Condi Rice: The Right Choice?

[Rob Lister]

I think that they are a couple in name only. If you listened to any of her speeches as highlighted by this last Sunday's political news shows, you know she's already campaigning for the next presidential race. She'll need Bill at least that long, and longer if she also has her sights set on any ambassadorships, or possibly a seat on the Supreme court.

Yes, I have been listening. I think she'll do well. I don't know if she'll win but she could. It just depends on who runs for the Repubs. I honestly can't fathom right now who that's going to be. Some say Jeb but I don't think so. Some say Rudy but...nay.

 

[Kodiak]

Yes, I have been listening. I think she'll do well. I don't know if she'll win but she could. It just depends on who runs for the Repubs. I honestly can't fathom right now who that's going to be. Some say Jeb but I don't think so. Some say Rudy but...nay.

Its early still, but the big three being talked about is Guliani (sp?), McCain, and the topic of this thread, Condi Rice.

 

[aerocontrols]

Its early still, but the big three being talked about is Guliani (sp?), McCain, and the topic of this thread, Condi Rice.

I would like Rice to run, but doesn't she have to run for something else to prove she's electable, first?

She's no Ike, after all.

Nor even a Wilson, who had also never held elected office, but had at least been President of Princeton. Condi has been Provost, not President, of Stanford.

Until she gets a Senate seat or a governorship, I'm afraid I'll have to root for her for the VP spot instead of President.

 

[IllegalArgument]

I would like Rice to run, but doesn't she have to run for something else to prove she's electable, first?

She's no Ike, after all.

Nor even a Wilson, who had also never held elected office, but had at least been President of Princeton. Condi has been Provost, not President, of Stanford.

Until she gets a Senate seat or a governorship, I'm afraid I'll have to root for her for the VP spot instead of President.

The thought of her running has crossed my mind, but everytime I hear her speak in, she sounds nervous to me. Would be a damn interesting election is she did run.

Imagine Hillary v Rice.

 

[Kodiak]

I would like Rice to run, but doesn't she have to run for something else to prove she's electable, first?

Couldn't she spin it into a positive that she isn't a career politician? That she was never a pork barrel spender or a judicial obstructionist. That while congressmen and governor's have been squabbling about taxes and road bills, she has been on the anti-terrorist front line and interacting with foreign nations to protect vital American interests abroad. Yada, yada, yada...

 

[aerocontrols]

Couldn't she spin it into a positive that she isn't a career politician? That she was never a pork barrel spender or a judicial obstructionist. That while congressmen and governor's have been squabbling about taxes and road bills, she has been on the anti-terrorist front line and interacting with foreign nations to protect vital American interests abroad. Yada, yada, yada...

I think it would be a great positive if she could get past the nomination fight. I just don't think someone who's never been elected before is well-positioned to get support from the party base. Unless Bush pushed for her, of course.

It would be nice if it would work out.

 

[Rob Lister]

I think it would be a great positive if she could get past the nomination fight. I just don't think someone who's never been elected before is well-positioned to get support from the party base. Unless Bush pushed for her, of course.

It would be nice if it would work out.

I wouldn't mind it. I'd vote for her in a heartbeat. But, one problem she has is related to her never having been elected to anything: she hasn't been vetted. What skeltons does she have lurking in her closest? Everyone has a few, rather real or real enough to be imagined by a significant proportion of the country. Is she a lesbian? Does it matter if she can be made to look like one? Could she play that (either way) to her favor? Did she once work for Malcom X? Castro? Hitler? ?Bush!? Did she bonk any of the three? Did they wear a raincoat? Does she have a baby that she allowed to be adopted? Does she trade tobacco with space aliens?

ditto above.

 

[Furious]

I wouldn't mind it. I'd vote for her in a heartbeat. But, one problem she has is related to her never having been elected to anything: she hasn't been vetted. What skeltons does she have lurking in her closest? Everyone has a few, rather real or real enough to be imagined by a significant proportion of the country. Is she a lesbian? Does it matter if she can be made to look like one? Could she play that (either way) to her favor? Did she once work for Malcom X? Castro? Hitler? ?Bush!? Did she bonk any of the three? Did they wear a raincoat? Does she have a baby that she allowed to be adopted? Does she trade tobacco with space aliens?

ditto above.

No chance in hell she'll get nominated.

To much Bush administration baggage, too many minorities in one package for Republican tastes, no previous elected experience and not enough of a Jesus freak.

I think I offered to wager someone else in a previous thread, and I'm willing to again.

 

[clk]

The Republican party nominating a black woman as President? HA! That's the funniest thing I have heard all day.

 

[Rob Lister]

The Republican party nominating a black woman as President? HA! That's the funniest thing I have heard all day.

Take a poll of the republicans/conservatives on this board by asking that very question. Then tell me how funny you find the results. Especially if she were running against Hillary.

 

[clk]

Take a poll of the republicans/conservatives on this board by asking that very question. Then tell me how funny you find the results. Especially if she were running against Hillary.

Yeah, but the thing is, the Republican posters on this board are not exactly in the same demographic as Southern Republicans in states like Alabama and South Carolina, now are they?

I don't have to speculate to prove my point. Let's take a look at the numbers, because numbers don't lie:
Blacks make up around 14 percent of the general US population.

Republicans hold around 288 seats of Congress. Therefore, you would expect there to be about 40 black Republican congressmen. Actually, there are zero black Republican congressmen.
So the percentage of black Republican congressmen is: 0%

Comparatively, Democrats hold around 250 seats of Congress. You would expect there to be about 35 black Democratic congressmen. Actually, there are 43 black Democratic congressmen. This means that the percentage of black Democratic congressmen is: 17%

So let me ask you a really simple question: If Republicans have a hard time getting just one single black person elected to either the House or Senate, then what makes you think they will vote a black woman to the Presidency? The only way Republicans can get a black person to a position of power is if the President appoints the person to the Cabinet.
I just don't think the hardcore Republican constituency would vote very many blacks in as a Senator or congressman (very few have been elected in the past). So frankly, I don't care how the Republicans on this board vote. The entire Republican constituency voted in 2004 and 2002, and they did not elect any blacks to office.


Source: http://www.senate.gov/reference/resources/pdf/RS22007.pdf

 

[Rob Lister]

Yeah, but the thing is, the Republican posters on this board are not exactly in the same demographic as Southern Republicans in states like Alabama and South Carolina, now are they?

I don't have to speculate to prove my point. Let's take a look at the numbers, because numbers don't lie:
Blacks make up around 14 percent of the general US population.

Republicans hold around 288 seats of Congress. Therefore, you would expect there to be about 40 black Republican congressmen. Actually, there are zero black Republican congressmen.
So the percentage of black Republican congressmen is: 0%

Comparatively, Democrats hold around 250 seats of Congress. You would expect there to be about 35 black Democratic congressmen. Actually, there are 43 black Democratic congressmen. This means that the percentage of black Democratic congressmen is: 17%

So let me ask you a really simple question: If Republicans have a hard time getting just one single black person elected to either the House or Senate, then what makes you think they will vote a black woman to the Presidency? The only way Republicans can get a black person to a position of power is if the President appoints the person to the Cabinet.
I just don't think the hardcore Republican constituency would vote very many blacks in as a Senator or congressman (very few have been elected in the past). So frankly, I don't care how the Republicans on this board vote. The entire Republican constituency voted in 2004 and 2002, and they did not elect any blacks to office.


Source: http://www.senate.gov/reference/resources/pdf/RS22007.pdf

How many blacks run for republican seats? That's where you're skewing your numbers. If no blacks run, no blacks are elected. Dems think it is about color. It's not. It's about culture. If you don't understand that then a brief visual aid would be for you to compare Al Sharpton with Colin Powell. Jessie Jackson with Condi Rice.

If you think the numbers here, on this board, are not representative, then run a poll on Free Republic or Free Conservatives and see how your numbers pan out. She wouldn't win the nomination in a landslide but if she won the nomination she would not only have the overwhelming support of republicans and moderates but a good percentage of the typically democrat black vote to boot. She might lose a portion of the dixiecrat vote but she'd make it up easily with the black vote. She'd spank the likes of Hillary, and she'd do it without ever playing the race card. The video would sell a hundred-million copies, btw.

 

[Tmy]

Yeah, but the thing is, the Republican posters on this board are not exactly in the same demographic as Southern Republicans in states like Alabama and South Carolina, now are they?

I

No way. Geez, if she was gay shed hit the far right freak out trifecta!

Those people viciously hate Hillary just cause shes a girl. A GIRL IN GOVERNMENT! What a topsy turvey world we live in!

 

[Tmy]

She might lose a portion of the dixiecrat vote but she'd make it up easily with the black vote.

I disagree. Methinks the blacks dont really take kindly to black republicans. For mant its seen as uncle-tomism. (new word alert!)

Shed do better if she jumpped to the dems and brought some repub votes with her.

What are her views on abortion anyway???

 

[clk]

How many blacks run for republican seats? That's where you're skewing your numbers. If no blacks run, no blacks are elected. Dems think it is about color. It's not. It's about culture.

Why do you think that very few blacks run as Republicans? Why do you think that there aren't very many black Republicans in the first place? Why do blacks prefer the Democrats instead of the Republicans? Hint: It might have something to do with people like Strom Thurmond.

And no, I did not skew my numbers. Actually, I was very generous to the Republican party. I did not take into account the fact that over 50% of blacks live in the South, which is generally Republican, while only 18% live in the Northeast, which is generally Democratic. That means that blacks make up more than 14% of the population in Southern Republican states. If you take that into account, the numbers look even worse for the Republicans and even better for the Democrats. So like I said, I was quite generous.

If you think the numbers here, on this board, are not representative, then run a poll on Free Republic or Free Conservatives and see how your numbers pan out.

No, I think that the entire Republican population of the United States of America is representative enough for me, thank you.

She wouldn't win the nomination in a landslide but if she won the nomination she would not only have the overwhelming support of republicans and moderates but a good percentage of the typically democrat black vote to boot.

What if a white Republican ran against her in the primaries? Are you honestly trying to say that she would have a chance against him in states like South Carolina? Remember, Bush won S.C. in 2000 partly because he spread racist rumors about McCain.

 

[Rob Lister]

Why do you think that very few blacks run as Republicans? Why do you think that there aren't very many black Republicans in the first place? Why do blacks prefer the Democrats instead of the Republicans? Hint: It might have something to do with people like Strom Thurmond.

And no, I did not skew my numbers. Actually, I was very generous to the Republican party. I did not take into account the fact that over 50% of blacks live in the South, which is generally Republican, while only 18% live in the Northeast, which is generally Democratic. That means that blacks make up more than 14% of the population in Southern Republican states. If you take that into account, the numbers look even worse for the Republicans and even better for the Democrats. So like I said, I was quite generous.



No, I think that the entire Republican population of the United States of America is representative enough for me, thank you.

[/b]

What if a white Republican ran against her in the primaries? Are you honestly trying to say that she would have a chance against him in states like South Carolina? Remember, Bush won S.C. in 2000 partly because he spread racist rumors about McCain. [/B]

Para 1: Because of a combination of districting and a lack of black republicans in general. The Democrats have been very effective in conveying the message that you seem to believe: republicans are racist. They aren't, IMO. They're culturalist. Please compare Thurmond with Byrd to see the silliness of your example.

Para 2: ibid.

Para 3: Then nothing but an actual vote would convince you? Polls count for nothing? Fine by me. But if true, your opinion counts even less than mine since I will likely be voting in the republican primary and you likely will not.

Para 4: If a white republican ran against her in the primary? Just how many blacks do you think will be in the republican primary? But to answer, the answer is obviously yes, she could win. Maybe not in '08 because she doesn't yet have the election track-record. She might have to pull a Hillary and run for (and most assurdedly win) a senate seat first. Then she'd be a shoe-in.

Note to add: she claims she has no plans to run for anything. In this case, and only this case, I hope she is lying. OR at least changes her mind.

 

[Tmy]

I think you are underestimating the amout of racism out there. And its not that the dems are torpedoing the repubs, its the repubs that fail to woo the blacks. And other minorities too.
What'd Bush pull in? 11% back vote? Thats terrible. And I bet you those 11% were mostly rich blacks who overlook the racism in exchange for tax breaks.



take the rebub convention. It was kinda a hoot how the cameras would scour the crowd to find black faces to show. Things really have changed much with the GOP. In fact the far righties in control are chaseing blacks away!

 

[clk]

Para 1: Because of a combination of districting and a lack of black republicans in general. The Democrats have been very effective in conveying the message that you seem to believe: republicans are racist. They aren't, IMO. They're culturalist. Please compare Thurmond with Byrd to see the silliness of your example.

So the evil Democrats convinced the blacks that Republicans are evil? Are you sure that is why there are so few black Republicans? I guess that is why there aren't many gay Republicans: the evil Democrats tricked them into thinking that Republicans are all homophobic.

Para 3: Then nothing but an actual vote would convince you? Polls count for nothing?

The Republicans voted in 2004 and 2002, and they did not elect one single black person to Congress. That speaks for itself.

Para 4: If a white republican ran against her in the primary? Just how many blacks do you think will be in the republican primary? But to answer, the answer is obviously yes, she could win. Maybe not in '08 because she doesn't yet have the election track-record. She might have to pull a Hillary and run for (and most assurdedly win) a senate seat first. Then she'd be a shoe-in.

Note to add: she claims she has no plans to run for anything. In this case, and only this case, I hope she is lying. OR at least changes her mind.

There is no way in hell that the hardcore right wingers will vote for Condi over just about any semi-viable white candidate. Again: they don't even vote in black congressmen, why would they vote for Condi over some Cowboy like Jeb Bush?

 

[Tmy]

ya gotta understand that racism is a deal breaker for most blacks. Sort of like abortion being a deabreaker for really religious people.

Blacks are extremely sensitive to racism red flags. For example the VP debate. When it came out that Cheney voted against the MLK holiday AND the Mandella resolution it made rich white old guy Cheney look racist. And when he had NO comback or excuse, it mad him REALLY look racist.

 

[Rob Lister]

So the evil Democrats convinced the blacks that Republicans are evil? Are you sure that is why there are so few black Republicans? I guess that is why there aren't many gay Republicans: the evil Democrats tricked them into thinking that Republicans are all homophobic.


[/b]

The Republicans voted in 2004 and 2002, and they did not elect one single black person to Congress. That speaks for itself.



There is no way in hell that the hardcore right wingers will vote for Condi over just about any semi-viable white candidate. Again: they don't even vote in black congressmen, why would they vote for Condi over some Cowboy like Jeb Bush? [/B]

Para 1: Yes, pretty much. And they've done it effectively. If you want to compare gays and blacks you're going to have a bit of difficulty with blacks going along with your comparision. Personally, I don't much care. I hope that becomes a greater democrat stratagy.

Para 2: How many blacks ran for congress on a republican ticket? Until you answer that your statistics are meaningless.

Para 3: You're mistaken. It is precisely the 'hard-core' republicans that would vote for Rice. It's the dixiecrats she'd have a problem with. These are reg. democrats from the south that always vote democrat locally and usually vote republican nationally.