quintavalle: ya got me there, bub.

See?

PS, as a person with literary connections, could you let me know whether my reconstruction has any merit, perhaps as a pilot for a dramatisation of the trial? Shoot me a PM if you think I could benefit by talking to your agent.

Yes to your last paragraph except everyone will point out that Mignini only speaks Italian and Mason, not French and Italians ARE allowed to lead witnesses and judges,

You do bring up the double play of Italian judicial practice: Allowing the police to give everything to the press (and more) and allowing the lay judges to freely read, listen and watch the media before and during the trial. Amanda's statements were in the tabs the day or two after arrest.
 
Have a look at this crazy guilters email to Mignini back in December 2009

http://www.amandaknoxcase.com/wp-co...0-Dec-2009-12-Tarek-Sharief-Email-Mignini.pdf

Thanks MB but it was a FAX I think from XXXXXXXXXXXXXX - most likely a brit as they refer to a land registry which we don't call it, at least not here in Seattle.

Can anyone make sense of the FAX number? I'm sure it was a fake but...

MichaelB it would be great to get the Filomena testimony translated. If I missed it, let me know.

Edited by jsfisher: 
Possible telephone number redacted.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
From that email:

"If the three are innocent the judge would have found the three innocent."

Well, how does the email author feel now?

That they are guilty and the ISC was paid off.
 
Yes to your last paragraph except everyone will point out that Mignini only speaks Italian and Mason, not French and Italians ARE allowed to lead witnesses and judges,

You do bring up the double play of Italian judicial practice: Allowing the police to give everything to the press (and more) and allowing the lay judges to freely read, listen and watch the media before and during the trial. Amanda's statements were in the tabs the day or two after arrest.

In fact, I don't think leading questions are allowed. Not in chief anyway. Those extracts of the transcripts I have seen feature objections based on leading. My impression of an Italian cross examination, as exemplified by this case anyway, is one of disorderly chaos and incompetence.
 
In fact, I don't think leading questions are allowed. Not in chief anyway. Those extracts of the transcripts I have seen feature objections based on leading. My impression of an Italian cross examination, as exemplified by this case anyway, is one of disorderly chaos and incompetence.

My goodness I said the leading part in the spirit of your post.

OT - I do like red and black stripes.
 
Have a look at this crazy guilters email to Mignini back in December 2009

http://www.amandaknoxcase.com/wp-co...0-Dec-2009-12-Tarek-Sharief-Email-Mignini.pdf



Enjoyed that letter MB. It is so familiar. I ducked back into this blog to see what was happening and got a good deja vu out of that. I have skimmed briefly some of the disconnected and detached commentary that gets dumped here, and that some feel the need to respond to, which is certainly ok. I suppose.

I have spent time :) in almost every mental institution in southern California, and somewhere in my archives I have hundreds of similar writings that I saved for amusement and potential sharing (personal ID omitted to not violate HIPAA!). This is at the expense of their sad situations. I am very sympathetic with the mentally ill, and I would venture that there is not a person participating in this blog that has not been affected either by family or friends.

On this note I will offer that when interacting with such people you have to realize that you will <not> cause a change in their thinking. You can only listen. For some reason the internet, with its mask of identity, seems to let the off balance bubble to the top, where they are more visible. It seems.
 
While Vixen is re-thinking the washing machine thing I was ruminating about her take on the bleach receipts which is, AIUI, that Richard Owen's story was true but the prosecution decided not to use the material because that's just the way things work. Prosecutors don't always use everything, she reasoned.

It occurred to me: might the public judges hearing the case alongside Massei also have entertained this ludicrous idea? Might they, too, have reasoned to themselves that there must be a good reason why they were not presented with evidence of a blood-soaked bathroom, bleach receipts and all the other lies spread around by the police and gobbled up by a credulous media? I think they might.

Vixen, it doesn't take a lawyer to understand that the bleach receipts would have been devastating had they ever existed and placed before the court. Here is the resulting testimony to make the point clear:

Mignini: Mr Quintavalle, I am handing you two receipts issued by your store showing that Amanda bought bleach on ..
Dalla Vedova : Excuse me, he is leading the ...
Bongiorno; This is impermissible!
Masseu: Please, please! Silence. Let's not have everyone talking at once. Will the Public Minister re-phrase his question?
Mignini: Mr Quintavalle, what can your say about these receipts?
Quintavalle: they show Amanda bought bleach on ..
Dalla Vedova: objection! The witness cannot say that
Bongiorno: Mama mia, santissima!!
Massei: Silence! The witness will confine his answers to matters within his own knowledge!
Mignini: do you recognise these receipts?
Quintavalle: yes
Mignini: where do they come from?
Quintavalle: my store
Mignini: do they bear dates and times?
Quintavalle: yes
Mignini: what are they?
Quintavalle: 8.30 and 9.15 a.m. on 2nd November 2007
Mignini: do those times suggest anything to you?
Quintavalle: yes, it was at those times that I sold bleach to her (pointing)
Dalla Vedova: objection! He cannot possibly know what time he sold bleach. Where is that in his written deposition?
Mignini: Sacre bleu! Can I proceed without all these interruptions? That was to be my next question, darn it!
Massei: Proceed. Sit down counsellor.
Mignini: how can you be sure of the times? Did you wear a watch?
Quintavalle: as you know, nobody wears a watch in Perugia
Mignini: then?
Quintavalle: when I issued the first receipt the bells of St Michael chimed the half hour and I associated this with her blue eyes. I will never forget that moment.
Mignini: and the second?
Quintavalle: the same - except it was the church of St Anthony ringing the quarter hour
Bongiorno: where is the evidence that church bells sound the quarter hour?
Commodi: We got that base covered, babe. We will prove with incontrovertible evidence that this church was running quarter of an hour late, or possibly early, with its bell-ringing.
Mignini: you keep referring to 'her'. Who do you mean?
Quintavalle: (pointing) she over there - the one with the T-shirt that says 'olla you needa eesa luva'
Mignini: thank you. That will be all except for one last question.
Quintavalle ?
Mignini: why are we conducting this exchange in English?
Quintavalle: ya got me there, bub.

See?

PS, as a person with literary connections, could you let me know whether my reconstruction has any merit, perhaps as a pilot for a dramatisation of the trial? Shoot me a PM if you think I could benefit by talking to your agent.



LOL. I had just crawled out into the world, my coffee yet untouched, and in my rapid scan mode I at first thought this was real...! Good one!
 
This too
[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=480&pictureid=10070[/qimg]
musta somehow got "lost in translation",
eh Grinda?

Them Italian Courts,
and you too,
still do not know,
err respect how Rudy spells his 1st name.
It's with a y, not an i...
My 2¢,
:D
RW


By the way,
I, Randy Wright,
like to spell my 1st name with a y:
http://www.lasurfpix.exposuremanager.com/

I hope my English is coherent enough for you
so that you never spell my 1st name with an i,
like you with Rudy.

For if you do,
you might then come across another Wright,
Randi Wright.
She's gnarly + this link is NS4W:
http://www.babesandstars.com/r/randi-wright/



I don't know why some people continue to dis Mr Guede. So after all the arrogance and ineptitude exposed in this case, I find it a sort of tip-o-the-hat to the courts involved to continue that assault on poor RudY. Think how he must feel... I know that Grinder did not always insist on using the Rudi spelling, and being the meticulous soul that he is, there must have been a political epiphany at some point to abandon the spelling preferred by Rudy. Wonder what that precise reason was? Or was that "Grynder"?

:)

Seriously G, you live in precision, it seems. Why did you decide on this change of your spelling of his name?
 
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